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How to track money transfered between Investment and Banking accounts (Quicken Deluxe Windows 2015)

Unknown
Unknown Member
edited October 2018 in Investing (Windows)
Two things I want to be able to do.  I want to be able to track movement of money between Banking and Investment Accounts as Income or Expense (or Transfer). And I want to track transfers of money to/from Investment accounts.  There does not appear to be anyway to do it.  Maybe someone out there has a better worki around than I have come up with.

If I have $10 in come, have $9 in "normal" expenses, and transfer $1 an asset account; all of that shows up in my income/expense report.  The $1 transfer shows up as an expense to [AssetAccount].  But if instead the $1 is transfered to a retirement account, that $1 does not show up as an expense.  Is there some way an investment account can be configured so it works similarly to a Property Account in this respect?  My current work around is to create a AssetAccount I call Transfer.  Any transfers from between Bank and Investment go through the intermediary Transfer account.  It is a pain because each transfer requires to transactions instead of one.

The second thing that interests me is tracking transfers.  Under Spending->ItemizedPayees, one can get a report showing all Income, Expense, and Transfer transaction.  Well not all, most transfers in/out of Investment accounts do not get included because there is no way to include a "Payee" in the transaction in the Investment Account.  (The only other report I have found that I had hoped would yield useful results was Investing->InvestingReports->InvestmentTransactions but that has two major flaws.  First it results are very buggy, totals are not the sum of the things they total.  And the only way to use that to get what I want is to clear all categories, then check all the account categories, which must be done one at a time.  Given the large number of account I have, this is both time consuming and prone to error if something does not get properly clicked.) My work around for this issue is to instead of transfering the money to/from a stock buy/sell directly from/to an account, I transfer it from/to the Investment account's cash balance,  Then I can create a deposit/withdrawal form the transfer, a transaction that includes a Payee fee (which I can specify to be the account/stock).

But combine this work around with the one above, I am now having to create three transactions in Quicken for something that is a single transaction.  To summarize, this is the transaction.

Sell $100 worth of StockA in account InvestA with proceeds to account BankA.

My work around is to process this as three transactions:

InvestA: Sell $100 worth of StockA to cash balance
InvestA: Withdrawal $100 to account Transfer with Payee "InvestA/StockA" (or just "InvestA")
Transfer: Decrease $100 to account BankA.

In the ItemizedPayees report, the transfer out of InvestA now shows up.  in the Income/Expense report, the transfer from Transfer to BankA shows up under Income.

Any ideas on a better way to do this?

Comments

  • UKR
    UKR SuperUser ✭✭✭✭✭
    edited September 2018
    Other than for the purposes of Income Tax reporting, I don't really know why one would need to track transfers ... but maybe I haven't fully thought this whole thing through.

    In budgets and reports you can always elect to show transfers to or from certain accounts, so you can see what goes where, as needed.

    For investment accounts and because Quicken for Windows does not allow you to categorize transfers, you can select income tax categories to be applied to transfers in or out.
    For example, Contributions to tax-deferred accounts or IRA Withdrawals need to have a tax category assigned so that these transactions appear in the tax reports of Quicken.
    To set this up, go into Edit Account Details for the investment account. Click the Tax Schedule button in the popup view. In the next popup select the tax categories that apply to this account's Transfers-in (Contributions) and Transfers-out (Withdrawals).

    I let somebody else analyze what specifically you're doing. All these workarounds you have devised seem like overkill to me.
  • NotACPA
    NotACPA SuperUser, Windows Beta Beta
    edited October 2018
    From an accounting perspective, there are only 4 types of "registers": Income, Expense, Asset and Liability. 
    If you add money and use and Income category, you've got more money.
    If you spend money and use an Expense caterory, you've got less money.
    Those will show up on an Income and Expense report.

    If you move money from an Asset account to another Asset account, you've got the exact same amount of money that you had before.  Your Net Worth hasn't changed.
    If you move money from an Asset account to a Liability account, you've got less money, but also less liability.  Your Net Worth hasn't changed.

    Instead of looking at an Income and Expese report to show your movement of funds to the Investment account ... look at a Cash Flow report.
    Q user since DOS version 5
    Now running Quicken Windows Subscription,  Home & Business
    Retired "Certified Information Systems Auditor" & Bank Audit VP
  • Unknown
    Unknown Member
    edited October 2017
    Let me respond to both of you.  During my working life, a portion of my wages are diverted into accounts that save that money for when I am retired.  During my retired life, money in those ccounts comes out to serve as my "income".  That tax status and type of the accounts is irrelevant (Roth, IRA, 401K, "regular", gold), their purpose is what is important (I do not use quicken for doing tax stuff, it does not serve that purpose well for me). So when I refer below to a retirement account, I am talking about an account whose purpose is to lock away funds until retirement, not tax status.

    Now lets look at what happens if I get paid $10 of which $1 is to go into a retirment account.  let also assume I spend what I make.  Then IMHO, my budget should show $10 in income with $9 in "regular expenses and $1 of an expense representing that money being put away for retirement.  Now lets say the retirement account in question is a Gold account which in Quicken is created as an asset.  That is exactly what Quicken will give me.  Any funds moving from one of my bank accounts to that Gold account show up as an Expense.  But if I move the funds from a bank account to a investment account, that transfer does not show up in Quicken as an Expense.  Quicken treats them differently.  In either case, you are correct, my net worth has not changed.

    Here is another way of looking at it.  Lets say you buy an $100 Annuity.  When you buy that Annuity, that transaction will show up as an Expense of $100.  years later you retire and you start getting payments from that Annuity.  Those payments will show up as Income.  That is the same concept as is happening with my retirement accounts.  Money going in during my working years is an expense I want to show up as an Expense.  Then later in retirement when money comes out, that shows up as Income.  That is the way Quicken would show it if I had an Anuity account.  That is the way Quicken would show it if I had a Gold Asset account.  But I am have to use these kludges to get Quicken to show it for Investment Accounts.
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