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Downloading transactions to a loan or HELOC account.

I have used Quicken for many years. In all this time, I have been frustrated with how it is not possible to download transactions from a bank or mortgage company to a 'Loan' type of account. I've been through many gyrations on how you can download the loan account transactions from the bank into a 'Line of Credit' type account. But I want to track this account as an amortized loan.

I can create a 'Loan' account type and Quicken does all the great things to calculate the payment schedule and use the what if tool to make an extra payment, keep track of the corresponding equity of the asset, etc. But you can't establish an Online Services link to the bank. Alternative, you can create a 'Credit' account type, which treats the account as a credit card. Now you can establish an Online Services connection. But you can't link it to a property/asset.

To address both functions, I have to create two accounts, a 'Loan' account, and a Separate 'Credit' account to track the loan.

Why has this never been addressed? I would like to see an account structure that is able to handle both operations. Is there some limitation that prevents this from happening? I think it would be a great improvement. Or am I missing some configuration that does this?

Answers

  • NotACPANotACPA SuperUser, Windows Beta Beta
    You CAN download the principal transactions to a Loan/Mortgage type account ... but the Interest portion and any Escrow amounts won't download with the principal ... AND in setting up a Loan/Mortgage (includes Auto) account for download, you lose ALL OTHER ability you might have to manage the account.  You won't even be able to view the transactions register.
    IF it's a true Mortgage, with a "determined at origination" amortization schedule, you can use Q's "Loan Wizard" to set up the mortgage. It's very accurate in calculating the principal/interest splits and you can add any escrow amounts to the transaction that it creates.
    IF it  doesn't have a pre-determined amortizaiton, then it's most likely a "daily interest" loan, where the amount of interest due for the next payment is partially determined by the day of the month that you make the mortgage payment.  If the loan is due on  the 1st, with a 10 day grace period, and you pay on the 10th ...  you pay MORE interest next month compared to if you had paid on the 1st.
    For a HELOC type account, where you can take multiple draws and pay varying amounts, there is a HELOC  type account in Q, that works much like a credit card account  ... because their receive and pay characteristics are so similar.
    Q user since DOS version 5
    Now running Quicken Windows Subscription,  Home & Business
    Retired "Certified Information Systems Auditor" & Bank Audit VP
  • John S.John S. Member ✭✭
    Thank you for your reply.

    > @NotACPA said:
    > You CAN download the principal transactions to a Loan/Mortgage type account ...

    Maybe it's my bank and not Quicken... From my bank I have closed escrow on an amortized mortgage loan with a fixed rate and term. When I ADD a 'Loan' type account in Quicken, and try to setup the connection as prompted, Quicken finds there is no 'Loan accounts found at <bank name> using username <MyUserName>'. If I setup a 'manual loan account' I can put all the loan terms in and Quicken will create the amortization schedule and all. But I can't establish the connection to download transactions any longer. Is there anything I can do about that?
    But if I try to ADD a 'Credit Card' type account I have at the same bank, Quicken finds that there IS a 'Line of Credit' type account corresponding to the loan.

    > @NotACPA said:
    >but the Interest portion and any Escrow amounts won't download with the principal ... AND in setting up a Loan/Mortgage (includes Auto) account for download, you lose ALL OTHER ability you might have to manage the account. 

    This is what I see in the 'Credit' type account that can download transactions from my bank. I don't have any Escrow amounts, but I do see that the interest portion is noted in the memo field, but not downloaded as an explicit transaction.

    > @NotACPA said:
    >You won't even be able to view the transactions register.

    In my case I can manipulate the transaction the same as other 'Credit' accounts. Could you be more specific about the account types and other settings that show this?

    > @NotACPA said:
    >For a HELOC type account, where you can take multiple draws and pay varying amounts, there is a HELOC  type account in Q, that works much like a credit card account  ... because their receive and pay characteristics are so similar.

    Yes, I can see that. I've had no issues with this type.
  • BKBK Member ✭✭✭✭
    > RE: Maybe it's my bank and not Quicken ...
    That seems to be the case where your lender perhaps does not have the most robust setup to Quicken.  You can always use a new blank Quicken datafile to do further troubleshooting on establishing the online download.  In the past 10 years, my mortgage has been sold three times and in all cases I was able to establish the online connection with the new lender and update using Quicken and link it to my House. That being said, it is not much use beyond the most primitive tracking as both you and @NotACPA already know.
    The way I track the loan details (to run Quicken reports) is via the checking account that I make the monthly mortgage payments from.  So when the debit transaction is downloaded to my checking account in Quicken (say $1000), I manually split that transaction into three parts: Principal ($900), Interest ($98), Extra Principal ($2) - where I obtain those detailed $ figures by going to my lender's website.  It is an extra step once a month.  Further, in order to somewhat automate this, I have that payment in my memorized payee list already split into three ways with proper categories and approx figures.  So when the debit transaction is downloaded to my checking account in Quicken, it is already split in three and categorized accurately, and I just have to adjust the two principal figures slightly each month.  Hope that makes sense.
    - Q Win Deluxe user since 2010, US Subs R28.24
    - I don't use Sync, Cloud, Mobile, Web, Bill Pay/Mgr
    - Techie, Win10 Pro x64 20H2
  • NotACPANotACPA SuperUser, Windows Beta Beta
    Your bank determines whether, and what, you can download at all ... not Quicken.
    AND, as I previously explained, downloading a non-HELOC loan is ill-advised.
    Q user since DOS version 5
    Now running Quicken Windows Subscription,  Home & Business
    Retired "Certified Information Systems Auditor" & Bank Audit VP
  • John S.John S. Member ✭✭
    Reply to BK: That is exactly how I track my loans in Q. But it would be nice if the transaction I can download to a Q 'Line of Credit' type account could be read by a Q 'loan' type. then I'd have the figures present in one Q account to resolve the transaction to the Q account.

    > @NotACPA said:
    > Your bank determines whether, and what, you can download at all ... not Quicken.AND, as I previously explained, downloading a non-HELOC loan is ill-advised.

    Why do you say that? At least in my case, my bank allows me to create an online connection to a 'Credit Card' type account. This allows me to download the transactions that contain info (in the memo field) that helps me update the 'Loan' account correctly.
    I have two account and the 'Credit Card' Q account is 'Separate' from my 'Loan account.
  • NotACPANotACPA SuperUser, Windows Beta Beta
    As I previously stated, and you even quoted, downloading to a non-HELOC loan is ill advised.
    And a credit card, while a liability, doesn't fall within the customary definition of a Loan.
    Q user since DOS version 5
    Now running Quicken Windows Subscription,  Home & Business
    Retired "Certified Information Systems Auditor" & Bank Audit VP
  • sandrade16sandrade16 Member
    So I have home loans and a personal loan. I was able to set up the home loans so that it upload transactions. They no longer have online access, but I can still see their registers. As for the personal loan, I was never able to set it up to automatically upload transactions, due to bank issues, however; now that the bank is allowing Quicken access, I can set up the account to connect to the account.
    So to see if it had to do to with a bank issue, I created a dummy personal loan account, and was able to connect to the bank. Unfortunately, the register is not available.
    Why can't Quicken just allow us to set up Loans like we do our bank and credit card accounts. It's ludicrous thatsywe are "blocked" from doing ths.
    I've been a Quicken user for decades, but I'm ready to try something different, something that will allow me to manage MY MONEY the way I WANT TO MANAGE IT! Luckily my subscription is ending soon. If Quicken doesn't fix this simple thing, I'm gone!
  • Tom YoungTom Young SuperUser ✭✭✭✭✭
    edited October 16
    If you have a regular amortizing loan then set that up as a "manual" loan using the Quicken loan "wizard" and have Quicken enter the upcoming payments in the checking Account as a "future payments" some number of days before payment is actually due.  That works fine for most people and you can see and affect the loan register in that situation.
    If you have a different type of loan, one that doesn't fit the "regular amortizing loan" mold, and the financial institution allows downloading of loan information into a Quicken Loan Account, then set up that loan as an "online-activated" loan.  You can still have Quicken enter upcoming future-dated payments in the checking Account, (or enter them manually), but you can't mess around with the loan's register in that case. 
    The assumption - probably correct most of the time - is that the financial institution is "feeding" that loan account correctly, properly entering principal decreases and increases as they occur.  You are still in complete control of "YOUR MONEY"; you decide when and how much to pay, you decide if you're going to borrow more, and how much.  I can't see how not having access to the loan's register affects anything, really, when it comes to managing your money.
  • John S.John S. Member ✭✭
    edited October 16
    NotACPA > @NotACPA said:
    > As I previously stated, and you even quoted, downloading to a non-HELOC loan is ill advised.And a credit card, while a liability, doesn't fall within the customary definition of a Loan.

    I appreciate the extensive experience you have with Quicken and how much you respond in this forum. I would like to explore your statement so that I better understand your knowledge of this aspect of Quicken.

    Downloading to a non-HELOC 'loan' type is not possible. Quicken does not even allow you to configure it. But as I see it, a 'Loan' type account and 'Credit' type account both have a register to enter transactions. When I setup the 'Credit' account to download transactions, I receive transactions that are, as far as I can tell, identical to what the 'Loan' type needs to track the loan, i.e, charges/interest, credits/payments/principal.

    So it seems that Quicken could be enhanced to enable a 'Loan' type account to download the transactions from the institutions and apply them correctly to the 'Loan' account. What am I missing that would prevent that? I can see that it might require some cooperation with the institutions to make it all work.
  • NotACPANotACPA SuperUser, Windows Beta Beta
    Downloading into many loan types is possible but other than HELOC's and LOC's it's ill advised because in doing so you lost ALL other ability that you have to manage the loan ... there's not even an account register that you can access.
    IF you can't download these other loans, perhaps it's because your bank doesn't permit such (the bank, and NOT Quicken, determines what account types can be downloaded).  The bank, and not Quicken even decides whether to support QWin, QMac, or both (some only support QWin).
    HELOC and LOC type accounts are significantly different from other loan types in that you can take additional draws on the account, and make irregular payments to the account.  Even thought they ARE loan accounts, they're set up in Q in a manner very similar to credit cards ... which they resemble more closely than a loan account.
    When I had a HELOC (I converted to a traditional mortgage a while back) my lender would download additional draws on the account and any payments ... but not the Interest component.  I had to enter that manually.
    RE: you setup, if you name the lender/bank, we can look into whether they allow the download of loan accounts into QWin.
    I'll see if I can find the rationale, posted by another SuperUser, for why downloads of Loans into Q is established in the manner that it is.

    Q user since DOS version 5
    Now running Quicken Windows Subscription,  Home & Business
    Retired "Certified Information Systems Auditor" & Bank Audit VP
  • NotACPANotACPA SuperUser, Windows Beta Beta
    @""John S."  Look at @Chris_QPW's comment at the bottom of this thread re: why there's no "loan register" for a downloadable loan account.

    Q user since DOS version 5
    Now running Quicken Windows Subscription,  Home & Business
    Retired "Certified Information Systems Auditor" & Bank Audit VP
  • Chris_QPWChris_QPW Member ✭✭✭✭
    Tom Young said:
    I can't see how not having access to the loan's register affects anything, really, when it comes to managing your money.
    Well that is just it, first off you can't see the details of what they are preventing the user from changing that might mess up things, so you can't really judge how "dangerous" it would be.  Second whether we like it or not it is in fact Quicken Inc's decision not ours.

    Power users like to judge at their level of what should be possible, and forget that the novice.  And Quicken Inc has to support the novice users, and they might feel that what might go wrong and what they would have to do to fix it, isn't worth it to them.

    Clearly when Intuit put this feature in they felt there was a risk, and did what they did.  Hiding the register obviously took extra work to do.  They wouldn't have done that if they felt there was no risk.
    (I'm using the latest Quicken subscription version)
  • John S.John S. Member ✭✭
    @NotACPA:
    I think we are talking about two slightly different accounts. Let me see if I can clarify what I see with what I understand you to be saying. How do you create a Loan account that doesn't have a transaction register?

    I have two loans from the same credit union. One is a car loan, the other is a fixed term Home Equity Loan. Both loans are fixed term and the Equity Loan has an amortization schedule established by the CU. When I setup the connection they connect as a 'Credit' type account. I can see if I were to create a HELOC account, it would behave like a 'Credit' type account. This would have an account register also. I can also create a 'Loan' type Quicken account and in this account Quicken will create an amortization schedule based on the terms I enter when the account is created. The account will have a transaction register, but no ability to establish a download connection. I can access the register by clicking on 'Payment Details' tab in the bar at the top of the account.

    So I'm not seeing how you create a Quicken account that doesn't have a transaction register.
  • Chris_QPWChris_QPW Member ✭✭✭✭
    edited October 17
    The "thing" that causes Quicken to hide the loan account register is if it is using the "loan download connection".

    I'm going to use the new dialogs that Quicken now has for adding an account if you aren't using the most recent version of Quicken you might still have the old dialogs, but they work the same, it is just easier to see with the new ones.

    Connected Account is selected, and you select a financial institution.


    Notice the separation here.  If you go down the Banking accounts path you are setting up downloading using the "normal/old" downloading.

    EDIT

    I'm changing this because I think I was answering the wrong question.
    To answer the question of how you get a loan account that is downloaded, and doesn't have a register you use the above steps.

    It is impossible to start with a manual entry loan account and activate it for downloading and therefore have a loan account without a register.
    (I'm using the latest Quicken subscription version)
  • Chris_QPWChris_QPW Member ✭✭✭✭
    edited October 17
    Wrong information, so deleted.
    (I'm using the latest Quicken subscription version)
  • thecreatorthecreator SuperUser ✭✭✭✭✭

    You wrote:" So I'm not seeing how you create a Quicken account that doesn't have a transaction register."

    They only way to set up an Account without a Transaction Register, is to set up the Account with Online Services Activated. You can't switch between the two Account Types, without starting over.


    thecreator - User of Quicken Subscription R30.10  USA & Quicken 2017 HBRP R20.5 USA
                       Windows 10 Pro 32 & 64-Bit Build 20262.1010
    also            Windows 10 Pro 64-Bit Build 19042.630

    View: https://community.quicken.com/discussion/7859218/work-with-copies-of-your-actual-quicken-data-files/p1?new=1

  • John S.John S. Member ✭✭
    edited October 18
    I started this reply last night but didn't post it. I am responding after seeing the post at 3:57am (??).

    @Chris_QPW:
    I really appreciate the detail you provided about setting up an auto update loan. After seeing your description of how to setup the auto update loan, I better understand what NotCPA was saying.

    This is the first I've heard about the auto update loan account you described. That explains why, when I was trying to setup my new Equity Loan, my CU return to Quicken the status that it couldn't find that type of loan. My CU apparently doesn't yet support this type of account in Quicken.

    So I had to set it up as a 'Credit' type account so I could download the transactions from my CU. My CU puts in the memo field the split between the principal and interest. I then did what I've done in the past, which is to create a second 'Loan' account marked as 'Separate' to track the amortization and payoff of the loan.

    So for me, if Quicken had not hidden the register and allowed the same editing of the scheduled transactions as the manual update loan, and accept download transactions from my CU, I would have been very happy with that.
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