Quicken for Mac v5.14 Released

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Comments

  • glennmacc
    glennmacc Member ✭✭✭
    edited January 2020
    I'm going to weigh in on the issue of 5.14 not remembering or carrying over information from previous instances of a manually-entered transaction. I upgraded to 5.14 and did not have the serious issues of the $0 transactions in reports, so I have stuck with it now to 5.14.3. As for the the retaining of previous information in a manual transaction, I did not think it was a big deal for me, but since using 5.14, I do find it a pain to often need to go back to a previous transaction, copy the note or memo and change the information in the new transaction. So, to Quicken Marcus, I'd point out something about this: if you retain the information, those that don't want it can tab and hit delete to eliminate it. The current workflow means that those who do want it need to make many clicks and key strokes to attain their desired outcome; whereas if the information is retained, those that do not want it can get rid of it in just two keystrokes. That to me means the information should be retained, despite the survey that 80% said they do not want the information. Just my 2 cents.

    Glenn
  • Southcoast
    Southcoast Member ✭✭
    Version 5.14.3 I still have disappearing budgets. My USAA checking account does not update. Anyone out there with similar problems?
  • smayer97
    smayer97 SuperUser, Mac Beta, Canada Beta ✭✭✭✭✭
    edited February 2020
    RCinNJ said:
    ... "why break something that some users have used for many years" and force them to study the changes (after being negatively surprised) and learn how to adapt to the changes.

    I don't know about in this case, but I have seen this before when well-meaning programers make what they think are good and logical changes while not thoroughly understanding how their customers use the program. It leads to a pissed off and dwindling user base.
    Quicken Marcus said:
    ...

    4) Why do you make such stupid decisions?  Fair question. 

    ...

    We've heard you. This will be released in late February or early March.
    First, thanks for taking the time to reply. I appreciate that you are trying to balance many priorities and have stated in the past the desire to not always reproduce all the features from previous versions, as some may no longer be useful.

    That said, I am not sure about one of your statements about the 80%. Though I question the accuracy of that statistic, it still demands the question, Is that to
    whom Quicken is catering the product?

    The vast majority of users of ANY product are only going to use a subset of features or even a feature will be used only partially. BUT there will ALWAYS be a large portion of users that use the more in-depth and richer features of a product. That includes Quicken.

    As such, I am not sure why Quicken does not take the approach that when a previously existing feature is being introduced, especially a previously well used and central one, that the full feature set of that function be developed. In the event that a feature is super complex, then I can appreciate it being delivered in stages. But in either case, when a feature IS delivered less than the original, first, you know you WILL get an outcry AND confusion. So at the very least, to head off such backlash, please consider including notes to highlight this so users are well informed and can take adequate action, either via work-arounds, or to simply not update and wait for a subsequent version.

    If you then wish to deliver alternative capabilities to a feature set, that is fine, as long as the original feature set is still available. Quicken is already a very well established product and QM2007 (though it has its quirks and bugs) is a solid baseline for any feature being brought forward.

    Just some thoughts.

    And glad to know that the full-featured version of Quick-Fill is in the works.

    Thanks for your continued feedback and dialogue and staying accessible and responsive.
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  • Randy
    Randy Member ✭✭
    Hello

    Is there a way to turn off quick fill rules? I enter & download transactions on the go with the quicken mobile app and categorize them. Since the latest updates quicken desktop is changing my transaction categories & notes that I have already assigned once I sync.

    Thanks
  • Bill VanLoh
    Bill VanLoh Member ✭✭✭
    Question for QuickenMarcus and other team members,
    In your recent message you stated: "1) We had always planned on providing an option to allow you to save all fields in transactions and not just the category in QuickFill. I mentioned that 20% of customers said they wanted this behavior in our beta customer survey. Even though this is not the majority of Quicken users, 20% is still a lot of people so we knew we would need to add this feature back in 5.15. ....... 2) What is the timing? Beta customers will get the new auto-save tag, memo and amount feature next week and we will ship the feature to everyone in 5.15 which will release in February or early March. If you're interested in having a say regarding what's in Quicken, please join our beta program"
    ***Your message did not specifically address the "Notes" field, which, up until the recent "5.14 update" release, provided for saving text and numbers information to the next transaction with the same payee. I have found that VERY useful and rely on it for accuracy of recordkeeping from month to month.

    ***To clarify, "Notes" is the box that appears in each transaction at the far right, after Category, Tags, Transfer, Amount, ... and then, finally... NOTES.
    ***Will that feature also be added back (after being taken away recently) ...and returned to all users in the 5.15 release?
    I certainly hope so and make a strong and sincere request for its return.

    Bill VL
  • User251646
    User251646 Member ✭✭✭
    > @noramar said:
    > > @John_M said:
    > > I think what people were doing was having one line contain both an expense >category and a transfer, which, as Marcus says, is wrong from an accounting >perspective.
    >
    > Now THAT makes sense! Never even knew you could do this on one line. But why would you want to? Of course, you know I'm going to enter a fake transaction now just to see how that works.

    Per a suggestion from @J_Mike, I tried using one line with both an expense category and a transfer to get my IRA distribution to appear in the Tax Schedule report. Since the IRA distribution is a transfer from my IRA account to my Checking account, it is not included in the Tax Schedule report. That makes sense from Quicken’s policy that a transfer does not increase/decrease my net worth and should not be considered “income”, but the government insists on taxing this transfer so it also makes sense to include it in the Tax Schedule report.

    I have the same issue with including the IRA distribution as “income” in my QMac Budget. Hopefully, the Advanced tab allowing users to control whether transfers are included can eventually be applied to the Tax Schedule report and Budgets.
    Quicken Mac Subscription
  • I addressed your last point by creating an "Investment Draw" subcategory for "Personal Income" which I coupled to 1099-R. I then turned this category on in my budget. It then shows up in the income portion of the budget. Then set up a QuickFill rule that identifies transfers from the IRA account as "Personal Income: Investment Draw".

    The "Investment Draw" subcategory seems to work correctly and is now reflected in my budget. Will see if the QuickFill rule works with next month's transfer.
  • User251646
    User251646 Member ✭✭✭
    > @Doug Blakeley said:
    > I addressed your last point by creating an "Investment Draw"
    > subcategory for "Personal Income" which I coupled to 1099-R.

    Thank you, Doug. This is essentially what @J_Mike suggested for the Tax Schedule report, but the report would not display this category - apparently because the entry is both a category and a transfer. When I tried to see how this category worked in my budget, I found the category could be selected and displayed, but the actuals for January showed zero instead of the transaction amount. Do you see the correct actuals in your budget?

    Will
    Quicken Mac Subscription
  • I just recently started this approach but for a year to date report the draws appear under the 1099-R category.

    I have taken the approach that a draw from my IRA is income and not a transfer. I treat credit card payments as transfers as I have already categorized each credit card charge in their respective categories (groceries, restaurants, gas, etc.). The payment from my bank account to pay the credit card payment is considered a transfer.

    So the IRA draw goes into checking as income and the credit card payment is a transfer of these funds to pay the required credit card payment. This makes sense to me but I am not a financial expert by training.
  • glennmacc
    glennmacc Member ✭✭✭
    edited February 2020
    I recently took my first distribution from an IRA. It was an old IRA from a previous job and was just a small amount, so I decided just to take it as a taxable distribution instead of rolling it over. I showed it in Quicken as a transfer, but the discussion above made me realize that yes, it was actually income. So I tried the various options above. Here are my findings and solution:

    1. When trying to show the distribution as both a transfer and income (using both the "category" and the "transfer" fields in a split), the transaction would not show up in reports that showed the income category (I had the option to use "transfers" in the customize options turned off). And if I turned on the transfers in the report, it showed only the net amount after taxes, as that was all that is actually transferred into an account, so that did not work (plus it showed other transfers that were not income). And even further, it did not show the transfer as income under "Income: taxable IRA Withdrawal" in any report that showed income totals.

    Here is my solution to the problem. I created a split in the transaction with the category "Income: Taxable IRA Withdrawal" (which is a standard - even required - category) which matched the gross distribution amount. I then made an equal and opposite entry in the split and put it in a "fake" category that I only use to balance these transactions called "adjustments - do not show in reports". As you can tell, I never use it in reports, so it essentially disappears. This ensures that the total is zero for this "accounting adjustment"

    So the result is this: I have a transfer of the net amount to my checking account (or whatever account), I have an income amount (which is also is connected to a 1099-R) for the gross distribution, and I have the deductions for taxes in the tax categories.

    Complex, but it works for me.

    Glenn
  • brberro
    brberro Member ✭✭
    I am running 5.14.0 and each time I use Quicken it asks me to upgrade which I do and go through the install and update process and then when Quicken reopens its 5.14.0 - and the cycle repeats itself. How do I actually get the update to install?
  • RickO
    RickO SuperUser, Mac Beta Beta
    If the update is not installing from within Quicken, one thing you can try is to go to your account at www.quicken.com, download a fresh copy on your account page, and install that over top of your existing copy.
    Quicken Mac Subscription; Quicken Mac user since the early 90s
  • caram
    caram Member ✭✭✭
    @Quicken Marcus wrote:
    > Anyway, we are definitely going to add the option to auto-save tags, memos
    > and amounts to QuickFill. We've heard you. This will be released in
    > late February or early March.

    I normally upgrade as soon as a new release is available, but I'm happy this time I looked at the forum first and didn't. I will stay with 5.13 until at least 5.15 is released and users in the forum are mostly happy.

    BTW, it's a little annoying that QM constantly asks me to upgrade at each launch and there is no Skip button. I understand the team's desire that everybody upgrades as soon as possible, but I'd like the option to do it in my own time. I would hate to accept by inadvertence and be screwed with a release that does not quite match my needs or standards. And BTW it takes many button pressed to opt-out.

    As @smayer97 said, it's good that you remain accessible and responsive. This is important for me to keep faith in the product and renew.
  • caram
    caram Member ✭✭✭
    @Just Lurking wrote:
    > I'm curious as to some of the reasons? Is it a matter of certain FIs not
    > supporting automatic downloads nor manual file downloads?
    > Or past bad experience with incorrect or inaccurate downloads?

    I've been using Quicken and it's predecessors for 25+ years. Downloads were not an option at that time and Quicken made it easy to enter new transactions by typing only a few letters and updating the amount.

    I've been working this way ever since:

    - there may be errors in the bank and they're easier to detect if I enter transactions manually first

    - there may be duplicates in the bank

    - the bank label may be inaccurate or unobvious

    - I may have forgotten about the transaction if it's cashed in a while after the transaction occurred - typical checks

    - the transaction may never appear in the bank (does not happen as often as I'd like, but sometimes)

    - some accounts are not available for download. Cash is a typical example, but in my case also sometimes loan or some bank accounts.

    When download is available for an account, I use transaction matching and the downloaded balance to reconcile the account and spot any mistakes. Prior manual entry makes this a breeze. Similar to what @smayer97 said earlier.
  • Concordman
    Concordman Mac Beta Beta
    edited February 2020
    I am not yet dealing with IRA distributions but I have been taking distributions from an Annuity; I treat cash from the  annuity as a transfer  not new income . Hence it will only show up on the reports I use if I include transfers. Also shows up correctly under 1099-R in the Tax Schedule
  • John_M
    John_M Member ✭✭✭✭
    edited February 2020
    Thanks @glennmacc for that suggestion. I thought through this issue and can't come up with any better way of doing it for now. To confirm this for myself, I created a fake transaction to illustrate this.

    Of course, the first step is to have a Sell transaction in the IRA or 401(k) account to create a cash balance equal to the amount of the gross distribution (in this case, $4,000). The subsequent transfer transaction should be created in the receiving account (checking or money market) and have splits like those shown in the attachment below creating a net deposit (in this case, $3,000).

    One thing I noticed is that QW seems to have a better way to deal with this. There is a discussion where @Bob_L states, "You should also edit your IRA account and click on tax schedules. Set transfers out to gross taxable distributions." If there were some way of doing this from the investment account, then the Adjustment line would not be necessary.

    Finally, the moderators may wish to move this to another topic, since it doesn't deal directly with the topic "Quicken for Mac v5.14 Released."

  • glennmacc
    glennmacc Member ✭✭✭
    John_M: All exactly correct.
  • Quicken Marcus
    Quicken Marcus Administrator, Employee ✭✭✭✭
    Randy said:
    Hello

    Is there a way to turn off quick fill rules? I enter & download transactions on the go with the quicken mobile app and categorize them. Since the latest updates quicken desktop is changing my transaction categories & notes that I have already assigned once I sync.

    Thanks
    That shouldn't happen.  That sounds like a bug.  We'll investigate.
  • Quicken Marcus
    Quicken Marcus Administrator, Employee ✭✭✭✭
    Randy said:
    Hello

    Is there a way to turn off quick fill rules? I enter & download transactions on the go with the quicken mobile app and categorize them. Since the latest updates quicken desktop is changing my transaction categories & notes that I have already assigned once I sync.

    Thanks
    That shouldn't happen.  That sounds like a bug.  We'll investigate.
    I just tried this and wasn't able to reproduce it.  Can you provide more details?  Does it always happen?  If it happens only on some transactions, can you describe what might be unique about that change?  Are you doing any editing on the transaction in desktop before your sync with mobile?  Anyone else seeing this issue.

    QuickFill rules are synced to mobile so they should be being used when downloading transactions on mobile and they shouldn't overwrite the changes you made on mobile.  

    I guess if you don't want to use QuickFill rules you can delete all of them and then uncheck the QuickFill checkbox that appears over categories.
  • smayer97
    smayer97 SuperUser, Mac Beta, Canada Beta ✭✭✭✭✭
    Randy said:
    Hello

    Is there a way to turn off quick fill rules? I enter & download transactions on the go with the quicken mobile app and categorize them. Since the latest updates quicken desktop is changing my transaction categories & notes that I have already assigned once I sync.

    Thanks
    That shouldn't happen.  That sounds like a bug.  We'll investigate.
    ...

    I guess if you don't want to use QuickFill rules you can delete all of them and then uncheck the QuickFill checkbox that appears over categories.

    Truly? A user has to delete all their rules first? Why not just have the setting override and turn off QuickFill? Seems like overkill. After all, a user may simply want to turn it off only temporarily or may be experimenting with it on or off, etc.
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  • Quicken Marcus
    Quicken Marcus Administrator, Employee ✭✭✭✭
    smayer97 said:

    That said, I am not sure about one of your statements about the 80%. Though I question the accuracy of that statistic, it still demands the question, Is that to
    whom Quicken is catering the product?

    The vast majority of users of ANY product are only going to use a subset of features or even a feature will be used only partially. BUT there will ALWAYS be a large portion of users that use the more in-depth and richer features of a product. That includes Quicken.

    As such, I am not sure why Quicken does not take the approach that when a previously existing feature is being introduced, especially a previously well used and central one, that the full feature set of that function be developed. In the event that a feature is super complex, then I can appreciate it being delivered in stages. But in either case, when a feature IS delivered less than the original, first, you know you WILL get an outcry AND confusion. So at the very least, to head off such backlash, please consider including notes to highlight this so users are well informed and can take adequate action, either via work-arounds, or to simply not update and wait for a subsequent version.
    First off, I generally agree with you. We would typically NOT take away a feature that has been there forever but we don't make these decisions lightly or in the absence of data and information. Quite honestly, beta users played a huge role in our decision and I'm quite surprised at how many beta users in the forums are sounding as if they are shocked by this change. For those of you not in the beta program, we launched the Quicken 5.14 beta in November of last year without auto-saving tags, memos or amounts. In other words, this change happened for some people 2-3 months ago so it's not like we made this decision quickly and without input. We did a survey that a large number of beta users participated in and asked them what fields should be auto-saved with QuickFill. 19% said tags, 20% said memos and 20% said amounts.  We consider our beta users to be the most hardcore Quicken users and were actually shocked that such a small percentage of customers wanted these 3 fields saved since this had been the default behavior since the dawn of time.  We felt beta represented the high-end of these numbers and that the actual percentage would drop even further in the general population who were less Quicken rooted. Finally, we didn't hear an uproar from beta.  If there were tons and tons of beta users complaining about the behavior, we probably would have done something different.  Beta users, if you disagree with something, please let us know.  Your vote matters and we take it very seriously and the absence of any reaction is also a data point we use in our decisions.

    Quicken as a product and company won't survive if we don't try to refine the way the product works that is more in line with how new users expect it to work.  What we realized by the beta survey is that Quicken had been optimized for 20% of users and not 80% which seemed like a bad design decision. Now, we're not using the survey numbers as gospel but as a way to understand directionally where people are.  Let's say the survey was off by 20% that would still give results of 40% in favor of autosaving everything and 60% against. I don't think we can ignore that. Since we were building this feature from scratch, we felt it was a good opportunity to reflect and rethink if this was the behavior that made sense in today's world.  I know most understand this and are arguing that we should have provided an option for people who wanted to continue using it the old way. I agree. We're also looking for ways to cut down on the clutter of preferences and options making the product too complex for new users which means we will experiment sometimes to see if people really need an option or not.


  • smayer97
    smayer97 SuperUser, Mac Beta, Canada Beta ✭✭✭✭✭
    edited February 2020
    smayer97 said:

    That said, I am not sure about one of your statements about the 80%. Though I question the accuracy of that statistic, it still demands the question, Is that to
    whom Quicken is catering the product?

    The vast majority of users of ANY product are only going to use a subset of features or even a feature will be used only partially. BUT there will ALWAYS be a large portion of users that use the more in-depth and richer features of a product. That includes Quicken.

    As such, I am not sure why Quicken does not take the approach that when a previously existing feature is being introduced, especially a previously well used and central one, that the full feature set of that function be developed. In the event that a feature is super complex, then I can appreciate it being delivered in stages. But in either case, when a feature IS delivered less than the original, first, you know you WILL get an outcry AND confusion. So at the very least, to head off such backlash, please consider including notes to highlight this so users are well informed and can take adequate action, either via work-arounds, or to simply not update and wait for a subsequent version.
    First off, I generally agree with you. We would typically NOT take away a feature that has been there forever but we don't make these decisions lightly or in the absence of data and information. Quite honestly, beta users played a huge role in our decision and I'm quite surprised at how many beta users in the forums are sounding as if they are shocked by this change. For those of you not in the beta program, we launched the Quicken 5.14 beta in November of last year without auto-saving tags, memos or amounts. In other words, this change happened for some people 2-3 months ago so it's not like we made this decision quickly and without input. We did a survey that a large number of beta users participated in and asked them what fields should be auto-saved with QuickFill. 19% said tags, 20% said memos and 20% said amounts.  We consider our beta users to be the most hardcore Quicken users and were actually shocked that such a small percentage of customers wanted these 3 fields saved since this had been the default behavior since the dawn of time.  We felt beta represented the high-end of these numbers and that the actual percentage would drop even further in the general population who were less Quicken rooted. Finally, we didn't hear an uproar from beta.  If there were tons and tons of beta users complaining about the behavior, we probably would have done something different.  Beta users, if you disagree with something, please let us know.  Your vote matters and we take it very seriously and the absence of any reaction is also a data point we use in our decisions.

    Quicken as a product and company won't survive if we don't try to refine the way the product works that is more in line with how new users expect it to work.  What we realized by the beta survey is that Quicken had been optimized for 20% of users and not 80% which seemed like a bad design decision. Now, we're not using the survey numbers as gospel but as a way to understand directionally where people are.  Let's say the survey was off by 20% that would still give results of 40% in favor of autosaving everything and 60% against. I don't think we can ignore that. Since we were building this feature from scratch, we felt it was a good opportunity to reflect and rethink if this was the behavior that made sense in today's world.  I know most understand this and are arguing that we should have provided an option for people who wanted to continue using it the old way. I agree. We're also looking for ways to cut down on the clutter of preferences and options making the product too complex for new users which means we will experiment sometimes to see if people really need an option or not.


    Thanks for your candidness and transparency. It is appreciated. This incident goes to show that Beta testing has its limits and, from this example, it shows it is not conducive as a survey group to reflect the larger majority. Beta testing is better suited to sorting out bugs but not necessarily to determine what is most desired.

    And in this case, simple logic should have made it clear that the whole point of being able to change the first occurrence would often necessitate entering info that is unique from the rest of the scheduled series, and hence, that includes notes, tags, amount, date, even splits. As a matter of fact, I cannot think of a situation where one of these have not needed to be changed at one time or another. Anyway, glad to see there is some adjusting as a result.

    BTW, if you are concerned about advanced users vs not, you might consider creating an advanced section in the preferences for features you consider to be for the more seasoned users. I know you are aware but please remember that Quicken has a long history and many loyal customers, meaning they are very familiar with and use many features extensively. Let's not dumb down the product just to attract new customers (at the expense of seasoned ones). There are other ways to attract new customers without shunning the seasoned ones.

    Keep up the good work.

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  • Jeff B
    Jeff B Member ✭✭
    We can't pay our mortgage online. We have to write a check. Same with our real estate taxes. These are old school transactions that require physically printing out a check and mailing it. I reverted back to Quicken 5.13. Just generated another check, typed the first two letters of the payee - and all the information filled in - specifically the account number that needs to be in the "memo" of the check. Took less than a second. Without that "memo" field filling I have to go locate that information and copy it in every time.

    I'm worried that with Quicken 5.14.5 I'll still have to specify "fill in memo field" with every payee, that the default will be to leave it blank.

    For the supposed 80% of users who prefer to not have "memo" filled in - if it was blank before, it remains blank when you recall the transaction. If it's such a bear to have one time information appear next time, don't enter any information and it will remain blank. Otherwise I find with two clicks that text is deleted, vs a ton of clicks trying to retrieve the text I need to appear in that field.

    Will keep reading in the hopes it will be safe to upgrade. Right now I have to diligently click "ignore" through the upgrade messages that appear every time I launch Quicken.

    Quicken for Mac software has come a long way in the past few years, but removing this fundamental auto-fill capability is a stunning step backward. I presume none of the beta users print out physical checks. If you own a home and hire cleaning services, landscapers, contractors, pay taxes, etc - those are usually still paid with physical checks - that need to have the same info in the "memo" field every time. Please don't make writing those checks turn into a huge chore when it's been so easy all these years !
  • jacobs
    jacobs SuperUser, Mac Beta Beta
    @JeffB  Marcus, the product manager, has explained above that this behavior will be changed int he next version to accommodate the Quicken users who want the memo field carried forward from prior transactions.

    Meanwhile, for what you are describing -- where you want a static memo field to appear on a check every time -- this is easily achievable right now in the current version. Just go to Windows > Payees & Rules, click on QuickFill rules, locate your recurring payees, and edit the QuickFill rule (or create one) with the memo you want; it will then be filled in every time going forward.
    Quicken Mac Subscription • Quicken user since 1993
  • glennmacc
    glennmacc Member ✭✭✭
    JeffB:

    Also, things that are recurring (like a mortgage) can be set up as a recurring item and all of the notes and memos are retained in recurring items as far as I can tell (I still write some hard checks too, and they seem to have the memos retained).
  • glennmacc
    glennmacc Member ✭✭✭
    All,

    Has anyone else noticed this small quirk/new behavior? If you leave one account and come back to it later (even in the same session), the register reverts to show the earliest date, not the most recent. So every time I open my checking account I see checks from the 20th century. Not a huge deal, but scrolling down 20 years worth of checks is a small pain. And logically you would expect (and it always has been so) to default to the most recent entry. This just started in 5.14 as far as I can tell.

    Glenn
  • John_M
    John_M Member ✭✭✭✭
    @glennmacc I'm not experiencing this. If I leave one register and then come back to it, it's still on the top transaction (my registers are sorted by date with the latest at the top). If I close Quicken with a register open and then reopen the program, it starts on that register with the most recent transaction highlighted.

    Version 5.14.3 (Build 514.31897.100)
    macOS 10.15.3
  • glennmacc
    glennmacc Member ✭✭✭
    John_M, thanks for the feedback.

    I wonder if it is because I sort my register with the latest at the bottom. Maybe it defaults to the top no matter what the date.
  • Dennis@1
    [email protected] Member ✭✭✭✭
    glennmacc said:
    John_M, thanks for the feedback.

    I wonder if it is because I sort my register with the latest at the bottom. Maybe it defaults to the top no matter what the date.
    I sort mine with the latest at the bottom also and I'm not seeing this behavior you described above.
This discussion has been closed.