FAQ: Unlink 401(k) cash account after conversion to Quicken?

Tony SayeTony Saye Member
edited December 2018 in FAQs
I've read the various posts regarding the 401(k) Money to Quicken conversion issues (Money Plus to Quicken 2010 for me). I too would like to "unlink" the 401(k) cash account. Problem is, I had already invested a lot of time cleaning up my Quicken file post-conversion -- before I read the pre-conversion solution of setting the account from retirement to investment, etc. I've also read that R3 should offer a fix to the converter. So my questions:

Will R3 also allow me to unlink the 401(k) cash account (and merge those transactions into the main 401(k) account a la my investment accounts) that I have already converted?

If not, if I reconvert my Money file using the pre-conversion retirement>investment tip, would I be able to "merge" or "replace" just the newly converted 401(k) account into my existing Quicken file?

If not, are there any other post-conversion solutions or workarounds?

I have spent a fair amount of time cleaning up my post-conversion Quicken file. But I have to say that given the complexity of conversion, I am very pleased with the results.

Comments

  • Quicken DanGQuicken DanG Member
    edited August 2016
    Hi tosa -

    Changing Quicken to allow unlinking 401k/IRA cash accounts is not in scope for R3. Quicken UI does not allow linking them in the first place, so it was a Money Converter bug that caused them to be linked. I have fixed the Money Converter to no longer link the accounts.

    The Money Converter is not built to support incremental conversions. It converts all data in the Money file, and requires a new Quicken file. So no, you won't be able to merge or replace existing accounts.

    I don't see any post-conversion workarounds, but perhaps someone in the Live Community can find one.

    The best I can offer you is to convert again using the R3 patch coming out in a couple weeks. I know this is less than ideal for your situation, but changing Quicken to account for a Money Converter bug is lower priority than many of the other issues and work items the team is facing.

    Dan
  • Tony SayeTony Saye Member
    edited July 2016

    Hi tosa -

    Changing Quicken to allow unlinking 401k/IRA cash accounts is not in scope for R3. Quicken UI does not allow linking them in the first place, so it was a Money Converter bug that caused them to be linked. I have fixed the Money Converter to no longer link the accounts.

    The Money Converter is not built to support incremental conversions. It converts all data in the Money file, and requires a new Quicken file. So no, you won't be able to merge or replace existing accounts.

    I don't see any post-conversion workarounds, but perhaps someone in the Live Community can find one.

    The best I can offer you is to convert again using the R3 patch coming out in a couple weeks. I know this is less than ideal for your situation, but changing Quicken to account for a Money Converter bug is lower priority than many of the other issues and work items the team is facing.

    Dan

    Dan,

    I hope you can appreciate that is a less than satisfying answer. However, I DO appreciate you taking the time to answer. At least at this point I more clearly understand what my options are, even if I'm not so happy about it. I will be trying the R3 converter when it's available and I'll see where that puts me relative to where I'm at now. Now I can't wait for R3 :) since the longer I go, the more delta I'll have between my now stagnant Money file and now active Quicken file.

    Again, thanks for taking the time, not just to answer my question, but the others in this forum as well. It has been very helpful!
  • neil154neil154 Member
    edited August 2016

    Hi tosa -

    Changing Quicken to allow unlinking 401k/IRA cash accounts is not in scope for R3. Quicken UI does not allow linking them in the first place, so it was a Money Converter bug that caused them to be linked. I have fixed the Money Converter to no longer link the accounts.

    The Money Converter is not built to support incremental conversions. It converts all data in the Money file, and requires a new Quicken file. So no, you won't be able to merge or replace existing accounts.

    I don't see any post-conversion workarounds, but perhaps someone in the Live Community can find one.

    The best I can offer you is to convert again using the R3 patch coming out in a couple weeks. I know this is less than ideal for your situation, but changing Quicken to account for a Money Converter bug is lower priority than many of the other issues and work items the team is facing.

    Dan

    DanG - are you saying that R3 will not link the IRA cash account and the IRA investment account and therefore I would only have 1 IRA investment account with a cash balance showing?
  • DaveUDaveU Member
    edited July 2016

    Hi tosa -

    Changing Quicken to allow unlinking 401k/IRA cash accounts is not in scope for R3. Quicken UI does not allow linking them in the first place, so it was a Money Converter bug that caused them to be linked. I have fixed the Money Converter to no longer link the accounts.

    The Money Converter is not built to support incremental conversions. It converts all data in the Money file, and requires a new Quicken file. So no, you won't be able to merge or replace existing accounts.

    I don't see any post-conversion workarounds, but perhaps someone in the Live Community can find one.

    The best I can offer you is to convert again using the R3 patch coming out in a couple weeks. I know this is less than ideal for your situation, but changing Quicken to account for a Money Converter bug is lower priority than many of the other issues and work items the team is facing.

    Dan

    Dan G,

    I also share the same issue with tosa.  I have put countless hours fixing my Quicken file post conversion from Money so I want to avoid another conversion just to unlink the cash portion of my retirement investment accounts.  

    I was hoping that I could convert a temporary copy of my Money file to Quicken 2010 after changing the retirement investment accounts to an account type of "investment" rather than retirement and then use the export / import function to just bring over the account transactions from my temporary Quicken file to my primary Quicken file - makes sense?

    Unfortunately, since the .QIF file is no longer supported for import / export, I have not found a solution to this problem.   

    Any ideas?  Thank you.
  • q_lurkerq_lurker SuperUser ✭✭✭✭
    edited May 2018
    DaveU:  You should review this post to see if it would help with your QIF file usage:
    https://qlc.intuit.com/post/show_post_full_view/dQMNaWtX4r3OK1acfArQA8?
    aka: How to Import QIF Files to Non-cash Accounts, post Q2004
  • DaveUDaveU Member
    edited July 2016
    q.lurker said:

    DaveU:  You should review this post to see if it would help with your QIF file usage:
    https://qlc.intuit.com/post/show_post_full_view/dQMNaWtX4r3OK1acfArQA8?
    aka: How to Import QIF Files to Non-cash Accounts, post Q2004

    q.lurker,

    I tried.  Unfortunately, QIF import no longer works with Quicken 2010 for investment accounts.  Do you know of another way to import transaction data into Quicken 2010?

    Thanks.
  • q_lurkerq_lurker SuperUser ✭✭✭✭
    edited December 2016
    q.lurker said:

    DaveU:  You should review this post to see if it would help with your QIF file usage:
    https://qlc.intuit.com/post/show_post_full_view/dQMNaWtX4r3OK1acfArQA8?
    aka: How to Import QIF Files to Non-cash Accounts, post Q2004

    DaveU wrote:  "I tried. Unfortunately, QIF import no longer works with Quicken 2010 for investment accounts."

    That is really strange, since I have recommended that post to other QW2010 users and they indicated it solved their problem.  I believe that post does apply to QW2010 and investment accounts.
  • DaveUDaveU Member
    edited July 2016
    q.lurker said:

    DaveU:  You should review this post to see if it would help with your QIF file usage:
    https://qlc.intuit.com/post/show_post_full_view/dQMNaWtX4r3OK1acfArQA8?
    aka: How to Import QIF Files to Non-cash Accounts, post Q2004

    Issue solved!.  When you try to import a QIF file in QW2010 the dialog box states that investment accounts are not supported and the list of accounts displayed that you can import into does not list any investment accounts.   However, if I ignore this text and import into "All Accounts" the import works!

    Thank you q.lurker for prompting me to go back and try something new!!
  • Quicken DanGQuicken DanG Member
    edited August 2016
    Good news! For R4, we have invested the time to address this scenario.

    Once you receive the R4 patch (currently scheduled for mid-January), you will be to unlink (combine) and link (separate) your IRA and 401(k) accounts that came from Money. The Show cash in checking account option has been special-cased to become visible for IRA and 401k accounts converted from Money.

    So for those of you who converted with the R2 Money Converter, you're currently stuck with the accounts linked and no way to unlink them. After R4, you'll be able to unlink them which will combine the accounts and create a cash balance in your investment account.

    For those of you who converted with the R3 Money Converter, you're currently stuck with the cash account and the IRA/401k accounts converted, but not linked. After R4, you'll be able to go to File > File Operations > Validate, which will go back and link these accounts under the covers. You can then keep them linked, or you can unlink them like above if you like. The Validate step is necessary because there's no way for you, the user, to link the two existing accounts. Please be sure to run Validate before attempting to link/unlink any of your Money IRA/401k accounts.

    Dan
  • Tony SayeTony Saye Member
    edited July 2016

    Good news! For R4, we have invested the time to address this scenario.

    Once you receive the R4 patch (currently scheduled for mid-January), you will be to unlink (combine) and link (separate) your IRA and 401(k) accounts that came from Money. The Show cash in checking account option has been special-cased to become visible for IRA and 401k accounts converted from Money.

    So for those of you who converted with the R2 Money Converter, you're currently stuck with the accounts linked and no way to unlink them. After R4, you'll be able to unlink them which will combine the accounts and create a cash balance in your investment account.

    For those of you who converted with the R3 Money Converter, you're currently stuck with the cash account and the IRA/401k accounts converted, but not linked. After R4, you'll be able to go to File > File Operations > Validate, which will go back and link these accounts under the covers. You can then keep them linked, or you can unlink them like above if you like. The Validate step is necessary because there's no way for you, the user, to link the two existing accounts. Please be sure to run Validate before attempting to link/unlink any of your Money IRA/401k accounts.

    Dan

    Dan,

    Again, thanks for taking the time and hearing our input. I know not every request can be accommodated, so this is indeed good news. Thanks also for posting an update here!!
  • fx45guyfx45guy Member
    edited July 2016

    Good news! For R4, we have invested the time to address this scenario.

    Once you receive the R4 patch (currently scheduled for mid-January), you will be to unlink (combine) and link (separate) your IRA and 401(k) accounts that came from Money. The Show cash in checking account option has been special-cased to become visible for IRA and 401k accounts converted from Money.

    So for those of you who converted with the R2 Money Converter, you're currently stuck with the accounts linked and no way to unlink them. After R4, you'll be able to unlink them which will combine the accounts and create a cash balance in your investment account.

    For those of you who converted with the R3 Money Converter, you're currently stuck with the cash account and the IRA/401k accounts converted, but not linked. After R4, you'll be able to go to File > File Operations > Validate, which will go back and link these accounts under the covers. You can then keep them linked, or you can unlink them like above if you like. The Validate step is necessary because there's no way for you, the user, to link the two existing accounts. Please be sure to run Validate before attempting to link/unlink any of your Money IRA/401k accounts.

    Dan

    Hi, I have a question...

    My MS Money just expired and I have lots of 401k Accounts with the linked cash accounts.  

    Where can I read up more on how Quicken 2010 actually handles the 401k accounts versus Money?  

    I just installed and did the conversion today but haven't entered any new data yet.  Is there a post someplace that desribes things that I should do in Money to prepare for the conversion before I actually do it?  

    Am I better off using Money still without my updates for the next month and waiting for R4 to come out?  Thanks.
  • AlanGAlanG Member
    edited July 2016

    Good news! For R4, we have invested the time to address this scenario.

    Once you receive the R4 patch (currently scheduled for mid-January), you will be to unlink (combine) and link (separate) your IRA and 401(k) accounts that came from Money. The Show cash in checking account option has been special-cased to become visible for IRA and 401k accounts converted from Money.

    So for those of you who converted with the R2 Money Converter, you're currently stuck with the accounts linked and no way to unlink them. After R4, you'll be able to unlink them which will combine the accounts and create a cash balance in your investment account.

    For those of you who converted with the R3 Money Converter, you're currently stuck with the cash account and the IRA/401k accounts converted, but not linked. After R4, you'll be able to go to File > File Operations > Validate, which will go back and link these accounts under the covers. You can then keep them linked, or you can unlink them like above if you like. The Validate step is necessary because there's no way for you, the user, to link the two existing accounts. Please be sure to run Validate before attempting to link/unlink any of your Money IRA/401k accounts.

    Dan

    Dan,

    I followed your R4 instructions for two IRA accounts that were converted from MS Money with Quicken 2010 R3.  The validate linked the cash accounts and then I was able to unlink them to put the cash transactions into the IRA investment account.

    Thanks
  • edited July 2016

    Good news! For R4, we have invested the time to address this scenario.

    Once you receive the R4 patch (currently scheduled for mid-January), you will be to unlink (combine) and link (separate) your IRA and 401(k) accounts that came from Money. The Show cash in checking account option has been special-cased to become visible for IRA and 401k accounts converted from Money.

    So for those of you who converted with the R2 Money Converter, you're currently stuck with the accounts linked and no way to unlink them. After R4, you'll be able to unlink them which will combine the accounts and create a cash balance in your investment account.

    For those of you who converted with the R3 Money Converter, you're currently stuck with the cash account and the IRA/401k accounts converted, but not linked. After R4, you'll be able to go to File > File Operations > Validate, which will go back and link these accounts under the covers. You can then keep them linked, or you can unlink them like above if you like. The Validate step is necessary because there's no way for you, the user, to link the two existing accounts. Please be sure to run Validate before attempting to link/unlink any of your Money IRA/401k accounts.

    Dan

    Where do I go to download the new R4 update?  I can't figure out where in the Quickewn site to find this.
  • Krowten-DogKrowten-Dog Member
    edited July 2016

    Good news! For R4, we have invested the time to address this scenario.

    Once you receive the R4 patch (currently scheduled for mid-January), you will be to unlink (combine) and link (separate) your IRA and 401(k) accounts that came from Money. The Show cash in checking account option has been special-cased to become visible for IRA and 401k accounts converted from Money.

    So for those of you who converted with the R2 Money Converter, you're currently stuck with the accounts linked and no way to unlink them. After R4, you'll be able to unlink them which will combine the accounts and create a cash balance in your investment account.

    For those of you who converted with the R3 Money Converter, you're currently stuck with the cash account and the IRA/401k accounts converted, but not linked. After R4, you'll be able to go to File > File Operations > Validate, which will go back and link these accounts under the covers. You can then keep them linked, or you can unlink them like above if you like. The Validate step is necessary because there's no way for you, the user, to link the two existing accounts. Please be sure to run Validate before attempting to link/unlink any of your Money IRA/401k accounts.

    Dan

    Unrelated but related ... I think.

    Bottom line: can we get the ability to check/uncheck "Show in a checking account" for 401k?

    Background (taken from thread with Customer Service:100126-003253):

    Reconverting would not solve the problem…

    The 401k was never linked … I converted from money before you could uncheck “show cash in a checking account.” Letâ€TMs call the resultant accounts “401k-a" and "401k-a-cash" this account came in with a linked checking account.

    I then recreated by hand-copy all of the transactions in 401k-a to a new account “401k-b”.

    401k-b was now a brand-new unlinked account that duplicated 401k-a. I then deleted 401k-a, this process resulted in the deletion of 401k-aâ€TMs linked checking account 401k-a-cash.

    Now some months later 401k-b is now showing as linked to my years-old daily checking account, an account that predates the 401k by 3+ years. And has never had any association with the 401k-b excepting a paycheck reminder/transfer.

    I would gladly do the hand-copy method again to rectify this problem … the problem is that deleting 401k-b after recreating all the transactions in 401k-c, my checking account holding significantly more unrelated data, will also be deleted. This checking account also has ~35 recurring reminders associated with it.

    All of this complicates things and makes a reconversion an unrelated issue, as you can clearly see this problem is not related to the initial conversion.

    The question is can DanG put this functionally to unlink (like what is now available for IRAs) into 401k accounts in a future version so I can unlink this erroneously linked account?
  • EngineerEngineer Member
    edited July 2016

    Good news! For R4, we have invested the time to address this scenario.

    Once you receive the R4 patch (currently scheduled for mid-January), you will be to unlink (combine) and link (separate) your IRA and 401(k) accounts that came from Money. The Show cash in checking account option has been special-cased to become visible for IRA and 401k accounts converted from Money.

    So for those of you who converted with the R2 Money Converter, you're currently stuck with the accounts linked and no way to unlink them. After R4, you'll be able to unlink them which will combine the accounts and create a cash balance in your investment account.

    For those of you who converted with the R3 Money Converter, you're currently stuck with the cash account and the IRA/401k accounts converted, but not linked. After R4, you'll be able to go to File > File Operations > Validate, which will go back and link these accounts under the covers. You can then keep them linked, or you can unlink them like above if you like. The Validate step is necessary because there's no way for you, the user, to link the two existing accounts. Please be sure to run Validate before attempting to link/unlink any of your Money IRA/401k accounts.

    Dan

    I was able to combine the cash account for my IRA accounts, but not 401(k) and 403(b). In addition, quicken 2011 won't allow me to categorize the "account intent" of my cash account for my 401(k) and 403(b) as a retirement account (Error message, "Quicken can not move this account. It is already linked to an investment account, and these transactions are included in investment calculations. You can either keep the account under the Cash Flow Center tab or close out the linked checking account.") - whatever that means :-/

    I would appreciate a fix for this!
  • edited July 2016
    I just wanted to mention, if anyone finds this post, that I just ran into this issue after doing a validate in 2011 R8. I just had a long chat with support and there is no solution. My backup file is 2 months old and I did a lot of work on my files during that time. My schwab bank accounts is now irreversibly linked to my 401k. I can no longer update it because it has the incorrect financial institution. I cannot move tx because the 401k contributions post back into it. It is a huge mess, and support has no solution other than go back to your old file. In fact they tried to have me go to the Show As Cash Account field, which no longer exists in 2011 R8.

    Note: Do Not validate old MS money data!!!
  • Howard RoarkHoward Roark Member
    edited August 2016
    Here is something you can try.
    -----------------------------------------

    Steps to recover from unwanted checking account linked to retirement account.

    Welcome to the Money Converter Catch-22.

    The reason you can't unlink the checking account is because Quicken does not offer the user any way to create a linked checking account for retirement accounts ... so Quicken offers no way to unlink them.

    As I understand the source of the problem; Money (apparently) created an invisible linked checking account for all investment accounts. The results of converting Money's linked checking accounts was no problem for non-retirement accounts ... but created the problem often reported, for converted retirement accounts. I suspect that there were no good alternatives for the Money Converter (which was written by an ex-Money programmer).

    If the problem had been addressed within a short time after initially converting, the workaround would have been fairly trivial ... basically re-convert:

    1.) In the Money file, change all retirement accounts to non-retirement accounts.
    2.) Convert the Money file to Quicken.
    3.) In Quicken, unlink all the checking accounts from the ex-Money-retirement accounts.
    4.) Tell Quicken to change the ex-Money-retirement accounts to Quicken retirement accounts.


    For those who can no longer re-convert: my suggested approach attempts to duplicate (to the extent possible) the simple approach mentioned above.

    1.) Backup
    2.) Create a new Quicken non-retirement brokerage account
    3.) Tell Quicken to "Show cash in a checking account" for new brokerage account.
    4.) Export the old retirement brokerage account to a QIF file.
    5.) Edit the exported QIF file (Notepad should work):
    5a.) Add records to make the QIF file importable, as described in:
    https://qlc.intuit.com/post/show_post_full_view/dQMNaWtX4r3OK1acfArQA8
    Read the first post in that link completely, and thoroughly.
    Make sure to use the exact name of the newly created Quicken brokerage account from step #2 above for "MyAccount" in the "NMyAccount" record.
    5b.) "Replace" all occurrences of the old linked checking account name with the new linked checking account name.
    6.) Import the modified QIF file into the new non-retirement brokerage account (created in step #2) as specified in the Community post referenced in step #5a.
    7.) Examine transactions in the old Quicken linked checking account. Use Copy transactions/Paste transactions to put the old linked checking account transactions not linked to the old brokerage account, into the new linked checking account. Transactions like checks written, paychecks deposited, or cash transferred to some other account besides the linked retirement account, for example.
    8.) Tell Quicken not to "Show cash in checking account" for the new brokerage account. [Ignore warning message.]
    9.) Tell Quicken that the new brokerage account is "tax deferred". [See the "Edit Account Details" dialog for the brokerage account.]
    10.) Tell Quicken to convert the new brokerage account to an IRA or 401k account. [See the blue link in the "Account Type" in the "Account Attributes" section of the "Account Overview" for the brokerage account.]
    11.) Make sure the new retirement brokerage account is correct.
    12.) Delete the old retirement brokerage account.
  • Larry RockLarry Rock Member
    edited May 2018
    I apologize for digging up this oldie, goldie BUT I've got this Microsoft Money related problem and have finally decided to do something about it. After a couple of hours of searching, I was ecstatic to find this very detailed solution and was preparing to take the plunge when I found a small glitch. The link in 5a.) in Howard Roark's wonderful instructions is no longer supported because it belongs to intuit. Can anyone help me with the information that was spelled out in this link? Thanks in advance.
  • Quicken HaroldQuicken Harold Moderator ✭✭✭✭
    edited March 2018

    I apologize for digging up this oldie, goldie BUT I've got this Microsoft Money related problem and have finally decided to do something about it. After a couple of hours of searching, I was ecstatic to find this very detailed solution and was preparing to take the plunge when I found a small glitch. The link in 5a.) in Howard Roark's wonderful instructions is no longer supported because it belongs to intuit. Can anyone help me with the information that was spelled out in this link? Thanks in advance.

    Hello Larry, appreciate your question.

    Here are the steps for importing a QIF: https://www.quicken.com/support/qif-import-frequently-asked-questions-quicken-windows

    Hope this helps.

    Respectfully,
    ~ Quicken Harold.
    Quicken Harold
    Community Moderator
  • q_lurkerq_lurker SuperUser ✭✭✭✭
    edited March 2018

    I apologize for digging up this oldie, goldie BUT I've got this Microsoft Money related problem and have finally decided to do something about it. After a couple of hours of searching, I was ecstatic to find this very detailed solution and was preparing to take the plunge when I found a small glitch. The link in 5a.) in Howard Roark's wonderful instructions is no longer supported because it belongs to intuit. Can anyone help me with the information that was spelled out in this link? Thanks in advance.

    @Larry:  Better still
    https://getsatisfaction.com/quickencommunity/topics/faq-how-to-import-qif-files-into-non-cash-accoun...
    and 
    https://getsatisfaction.com/quickencommunity/topics/faq-a-program-to-add-the-account-name-and-type-t...
    and 
    maybe some others on this list
    https://getsatisfaction.com/quickencommunity/topics/faq-is-there-a-faq-listing
    
  • Larry RockLarry Rock Member
    edited March 2018
    Thanks for the quick replies. Much appreciated! First attempt crashed and burned. Will keep banging away at it to see if I can get it to work. Thanks, again. Larry
This discussion has been closed.