Quicken Community is moving to Single Sign On! Starting 1/22/21, you'll sign in to the community with your Quicken ID. For more information: http://bit.ly/CommunitySSO

Restricted Stock Units (RSUs)

Unknown
Unknown Member
edited June 2019 in Investing (Windows)
I'm trying to figure out how to record Restricted Stock Units (RSUs) into Quicken.  An RSU award is an agreement to issue stock at the time the award vests.  No shares are delivered until the employee satisfies the vesting schedule.  At that time, taxes are netted out of the units, with employees receiving company stock equal to the net after-tax value of the RSU.It's similar to a stock option, but instead of having an option to buy, shares are awarded automatically on the vesting date, with taxes on the awarded shares accruing at that time.Is there a way to record these in Quicken?  I've tried putting them in as an ESOG, but it's awkward and creates some weird accounting issues.

Comments

  • Unknown
    Unknown Member
    edited June 2019
    If my understanding is correct, you have nothing until it vests. So don't enter anything until it vests.
  • Unknown
    Unknown Member
    edited July 2016
    I have the same question - have you tried treating them as options with a 1 penny exercise price?  I guess you will still have to deduct the taxable portion at the time of vesting.
  • Unknown
    Unknown Member
    edited July 2016
    Hi folks - I too am trying to enter my company's restricted stock unit grants into Quicken like stock options.  But it registers the full value today, rather than future value in 3 years.  Does Quicken 2006 have this function incorporated?thanks
  • Unknown
    Unknown Member
    edited July 2016
    I am having the same issue.  What I think will work is the following:1. Create a new account for your RSUs.2. Add the RSUs on the date they will vest.  They will not appear in your portfolio until that day.3. Sell the RSUs after they vest on the day it vests at the vesting price.4. Transfer the funds as income into your Stock account, and repurchase the stock at the appropriate price.  You will need to treat this as actual immediate income for tax purposes.As best I can tell, there is no other way to do this unless the newest version of Quicken has this built in.Good luck.
  • Unknown
    Unknown Member
    edited July 2016
    Seems rather cumbersome.   I figure the best bet is to enter when they vest, the full quantity, sell the shares needed to withhold taxes, then expense the taxes from the account.  I'll let you know how it works in about 3 months.
  • Unknown
    Unknown Member
    edited July 2016
    Also looking for a restricted stock solution.  In my case, the restricted award is mine the day it's awarded with dividends payable directly to me.  I can't touch the shares until it's vested at 3 years but the dividends are paid during the vesting period.
  • Unknown
    Unknown Member
    edited July 2016
    I tried a slight variation of your method and, although a bit cumbersome, it creates the desired tax results.   On the vesting date, I entered a cash deposit into the brokerage account equal to the FMV of the net restricted shares left after the broker sold sufficient shares to cover payroll withholding taxes.  I split the entries with a deposit equal to the FMV of the total restricted shares (categorized as ordinary compensation income from the employer), and then negative tax withholding entries for the various taxes withheld from the proceeds of the shares that the broker sold. The net deposit thus equaled the value of the shares I was left with.  I then did a purchase of those shares on the vesting date at FMV, which used up the net deposit from the first entry.
  • Unknown
    Unknown Member
    edited July 2016
    I too am interested in a method to record these transactions in Quicken and that properly accounts for accounting/tax/tracking consequences... and one that would also allow (if chosen) the optional 83(b) election... which if made with the IRS within 30 days of the grant allows one to pay taxes on the value of the stock at grant, which will start your capital-gains holding period for later resales.  (if shares never vest because you leave you cannot recover any taxes paid with this election).  So you pay taxes on the grant up front as ordinary income, and your cap-gains period starts right away.  Then when you sell you pay cap gains on the difference.Not sure why Quicken does not already have this... also not sure why there isn't a manual way to do regular stock option grants instead of "the wizard" which locks you into percentages instead of letting you set the number of shares per vesting period.
  • Unknown
    Unknown Member
    edited July 2016
    OK, got my first paperwork.. did it this way.. seemed to transact OK.. will still need to validate at tax time..
  • Unknown
    Unknown Member
    edited July 2016
    Sorry.. this way..Seems rather cumbersome. I figure the best bet is to enter when they vest, the full quantity, sell the shares needed to withhold taxes, then expense the taxes from the account. I'll let you know how it works in about 3 months.
  • Unknown
    Unknown Member
    edited July 2016
    It's a really really bad idea to not track these things until they vest.  You say they have zero value, but in truth they're similar to bonds.  Some pay dividends before vesting.  Some pay their dividends at vesting.  Do you not record your bonds just because you have nothing until maturity?  Of course not!  If you own 1000 shares of a stock right before the IPO, do you not record that you own that?  We don't just use Quicken to give us a net worth number and pat ourselves on the back.  We use Quicken to keep our finances organized so we have a clear picture of what we have and what we will have.Quicken needs to add this functionality.
  • Unknown
    Unknown Member
    edited June 2019
    > It's a really really bad idea to not track these> things until they vest.  You say they have zero> value, but in truth they're similar to bonds.

    They're TOTALLY dissimilar to bonds. RSU's are a promise that IF, on some future date, you're still employed by the company you'll received something that, until that time, has an unknown value.  If you get hit by a bus, receive a better offer by a competitor, the company goes bust or (various other circumstances) the value of RSU's is zero.

    It's true that bond-issuers can go bust also ... but at least, in that case, you'd have a legally supportable claim to assets of the issuer.  In many cases, federal state or local government bonds, your bonds are backed by the "power to tax" of the issuing government.

    Your RSUs are backed by a promise ... and one that's contingent upon your future actions at that.  If I say, here and now, that I'm going to give you $1 million in my will, are you going to record that in Q???db

    --Edited by dbAnalyst at 11/21/2006 9:22 AM
  • Unknown
    Unknown Member
    edited July 2016
    While I'd say they might be "totally" dissimilar to bonds, the fact is, many of them DO produce income BEFORE the vest date!  In many (all???) cases, the dividend on the shares IS payable (permanently) to the RSU holder from the grant date forward...in order to track these event in way that "traces" the income back to the original source, therefore allowing you to calculate a total ROI (not to mention the tax implications), it would be most helpful to find a way to get these into Quicken somehow!To me, the real solution is in the programmers hands...
  • Unknown
    Unknown Member
    edited July 2016
    Y'all working way to hard on this...RSU's have value... they're a conditional right / asset & should be tracked.Dividends may or may not accrue in your name, but they probably aren't yours until the conditions to award the stock are met. Our company does not give use the dividends over the 5 years it takes to earn all of the RSUs in one grant.From a Quicken point of view, RSUs are securities, held in a brokerage account. Let's say you work for GM, got 250 RSUs granted on the first day of the year, every year, starting next year.** Create a brokerage account called "GM RSU"** Enter a "buy" transaction for 50 GM shares for each day you'll get a grant. Leave all the $ fields blank.  You have no idea what the price will be (they're RSUs, not options). I like a note in the memo field to remind me which RSU grant this transaction goes with ("2007Bonus 2/5" for the second of five grants of the 2007 Bonus)** When the paperwork shows up for each grant, enter the real number of shares (our company automatically sells some  of the shares to cover estimated income tax) and the real price (and any fees). Your company may be different, but for ours, the stock sold for taxes is never in our name so I don't track it. If it were in my name from an IRS point of view - say, for a day it was my stock - then I'd "buy" the full shares and enter a new transaction to sell the fractional shares for taxes and ledger-entry that amount out using category "Fed Witholding".** Enter any necessary transactions you might need to disposition the shares (transfer to your Fidelity account, sell, etc.). If you leave them in the RSU account (advised for fractional shares) then no extra transaction is necessary.
  • Unknown
    Unknown Member
    edited July 2016
    Quote:" Re: Restricted Stock Units (RSUs): Y'all working way to hard on this...RSU's have value... they're a conditional right / asset..."]You're missing the point - we should be trying to fool Quicken into thinking RSU's are normal shares.  Neither should we be pretending taxes and dividends don't exist.  There should be an investment type called RSU that allows for the nuances of this compensation vehicle.  ]Your solution doesn't work.  In some cases, the dividends are payable in cash immediately, not after the RSU's vest.  In those cases, taxes are not necessarily withheld from the payment.  How would you then track the RSU's performance if you decouple the dividend from the security?  ]Also, your solution impacts net worth retroactively from day 1.  This is no good because RSU's really have $0 value until they vest (with the dividend exception above).  Granted, this isn't huge, but I use Quicken to track my money.  If I wanted to jerry-rig a system, I'd use Excel.  ]Third, I think you're being a little simplistic regarding the taxes.  Stock sold for taxes is not necessarily at the rate you end up owing taxes at the end of the year.  If you try to import that into TurboTax, you'll get screwed, because you'll have no way to track in Quicken how much you actually paid in taxes already.
  • Unknown
    Unknown Member
    edited July 2016
    Quote:" Re: Restricted Stock Units (RSUs): You're missing the point - we should be trying to fool Quicken into thinking RSU's..."Agree with Sherri- my company, NuStar Energy LP issues RSU's for units as we are master limited partnership- employees receive units vs. stock options.  We receive units that have  Distribution Equivalent Rights (DER) per IRS Code 409A.  You have GOT to track these corectly.  If we rcv 100 units on year one, our DER's earn distributions (dividends) that are paid in hard cash to us- no reinvestment provision- maybe that's an accounting blessing?  We get to cash in on the RSU's for that year over 5 years, or 1/5th of the RSU award each year. Perhaps just enter them as stock options and just treat the DER distribution as dividend income?
This discussion has been closed.