2017 Mac Discount? Where is the UPGRADE price?

Tom AndersonTom Anderson Member ✭✭
Why is there an insignificant discount - especially for those with Quicken 2016 - this is the greed that Intuit/Quicken continue to cast upon the waters. I bout 2016 less than a year ago and you want another 75 bucks? The software still is not equivalent to the Windows version - not that that should be the pricing factor either - for an upgrade.
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Comments

  • JonJon Member
    edited December 2016
    I agree. I bought this in March or April of last year and they already want $65 ($10 discount) to upgrade. I doubt they are going to continue to update the version I bought which means I'm left with the bugs that this already has.
  • pauldv172pauldv172 Member ✭✭
    edited December 2018
    They don't care about there long standing customers. If there was something major included ok, but nothing worth the current price. Just continued bugs that WE have to work thru.
  • masugmasug Member
    edited March 2017
    Every year I suggest an upgrade price as a "feature" or "request". 2017 is the same as previous years. Quicken doesn't give a damn.
  • jacobsjacobs SuperUser ✭✭✭✭✭
    edited December 2016
    masug said:

    Every year I suggest an upgrade price as a "feature" or "request". 2017 is the same as previous years. Quicken doesn't give a damn.

    It's not that they don't give damn; it's that this is their chosen business model. We want them to hire more programmers to add more features more quickly; they're a business which has to make money. I'm sure they've got a finance person there who has built different models for pricing. Perhaps they've calculated they'd need to raise the overall price of the product in order to give existing users a lower-cost upgrade price, and that doing so would dampen growth of new users.

    I've been no fan of the move of parts of the software industry to annual subscription pricing, but in Quicken's case, I think it could be worthwhile; I'd gladly pay, say, $30 a year for a new version each year versus spending $75 once every three years for a new version. But their business forecast models must tell them the numbers are less favorable that way.
    QMac 2007 & QMac Subscription • Quicken user since 1993
  • masugmasug Member
    edited October 2016
    Well, the model did not work. Did it? After all Intuit had to sell off Quicken.



    My expectation was that under the new management, Quicken team would have a serious rethink on how to survive and THRIVE in the 21st century. Instead Quicken 2017 launch is just a rehash of the old strategy.


    Quicken 2017 RPM: RRP $164. Initial offer $154 (10 off). Amazon a week later: $144 ($20 off). A couple of months later email offer: $99 ($64 off). Most will wait. After all Quicken 2016, R8 is a stable version (R1-R4 had serious issues).



    Haven’t we all seen this before?
  • jacobsjacobs SuperUser ✭✭✭✭✭
    edited February 2017
    pauldv172 said:

    They don't care about there long standing customers. If there was something major included ok, but nothing worth the current price. Just continued bugs that WE have to work thru.

    I'm pretty sure they do care about their customers, because they'd quickly be out of business if existing customers didn't stay with them. (If anything, personal finance software is a shrinking product market with many young people choosing online services like Mint over traditional desktop-based programs -- meaning Quicken depends even more heavily on retaining existing customers.)

    We can debate whether their longstanding pricing model is the best or not. I think it does make many people angry to have to buy the program again instead of getting a lower-cost upgrade, but they must have calculated they'd make less money and not be able to make things work otherwise. Now that software subscriptions have become more common, I've wondered why they haven't move to such a pricing scheme, or at least offered it as an option. I'd love to hear President Eric Dunn or someone from Quicken explain why they choose to do their pricing the way they do, but I doubt that will ever happen. (They're not going to share their customer sales data publicly, I'm sure.)

    But in response to your comment about there being nothing major that's new, I'd say that you need to look at it differently than we longtime customers used to. It used to be that there was one annual release per year. They worked all year to add a bunch of features, and it came out each fall as the next annual product. But they broke that mold when this next-generation Quicken for Mac came to market in August 2014. Because the program was pretty incomplete and rough around the edges, they wanted to be able to continue to push out new features and enhancements without waiting a whole year. So they moved to a model of incremental releases; as soon as some new features were done and tested, they'd release them for free to users of the current year's program. This meant we users got new features to use sooner.

    For example, we Quicken 2016 users got the budgeting feature this past spring, instead of waiting until the release of Quicken 2017 to get it. We got the ability to view the investment portfolio as of a past date, in order to check against a brokerage statement -- something I'd been desperately wanting since Quicken 2015 came out -- in the spring as well, instead of waiting for the 2017 product. This approach also allows them to release a new feature in rudimentary form, get feedback from customers about what it lacks, and refine it via new iterations as frequently as monthly. Again, look at the budget this past year, where new features were added in the months following the initial bare-bones release. And other highly-requested features for budgeting -- such as printing a budget report, being able to include/exclude by account, being able to include/exclude fund transfers -- are still being worked on, or on the roadmap for the future. If they waited until the budget functionality was "done", we wouldn't have it at all until Quicken 2018 came out!

    So my point is that under this new model, you can't really look at the difference between the ending Quicken 2016 and the beginning Quicken 2017 -- there are only a couple month of programming work in the 2017 release beyond the latest 2016 release, so it's not too surprising there aren't a boatload of new features. The way to evaluate the value of Quicken 2017 will be to look at it at the end of the product year, and compare that version of 2017 to the end version of 2016 a year earlier. Of course, we can't look forward a year and know what will or won't make it out the door, so the best we can do to approximate is look back at the past year. Does the end version of Quicken 2016 justify the cost of buying it compared to the end version of Quicken 2015? When Quicken 2016 first shipped last November, it essentially had one new feature: online bill payment. But if you launch Quicken 2016, open Help, and click on "What's new in the latest update," you can scroll through all the fixes and new features that were added since Quicken 2016 first shipped. People who bought Quicken 2016 actually did get a decent number of new features -- just not all at the beginning of the year when the program first shipped.

    Of course, we all want more new features. Hopefully, the programmers they've been adding to the Mac team will help increase the speed new features come out in the year ahead. (Although Marcus has already signaled that they're first going to have to spend a bunch of time working on infrastructure to rid Quicken of the back-end services still supplied by former parent Intuit, so that may significantly limit the speed of new features for awhile.)

    Bottom line for all of us: until there are enough advantages to the new version to make it feel worth the cost, rather than be angry at Quicken, just don't buy it yet. I wouldn't think most Quicken 2016 users would jump to buy Quicken 2017 right now, unless they've been desperately waiting for the two new features (Quicken Bill Pay and comparison reports) that made it into the first release. If the Quicken team doesn't push out enough new features, or the new features you're looking for, during the course of the year, you might find you could skip 2017 and wait to purchase 2018. If they do push out new features later in the product year that would make your life easier, then buy 2017 at that time.
    QMac 2007 & QMac Subscription • Quicken user since 1993
  • masugmasug Member
    edited October 2016
    pauldv172 said:

    They don't care about there long standing customers. If there was something major included ok, but nothing worth the current price. Just continued bugs that WE have to work thru.

    At least we both, as long time users, agree the pricing model is not the best. As you said that they are incrementally adding features throughout the year (though the first few releases are mostly bug fixes!), it might be most appropriate to go for a subscription service.


    As Quicken is not changing its mind regarding the business model, though I may not wait for Q2018, I will wait for the half price sale in a few months! Or keep an eye on Amazon.com for even a better price.
  • Tom AndersonTom Anderson Member ✭✭
    edited October 2016
    masug said:

    Every year I suggest an upgrade price as a "feature" or "request". 2017 is the same as previous years. Quicken doesn't give a damn.

    As a superuser, you obviously have made numerous and possibly thoughtful comments on these topics. The reality of their business model is hype and vaporware. I say vaporware because the time needed to complete the programming and validation plus beta testing has been lengthy enough to provide a lot more than what they have rolled out from Quicken 2007 for the Mac. There are plenty of programs out there that have comparable complexity (for other kinds of applications - not a financial "package") and the cost of those is significantly less and upgrade plans that are more rational. Now, the investors and management involved with this product appear to have their own distortion field in the space-time continuum. I still do not have the simplest transfer of funds feature that was easily conducted in 2007. It may not be on their list or priority features, but there is also no reason that the features and capability in 2007 be completely available and not piece-parted out over 5 years or so and even one a full, or near full upgrade price tied to it.
  • jacobsjacobs SuperUser ✭✭✭✭✭
    edited February 2017
    masug said:

    Every year I suggest an upgrade price as a "feature" or "request". 2017 is the same as previous years. Quicken doesn't give a damn.

    Tom, I agree with your frustration at the slow pace of development. I share it. Although I'm using the new Quicken products to test them, and participate in beta testing, I continue to keep my live records in Quicken 2007 because there are still key features to me that don't yet exist in Quicken 2017. (I'm curious what transfer of funds feature you're referring to doesn't exist in the new Quicken, though.)

    Where I'll disagree with you is your assertion that the business model is hype and vaporware. I honestly think the Mac team at Quicken wants to deliver more, and faster, to their customers. They have been saddled with a large number of infrastructure changes that are invisible to customers when successful and painful to customers when buggy. Changing banking and networking standards took a lot of time to implement. Moving some back-end processing off servers that were developed before Quicken Essentials took a bunch of time. And sometimes they need to re-wrok existing code to keep up with Apple's annual macOS changes. These are all things which were needed to move forward, but which chewed up large chunks of time that couldn't go into user-facing features.

    The Mac programming team at Quicken has been tiny -- think handful, not dozens or hundreds -- since it was re-constituted starting in late 2012 to build this next generation Quicken. I have no inside information about their development roadmap, but I'm convinced they've made much slower progress than they thought they would. Product manager Marcus has said as much. If they could have re-created the features of Quicken 2007 in five years, I absolutely believe they would have. They wanted to retire support for Quicken 2007 before now; they wanted the Quicken 2007 (and Essentials) users to purchase the new product. the slow pace of new features is not by design to snooker users into spending money on upgrades spread out over multiple years. Heck, they'd sell a lot more upgrades if they delivered a lot more features.

    What scares me now is that even though Quicken President Eric Dunn earlier this year said they would double the size of the Mac development team, they next face the daunting task of "de-Intuit-ing" Quicken, reprogramming everything from the disliked Intuit ID to the back-end servers which log into financial institutions to download user transaction data and which assign categories and payee names to downloaded transactions. That will take months of development and testing for the servers as well as revamped code for the current and prior year Quicken Mac and Windows programs. Meanwhile, users will continue to be frustrated if often-requested features don't get delivered in the monthly updates Quicken has touted over the past two years.
    QMac 2007 & QMac Subscription • Quicken user since 1993
  • GarmGarm Member
    edited November 2016
    I have been a loyal user of Quicken for Mac for over 20 year and am currently using 2016 version.  Every time I use the program I like it more and will be an ongoing user.  Your recent policy of offering a $10 discount for current users is a huge mistake.  Users like to stay current and would certainly update with reasonable encouragement, say in the 50% range.  A $10 discount is like a slap in the face and will turn most users off to an otherwise very attractive program.  I am sure the majority of current 2016 users will simply not upgrade.  The argument that if you buy a 2016 car, the dealer does not offer you the 2017 when it comes out, is flawed.  You can sell your 2016 car and then buy the 2017.  This means you can likely upgrade a car for a 60-75% discount.  Same goes for a smartphone, computer, e-reader etc.  Please re-evaluate your upgrade policy for current users for the good of the company.  A loyal, happy contingent of regularly upgrading users is much better than a large group of dissatisfied users using an outdated version due to poor pricing policies.
  • 102_dar_70102_dar_70 Member ✭✭
    edited December 2016
    Jon said:

    I agree. I bought this in March or April of last year and they already want $65 ($10 discount) to upgrade. I doubt they are going to continue to update the version I bought which means I'm left with the bugs that this already has.

    @Jon, they will continue "support" for 3 years from when it was rolled out is the industry norm, which means fixes and security issues only no improvements.
  • 102_dar_70102_dar_70 Member ✭✭
    edited February 2017
    masug said:

    Every year I suggest an upgrade price as a "feature" or "request". 2017 is the same as previous years. Quicken doesn't give a damn.

    @Tom,
    I agree with you in many ways, 2007 has been the most loved version of Quicken (even the MAC version) by it's users and it is now 10 years later.  No reason the development team could not of cloned all of 2007 features into the latest version by now (MAC is worse off than Windows I understand in this scenario). Quicken obviously did not allocate the funds for the MAC upgrades as it was not that popular back then as Windows was.  Things have certainly changed in regards to the population of MAC users now and growing....... 
  • SherrySherry Member
    edited December 2016
    pauldv172 said:

    They don't care about there long standing customers. If there was something major included ok, but nothing worth the current price. Just continued bugs that WE have to work thru.

    will they honor the lower price for the windows version?
  • 102_dar_70102_dar_70 Member ✭✭
    edited October 2018
    I see it''s available at Staples retailing  for 54.95 plus tax and you think this is a high priced program with all the bells and whistles it has and a team of MAC specific programmers dedicated to making it a better program for users with a support team if you have issues. Come on.  People just have to complain and try to get something for nothing, I hate it when I run into it.  They want all the extras but at a discount. Please.........  I think they should charge more given what goes into all the programming hours,  testing, packaging/marketing and so on.  Quicken has to sell a lot of the 2017 to make a profit at that price.  I don't think the original prices were out of line at all but I do agree it needs a lot more work to bring it to the level of the 2007 mac version.  

    Sorry but you lose money on a car or electronics as they devalue from what you paid for it the moment you take possession (used).  You sell a car after one year when you're upside down in the vehicle,  you will incur a financial loss.  You can lease things, but you don't own it so the money is just rent (down the drain) for the term of the lease.
  • jacobsjacobs SuperUser ✭✭✭✭✭
    edited December 2016

    I see it''s available at Staples retailing  for 54.95 plus tax and you think this is a high priced program with all the bells and whistles it has and a team of MAC specific programmers dedicated to making it a better program for users with a support team if you have issues. Come on.  People just have to complain and try to get something for nothing, I hate it when I run into it.  They want all the extras but at a discount. Please.........  I think they should charge more given what goes into all the programming hours,  testing, packaging/marketing and so on.  Quicken has to sell a lot of the 2017 to make a profit at that price.  I don't think the original prices were out of line at all but I do agree it needs a lot more work to bring it to the level of the 2007 mac version.  

    Sorry but you lose money on a car or electronics as they devalue from what you paid for it the moment you take possession (used).  You sell a car after one year when you're upside down in the vehicle,  you will incur a financial loss.  You can lease things, but you don't own it so the money is just rent (down the drain) for the term of the lease.

    Amazon is selling Quicken 2017 for Mac for $47.51 currently (12/25/16), although their price fluctuates frequently. Amazon is often the lowest price around.

    (Note that buying it from Amazon is fine, but... for someone who is iffy about Quicken 2017 for Mac and wants to try it but thinks they might use the 60-day refund to bail out, getting the refund is faster and easier if the purchase is made directly from Quicken than from Amazon.)
    QMac 2007 & QMac Subscription • Quicken user since 1993
  • splashersplasher SuperUser ✭✭✭✭✭
    edited December 2016
    pauldv172 said:

    They don't care about there long standing customers. If there was something major included ok, but nothing worth the current price. Just continued bugs that WE have to work thru.

    @Sherry

    Two completely different products, so no discount matching.
    -splasher  using Q since 1996 -  QW 2015, 2016, 2017 & Subscription  -  Win10
    -Questions? Check out the  Quicken Windows FAQ list

  • 102_dar_70102_dar_70 Member ✭✭
    edited December 2016

    I see it''s available at Staples retailing  for 54.95 plus tax and you think this is a high priced program with all the bells and whistles it has and a team of MAC specific programmers dedicated to making it a better program for users with a support team if you have issues. Come on.  People just have to complain and try to get something for nothing, I hate it when I run into it.  They want all the extras but at a discount. Please.........  I think they should charge more given what goes into all the programming hours,  testing, packaging/marketing and so on.  Quicken has to sell a lot of the 2017 to make a profit at that price.  I don't think the original prices were out of line at all but I do agree it needs a lot more work to bring it to the level of the 2007 mac version.  

    Sorry but you lose money on a car or electronics as they devalue from what you paid for it the moment you take possession (used).  You sell a car after one year when you're upside down in the vehicle,  you will incur a financial loss.  You can lease things, but you don't own it so the money is just rent (down the drain) for the term of the lease.

    64.00 after 10.00 discount with 60 day refund policy or 47.00 from Amazon no refund available.  That amounts to almost 30% off Quickens price.  If you really have that much reservation about the product, I don't think I wouldn't upgrade at this point.  If you are using 2016 your using a current enough version unless one of the 2017 features is a must have.  I don't do online third party stuff so I'm OK where I'm at.  I think it's probably better to wait until they have gotten all the kinks out (patches) anyway. :)
  • jacobsjacobs SuperUser ✭✭✭✭✭
    edited December 2016

    I see it''s available at Staples retailing  for 54.95 plus tax and you think this is a high priced program with all the bells and whistles it has and a team of MAC specific programmers dedicated to making it a better program for users with a support team if you have issues. Come on.  People just have to complain and try to get something for nothing, I hate it when I run into it.  They want all the extras but at a discount. Please.........  I think they should charge more given what goes into all the programming hours,  testing, packaging/marketing and so on.  Quicken has to sell a lot of the 2017 to make a profit at that price.  I don't think the original prices were out of line at all but I do agree it needs a lot more work to bring it to the level of the 2007 mac version.  

    Sorry but you lose money on a car or electronics as they devalue from what you paid for it the moment you take possession (used).  You sell a car after one year when you're upside down in the vehicle,  you will incur a financial loss.  You can lease things, but you don't own it so the money is just rent (down the drain) for the term of the lease.

    You absolutely CAN get a refund for Quicken if you purchase through Amazon. It involves mailing in proof of purchase and waiting to receive a refund check in the mail, so it's just not as fast or convenient as getting a refund directly from Quicken.
    QMac 2007 & QMac Subscription • Quicken user since 1993
  • 102_dar_70102_dar_70 Member ✭✭
    edited December 2016

    I see it''s available at Staples retailing  for 54.95 plus tax and you think this is a high priced program with all the bells and whistles it has and a team of MAC specific programmers dedicated to making it a better program for users with a support team if you have issues. Come on.  People just have to complain and try to get something for nothing, I hate it when I run into it.  They want all the extras but at a discount. Please.........  I think they should charge more given what goes into all the programming hours,  testing, packaging/marketing and so on.  Quicken has to sell a lot of the 2017 to make a profit at that price.  I don't think the original prices were out of line at all but I do agree it needs a lot more work to bring it to the level of the 2007 mac version.  

    Sorry but you lose money on a car or electronics as they devalue from what you paid for it the moment you take possession (used).  You sell a car after one year when you're upside down in the vehicle,  you will incur a financial loss.  You can lease things, but you don't own it so the money is just rent (down the drain) for the term of the lease.

    If that's true great! But I did read their refund policy and it stated unopened unused items only that's why I concluded this product would not be eligible.  Maybe they will give store credit.
  • 102_dar_70102_dar_70 Member ✭✭
    edited December 2016

    I see it''s available at Staples retailing  for 54.95 plus tax and you think this is a high priced program with all the bells and whistles it has and a team of MAC specific programmers dedicated to making it a better program for users with a support team if you have issues. Come on.  People just have to complain and try to get something for nothing, I hate it when I run into it.  They want all the extras but at a discount. Please.........  I think they should charge more given what goes into all the programming hours,  testing, packaging/marketing and so on.  Quicken has to sell a lot of the 2017 to make a profit at that price.  I don't think the original prices were out of line at all but I do agree it needs a lot more work to bring it to the level of the 2007 mac version.  

    Sorry but you lose money on a car or electronics as they devalue from what you paid for it the moment you take possession (used).  You sell a car after one year when you're upside down in the vehicle,  you will incur a financial loss.  You can lease things, but you don't own it so the money is just rent (down the drain) for the term of the lease.

    The 48.00 product is a download purchased from Quicken through Amazon so Quickens refund policy will prevail.  Check with Quicken on their policy regarding downloaded software refunds.
  • gmalis1gmalis1 Member
    edited February 2017
    Don't upgrade...or buy it from Amazon at a greatly reduced price from the suggested retail price. 
  • splashersplasher SuperUser ✭✭✭✭✭
    edited December 2016

    I see it''s available at Staples retailing  for 54.95 plus tax and you think this is a high priced program with all the bells and whistles it has and a team of MAC specific programmers dedicated to making it a better program for users with a support team if you have issues. Come on.  People just have to complain and try to get something for nothing, I hate it when I run into it.  They want all the extras but at a discount. Please.........  I think they should charge more given what goes into all the programming hours,  testing, packaging/marketing and so on.  Quicken has to sell a lot of the 2017 to make a profit at that price.  I don't think the original prices were out of line at all but I do agree it needs a lot more work to bring it to the level of the 2007 mac version.  

    Sorry but you lose money on a car or electronics as they devalue from what you paid for it the moment you take possession (used).  You sell a car after one year when you're upside down in the vehicle,  you will incur a financial loss.  You can lease things, but you don't own it so the money is just rent (down the drain) for the term of the lease.

    Amazon is not the entity that is providing the refund, Quicken is, so what it states on the Amazon site is immaterial.

    Quicken Return Policy 
    -splasher  using Q since 1996 -  QW 2015, 2016, 2017 & Subscription  -  Win10
    -Questions? Check out the  Quicken Windows FAQ list

  • 102_dar_70102_dar_70 Member ✭✭
    edited December 2016

    I see it''s available at Staples retailing  for 54.95 plus tax and you think this is a high priced program with all the bells and whistles it has and a team of MAC specific programmers dedicated to making it a better program for users with a support team if you have issues. Come on.  People just have to complain and try to get something for nothing, I hate it when I run into it.  They want all the extras but at a discount. Please.........  I think they should charge more given what goes into all the programming hours,  testing, packaging/marketing and so on.  Quicken has to sell a lot of the 2017 to make a profit at that price.  I don't think the original prices were out of line at all but I do agree it needs a lot more work to bring it to the level of the 2007 mac version.  

    Sorry but you lose money on a car or electronics as they devalue from what you paid for it the moment you take possession (used).  You sell a car after one year when you're upside down in the vehicle,  you will incur a financial loss.  You can lease things, but you don't own it so the money is just rent (down the drain) for the term of the lease.

    No it's not, there are several other vendors/sellers selling Quicken 2017 on Amazon besides Quicken and Amazon states who ever is the Amazon seller their refund policy prevails, so it says read the sellers policy before you buy.  There is also a used one for sale for 26.00.   
  • jacobsjacobs SuperUser ✭✭✭✭✭
    edited December 2016

    I see it''s available at Staples retailing  for 54.95 plus tax and you think this is a high priced program with all the bells and whistles it has and a team of MAC specific programmers dedicated to making it a better program for users with a support team if you have issues. Come on.  People just have to complain and try to get something for nothing, I hate it when I run into it.  They want all the extras but at a discount. Please.........  I think they should charge more given what goes into all the programming hours,  testing, packaging/marketing and so on.  Quicken has to sell a lot of the 2017 to make a profit at that price.  I don't think the original prices were out of line at all but I do agree it needs a lot more work to bring it to the level of the 2007 mac version.  

    Sorry but you lose money on a car or electronics as they devalue from what you paid for it the moment you take possession (used).  You sell a car after one year when you're upside down in the vehicle,  you will incur a financial loss.  You can lease things, but you don't own it so the money is just rent (down the drain) for the term of the lease.

    As I said above, Quicken's refund policies are really quite clear. Here is the page on Quicken.com for refund policies and procedures. Click the link for "Electronically Delivered Products (Downloads) purchased from Amazon.com". The refund is not done by Amazon; it's done by Quicken. That's why Amazon's software refund policy is irrelevant.
    QMac 2007 & QMac Subscription • Quicken user since 1993
  • 102_dar_70102_dar_70 Member ✭✭
    edited December 2016

    I see it''s available at Staples retailing  for 54.95 plus tax and you think this is a high priced program with all the bells and whistles it has and a team of MAC specific programmers dedicated to making it a better program for users with a support team if you have issues. Come on.  People just have to complain and try to get something for nothing, I hate it when I run into it.  They want all the extras but at a discount. Please.........  I think they should charge more given what goes into all the programming hours,  testing, packaging/marketing and so on.  Quicken has to sell a lot of the 2017 to make a profit at that price.  I don't think the original prices were out of line at all but I do agree it needs a lot more work to bring it to the level of the 2007 mac version.  

    Sorry but you lose money on a car or electronics as they devalue from what you paid for it the moment you take possession (used).  You sell a car after one year when you're upside down in the vehicle,  you will incur a financial loss.  You can lease things, but you don't own it so the money is just rent (down the drain) for the term of the lease.

    I only said if the seller was not Quicken and Amazon is not the seller in any case just the platform by which it is being advertised for sale.  Quicken is not the only "seller" and cannot refund what it has not been paid from the purchaser. Simple mathematics.
  • jacobsjacobs SuperUser ✭✭✭✭✭
    edited December 2016

    I see it''s available at Staples retailing  for 54.95 plus tax and you think this is a high priced program with all the bells and whistles it has and a team of MAC specific programmers dedicated to making it a better program for users with a support team if you have issues. Come on.  People just have to complain and try to get something for nothing, I hate it when I run into it.  They want all the extras but at a discount. Please.........  I think they should charge more given what goes into all the programming hours,  testing, packaging/marketing and so on.  Quicken has to sell a lot of the 2017 to make a profit at that price.  I don't think the original prices were out of line at all but I do agree it needs a lot more work to bring it to the level of the 2007 mac version.  

    Sorry but you lose money on a car or electronics as they devalue from what you paid for it the moment you take possession (used).  You sell a car after one year when you're upside down in the vehicle,  you will incur a financial loss.  You can lease things, but you don't own it so the money is just rent (down the drain) for the term of the lease.

    You're over-complicating things. When someone says "buy from Amazon", we mean go to Amazon, search for Quicken 2017 for Mac, and buy it. As the attached screenshot shows, the "seller" is "Amazon Digital Services LLC". Note there are NO other sellers available for the digital download version -- only Amazon. (Other sellers only show up if you try to buy a CD version, which there is honestly no reason for anyone to purchase anymore; the CD version still requires Internet access so it can immediately upon launch download the latest version. And you CAN get a refund from Quicken for physical CD purchases from other vendors, simply by following the link on the same Quicken refunds page under the "Retail Purchases" link.)

    image

    The Amazon page also shows that "This product is non-returnable and non-refundable." Which is true, as far as Amazon is concerned -- you can't get a refund from Amazon. But it's NOT true as far as Quicken is concerned, because Quicken WILL refund your purchase price upon request and receipt of your Amazon purchase receipt or invoice, just by following the instructions in the link I provided above.

    Can we just leave it at that?
    QMac 2007 & QMac Subscription • Quicken user since 1993
  • Joseph LiuzzoJoseph Liuzzo Member
    edited October 2018
    I've been relatively new using a Mac, having finally been 'converted' by all the positive things I had heard from other users and Apple's general good reputation, combined with some dis-satisfaction with Windows.  However, in certain respects, and unfortunately in the programs I use *most often* I have been sorely disappointed.   My experience with Quicken is very disappointing.  (So is the situation with MS Office for Mac, particularly Outlook, but that's a different story and not relevant to this site).

    I came here to see if others think whether upgrading to the 2017 version was worth it, because although the 2016 version was an improvement, it still left me far less satisfied than I was with the WIN version, of which I had been a loyal user since 1994.  

    I was unaware that Quicken had been spun off from Intuit and I'm a bit puzzled by some of the comments here that the current versions are trying to 'catch up' to the features that were in the 2007 Mac version.  Can someone shed light on what happened?   How is it that even if the product was split off into a new company, the newer versions are degraded from what was available in 2007?  That makes no sense to me.  
  • jacobsjacobs SuperUser ✭✭✭✭✭
    edited February 2017

    I've been relatively new using a Mac, having finally been 'converted' by all the positive things I had heard from other users and Apple's general good reputation, combined with some dis-satisfaction with Windows.  However, in certain respects, and unfortunately in the programs I use *most often* I have been sorely disappointed.   My experience with Quicken is very disappointing.  (So is the situation with MS Office for Mac, particularly Outlook, but that's a different story and not relevant to this site).

    I came here to see if others think whether upgrading to the 2017 version was worth it, because although the 2016 version was an improvement, it still left me far less satisfied than I was with the WIN version, of which I had been a loyal user since 1994.  

    I was unaware that Quicken had been spun off from Intuit and I'm a bit puzzled by some of the comments here that the current versions are trying to 'catch up' to the features that were in the 2007 Mac version.  Can someone shed light on what happened?   How is it that even if the product was split off into a new company, the newer versions are degraded from what was available in 2007?  That makes no sense to me.  

    Joseph, it's a good question. The history of Quicken for Mac is a long and rather tortured saga. The very short answer is that after Quicken 2007, they started over from scratch, and that Quicken 2017 doesn't yet have all the features of the older version. But the full story is much messier, and provides insight why after 10 years, we still don't have all the functionality we had a decade ago...

    After releasing Quicken 2007 back in mid-2016, the developers decided for a number of reasons that they were approaching a dead end in continuing to enhance it after two decades. Quicken's code base was built on a variety of tools that pre-dated Mac OS X and Intel processors, and some of those core tools were things Apple told developers is was moving away from in the future. So they concluded that the only path forward was to start over from scratch and build a new version of Quicken using modern Mac technologies for everything from the database to displaying what's on the screen to memory management, file access, data communications and more.

    Intuit announced in early 2008 that the re-write project would result in the launch of a new product, called Quicken Financial Life for Mac, in fall 2008. The date passed with no release, and Intuit announced it was pushed back to summer 2009. Beta testers worked on an early version of Quicken Financial Life, but there were so many problems with it, it was never released. In summer 2009, Intuit announced they were going back to the drawing board, and that the product would be delayed until 2010.

    But bigger changes were afoot. In fall 2009, Quicken bought Mint, an online site for managing personal finances, which in two short years had grown to be a significant competitor to Quicken. The founder and CEO of Mint was made the new VP and general manager of Intuit’s personal finance group, in charge of both Mint and Quicken. He changed the development of the Mac product and in early 2010 brought out Quicken Essentials for Mac -- a next-generation Quicken that was significantly limited in functionality. There was only rudimentary investment tracking, there was no online bill pay, it didn't export to TurboTax, etc. The new Quicken honcho said they called it Essentials because its core functionality would meet the needs of about 80% of users, and they felt it was better to ship a stripped-down product rather than waiting another year to develop all the missing functionality. But he promised a full-featured Quicken Deluxe for Mac would follow in 2011.

    It wasn't to be. The former Mint CEO left the personal finance group after only 18 months to work on innovation of other Intuit products (and left the company entirely a year later). With Quicken Essentials a sales disappointment, and Quicken Deluxe a long way from completion, Intuit management largely disbanded the Mac programming team. A new management team was installed, and a new product manager for Quicken Mac was hired in late 2011. He hired a few new programmers, and they first worked on fixes to Essentials just to keep it working with a revamped Intuit data service platform. Finally, in late 2012, work on a new version of Quicken for Mac got underway -- building on the Essentials code base, and starting with again revamping some of the programming architecture just to keep up with changes in the Mac operating system (particularly a new memory architecture). Through 2013 and 2014, the tiny Mac development team worked on the program, which eventually came to market as Quicken 2015 in August of 2014.

    That first release of Quicken 2015 was a mixed bag. It included some of the basic functionality for tracking investments that Essentials had never had. But it was still missing a large number of features from Quicken 2007 for Mac. The product manager said they knew it wouldn't yet satisfy many legacy users, but it was a step forward for Essentials users and it was better to release a work-in-progress than to keep laboring in the lab without releasing anything. The plan was to do quick iterations, adding additional features and responding to user feedback to guide development. They didn't want to just try to recreate what the old versions of Quicken did; they wanted to re-think things and skip some features that may have been added decades earlier that people no longer needed.

    And so, over the past 30 months, Quicken for Mac has made forward progress -- but hasn't yet crossed the finish line. The development team was small (it's gotten a bit bigger in the past year since Intuit sold off the Quicken division) so new features have appeared more slowly than anyone -- users and developers -- would like. There were many bugs to fix, as well as multiple detours to migrate back-end services to more modern and secure systems. But over time, some of the major holes, such as budgeting and online bill payment, have been addressed. The widely requested functionality for loan amortization is apparently the next major feature slated to arrive sometime this year. There are still some major gaps in printed reports and the intricacies of investment tracking, and we can only hope that these, too, will be addressed over time. The new CEO of Quicken stated last year that their goal was to move Quicken Mac closer to feature parity with Quicken Windows, but the reality is that full feature parity is still likely two or more years away.

    That's probably way more than you wanted to know! But since the question comes up frequently why Quicken 2017 is in certain ways behind Quicken 2007, I thought it was worth trying to explain the tortured path the program's development has taken to get us to where we are today.
    QMac 2007 & QMac Subscription • Quicken user since 1993
  • splashersplasher SuperUser ✭✭✭✭✭
    edited February 2017

    I've been relatively new using a Mac, having finally been 'converted' by all the positive things I had heard from other users and Apple's general good reputation, combined with some dis-satisfaction with Windows.  However, in certain respects, and unfortunately in the programs I use *most often* I have been sorely disappointed.   My experience with Quicken is very disappointing.  (So is the situation with MS Office for Mac, particularly Outlook, but that's a different story and not relevant to this site).

    I came here to see if others think whether upgrading to the 2017 version was worth it, because although the 2016 version was an improvement, it still left me far less satisfied than I was with the WIN version, of which I had been a loyal user since 1994.  

    I was unaware that Quicken had been spun off from Intuit and I'm a bit puzzled by some of the comments here that the current versions are trying to 'catch up' to the features that were in the 2007 Mac version.  Can someone shed light on what happened?   How is it that even if the product was split off into a new company, the newer versions are degraded from what was available in 2007?  That makes no sense to me.  

    @jacobs  Great recap.
    -splasher  using Q since 1996 -  QW 2015, 2016, 2017 & Subscription  -  Win10
    -Questions? Check out the  Quicken Windows FAQ list

  • Tom AndersonTom Anderson Member ✭✭
    edited February 2017

    I've been relatively new using a Mac, having finally been 'converted' by all the positive things I had heard from other users and Apple's general good reputation, combined with some dis-satisfaction with Windows.  However, in certain respects, and unfortunately in the programs I use *most often* I have been sorely disappointed.   My experience with Quicken is very disappointing.  (So is the situation with MS Office for Mac, particularly Outlook, but that's a different story and not relevant to this site).

    I came here to see if others think whether upgrading to the 2017 version was worth it, because although the 2016 version was an improvement, it still left me far less satisfied than I was with the WIN version, of which I had been a loyal user since 1994.  

    I was unaware that Quicken had been spun off from Intuit and I'm a bit puzzled by some of the comments here that the current versions are trying to 'catch up' to the features that were in the 2007 Mac version.  Can someone shed light on what happened?   How is it that even if the product was split off into a new company, the newer versions are degraded from what was available in 2007?  That makes no sense to me.  

    While the latest Quicken for Mac versions continue to improve, the desire not only to have the equivalent (parity) of the PC version with all features is just part of this entire story. Cost of upgrading continues to be questionable and sounds like the excuses coming form the current White House occupants. I have yet to pare down my file to only the most recent years of transactions as I do not know what limitations lurk by doing so. My data file is now approaching 75MB - and I get concerned that one data crash will lead to significant corruption - even with backup files and I have plenty. There is no clean way to do just this - define a year and all previous years and just file them away. The fear stems from changing file formats as much as how cleanly the pruning will be accomplished.
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