QWin 2016 Premier: What is the difference between "One Step Update" and "Update Now" behind the scen

Perhaps asked and answered in the past but I was not able to find it.  I am a techie, long-time QW user and have US QW2016 Premier on Win10Pro w/ no major issues.  I would like to know what is the detailed/technical behind-the-scenes difference between "One Step Update" and "Update Now" and how each function interacts with the FI?  Why is "Update Now" less error prone and hence recommended over OSU?  Is the new 3rd party Awesomium browser used in both operations and to what extend?  At your convenience pls any and all info, pros and cons, personal experiences and opinions etc. is appreciated.  I just want to know and learn.  Thanks.

Comments

  • splashersplasher SuperUser ✭✭✭✭✭
    edited October 2018
    I can tell you one difference when the connection is Express Web Connect.

    OSU does a connection to the Quicken aggregation data server to retrieve the transactions and Update Now goes directly to the financial institution to get data just like it does during the initial EWC setup.  That is why doing an Update Now will sometimes fix a sick EWC connection.

    Another obvious difference is that OSU does all the accounts that are "checked" and Update Now is for one account only, but I think you had already figured that out.

    Here is an article that discusses the download methods: Connection Types
    -splasher  using Q since 1996 -  QW2016, 2017 & Subscription  -  Win7/Win10
    -Questions? Check out the  Quicken Windows FAQ list

  • BKBK Member
    edited October 2018
    So are you saying that even if I already have a DC setup for a particular FI, when I invoke OSU, that update request is re-routed thru the Quicken server, and acts as if it was EWC?  Hence I am not getting the direct/faster/secure DC benefit?
  • NotACPANotACPA SuperUser ✭✭✭✭✭
    edited October 2017
    BK said:

    So are you saying that even if I already have a DC setup for a particular FI, when I invoke OSU, that update request is re-routed thru the Quicken server, and acts as if it was EWC?  Hence I am not getting the direct/faster/secure DC benefit?

    if I already have a DC setup for a particular FI, when I invoke OSU,
    that update request is re-routed thru the Quicken server, and acts as if
    it was EWC?
    No.  DC always goes directly to the FI.  EWC, on initial  setup or on "Update Now", goes directly to the FI, but EWC invoked via OSU goes to Q  servers FOR THE EWC accounts.  Any DC accounts are always direct to the FI.
    Q user since DOS version 5
    Now running Quicken Windows Subscription,  Home & Business
    Retired "Certified Information Systems Auditor" & Bank Audit VP
  • QPWQPW Member ✭✭✭✭
    edited October 2017
    BK said:

    So are you saying that even if I already have a DC setup for a particular FI, when I invoke OSU, that update request is re-routed thru the Quicken server, and acts as if it was EWC?  Hence I am not getting the direct/faster/secure DC benefit?

    No Splasher was talking about what Express Web Connect does, not Direct Connect.

    Direct Connect is never routed through the Quicken/Intuit servers.

    But it is possible that Update Now can help Direct Connect problems for a different reason.

    One thing that Direct Connect needs from the Quicken servers is the URL to contact at your financial institution.  It updates this periodically, but I believe that Update Now might force getting it again (I don't know if that is true for sure).  For sure there is a process to force the updating of that information through the Online Center, and the last step in that process is Update Now.

    But it is really Express Web Connect that "benefits" from doing a Update Now when there are problems.
  • QPWQPW Member ✭✭✭✭
    edited October 2017
    BK said:

    So are you saying that even if I already have a DC setup for a particular FI, when I invoke OSU, that update request is re-routed thru the Quicken server, and acts as if it was EWC?  Hence I am not getting the direct/faster/secure DC benefit?

    BTW I'm 99% sure that Direct Connect doesn't use Awesomium for making connections.  It still used "embedded IE".

    That was sort of proven when we found that Vanguard has "cookie problems".
    And the workaround is to log in to their website using IE.  That stores a cookie that doesn't expire for years.  And that in turn allows One Step Update with Vanguard to work, because the "embedded IE" picks up and sends that cookie when first making the connection to Vanguard.

    Note it had to be IE, not just any web browser.  That is because every web browser has their own ways of storing cookies, they are not shared.

    That is why each web browser is considered a different "device" when you log into a site that allows you to set it as a trusted "device".
  • QPWQPW Member ✭✭✭✭
    edited October 2017
    BK said:

    So are you saying that even if I already have a DC setup for a particular FI, when I invoke OSU, that update request is re-routed thru the Quicken server, and acts as if it was EWC?  Hence I am not getting the direct/faster/secure DC benefit?

    One more BTW I'm not sure this is 100% accurate:
    OSU does a connection to the Quicken aggregation data server to retrieve
    the transactions and Update Now goes directly to the financial
    institution to get data just like it does during the initial EWC setup. 
    It is my belief that Quicken doesn't have the code to deal with talking to the financial institution directly when the connection type is Express Web Connect.

    Direct Connect is a set protocol that was clearly coded into Quicken.
    Express Web Connect was layered on top of this.  As in for the most part Quicken thinks of Express Web Connect as just another Direct Connect conversation.
    The difference being that it is now talking to the Intuit server instead of the financial institution.

    The "magic" of Express Web Connect is handled on the servers.  As in the servers know what scripts to run for each financial institution, and then translate that back into the OFX/QFX protocol that Quicken understands.

    So the main difference in Update Now with Express Web Connect isn't "who" it talks to, it is the conversation non interactive or interactive.

    As in does the Intuit server actually talk to the financial institution at that point or not and relate it back to Quicken, or if it relies on the connection/data it made during the nightly update.
  • BKBK Member
    edited October 2017
    BK said:

    So are you saying that even if I already have a DC setup for a particular FI, when I invoke OSU, that update request is re-routed thru the Quicken server, and acts as if it was EWC?  Hence I am not getting the direct/faster/secure DC benefit?

    Great.  Thank you all.  So when does Awesomium come into the picture, if at all?  And if not, what is the role of Awesomium?
  • QPWQPW Member ✭✭✭✭
    edited October 2017
    BK said:

    So are you saying that even if I already have a DC setup for a particular FI, when I invoke OSU, that update request is re-routed thru the Quicken server, and acts as if it was EWC?  Hence I am not getting the direct/faster/secure DC benefit?

    Well that turns out to be a very complicated question since no one at Quicken Inc is spelling it out.

    Sometimes it is pretty clear like when you do something that creates an "embedded web browser window".  As in say your connection type is Web Connect and up do Update Now that will start the web browser for you to log in (this is something that the people using the Canadian version do a lot since the financial institutions that support Express Web Connect are very limited, and none support Direct Connect).  That web browser is definitely Awesomium.

    And it is certainly used for the "tips  tutorials" tab.
    And most likely most of the new "web pages" like the MorningStar X-Ray portfolio.

    It isn't used for the Tax Planner probably because it uses ActiveX to communicate with the core Quicken.

    It is certainly being used for prompts like the Quicken/Intuit Id.

    I'm not sure about if it is used for Express Web Connect or not.

    Basically it was brought in to the picture because of the concern that Microsoft is dropping IE and not supporting it "well", and that means "embedded IE" too since that really just calls to the "back end libraries" of IE.  The statement was that they are concerned about "security", which would be true if it isn't kept up to date.
  • BKBK Member
    edited October 2017
    BK said:

    So are you saying that even if I already have a DC setup for a particular FI, when I invoke OSU, that update request is re-routed thru the Quicken server, and acts as if it was EWC?  Hence I am not getting the direct/faster/secure DC benefit?

    Clear as mud, just kidding!  Thanks again.

    I can tell you with
    reasonable certainty that Vanguard no longer requires cookies in the traditional IE for
    Quicken's OSU to work.  I have not used IE for couple of years and I always remove all visible access to it (short of disabling it) so I would not accidentally launch it.  I did a fresh install of my machine (OS, etc.) three months ago so I'd remember if I used it.  I also know I have not used Edge since I reinstalled my OS.  And all of my OSUs
    work including Vanguard.  Just FYI.  So must be the embedded IE.
  • QPWQPW Member ✭✭✭✭
    edited October 2017
    BK said:

    So are you saying that even if I already have a DC setup for a particular FI, when I invoke OSU, that update request is re-routed thru the Quicken server, and acts as if it was EWC?  Hence I am not getting the direct/faster/secure DC benefit?

    Here is a long thread on the Vanguard problem:
    https://getsatisfaction.com/quickencommunity/topics/downloads-from-vanguard-not-always-working
  • BKBK Member
    edited October 2017
    BK said:

    So are you saying that even if I already have a DC setup for a particular FI, when I invoke OSU, that update request is re-routed thru the Quicken server, and acts as if it was EWC?  Hence I am not getting the direct/faster/secure DC benefit?

    Funny since I had the EXACT same problem at the same time (2 months ago, 2 separate Vanguard logins, one getting an error with OSU more than half the time).  I didn't do anything, just ignored it and it went away on its own after 10-14 days!  Just now I tried to launch IE and it was its first time ever since it wanted to go thru that initial setup (I cancelled) and ditto w/ Edge.  Therefore those two browsers have not yet been fully initialized/launched on my system.  And thanks for the info.
  • QPWQPW Member ✭✭✭✭
    edited October 2017
    BK said:

    So are you saying that even if I already have a DC setup for a particular FI, when I invoke OSU, that update request is re-routed thru the Quicken server, and acts as if it was EWC?  Hence I am not getting the direct/faster/secure DC benefit?

    Maybe Vanguard actually fixed the problem, I never really verified that.
  • BKBK Member
    edited October 2017
    BK said:

    So are you saying that even if I already have a DC setup for a particular FI, when I invoke OSU, that update request is re-routed thru the Quicken server, and acts as if it was EWC?  Hence I am not getting the direct/faster/secure DC benefit?

    I have new info for you QPW.  I just turned off IE completely from "Windows Features" on a another machine that had never used IE nor Edge (Program & Features > Turn Windows Features on or off).  Left with FF and Edge but Edge has never been launched.  Not a single browser on this machine has ever logged into any of my FIs (my kids old laptop that I freshly installed Win10Pro few months ago for a rainy day but never used).  Installed Q2016 today for the first and 6th time + R14 update (you recall the details) and created a new data file under a brand new QID with my Vanguard accounts and all updated.  Next I fed my entire data file to it and all updated fine.  I don't want to get into any discussions about IE as this two minute testing does not support any conclusions.  I realize the IE files are still on the machine.  Just thought to share this with you if someday you become curious.

    Also Security (or lack of) comes to my mind since if I tried to access most of
    my FIs via any browser on that new system, they'd have to send me a code, sms
    etc. but not via Quicken's new data file!  Cheers.
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