Why does Quicken remove minus sign in a "reminders" final amount?

If I edit a quicken reminder, and it turns out to be a "negative" payment.... FOR EXAMPLE, the split lines might look like:
service payment .... $50
refund for equipment returned $-100
net payment $ -50

When such a split occurs, Quicken automatically changes the net payment to +50. This causes an incorrect split (which is -50), and so quicken adds an UNCATEGORIZED expense of +100 to make up for it.... so what I edited was splites of +50, -100... but what quicken ends up with is +50, -100, +100... for a net of plus 50, whereas the net was supposed to be negative 50.

Answers

  • NotACPA
    NotACPA SuperUser, Windows Beta Beta
    What does the Amount field in the parent transaction look like.  It should be a deposit of $50 ... because a negative payment is a credit/deposit.
    Q user since DOS version 5
    Now running Quicken Windows Subscription, Home & Business
    Retired "Certified Information Systems Auditor" & Bank Audit VP
  • ColdGranite
    ColdGranite Member ✭✭
    That is exactly what is SHOULD be.... a deposit.
    But I am not sure what you mean by "parent" transaction????.

    This is a reminder which repeats monthly, and normally looks like:
    services..... $50
    rental..........$10
    Net payment $60

    and is "entered" monthly like that, with maybe some minor amount edits.

    But this time, there is going to be a deposit.... So I "edit the reminder" (all instances" so that I can get at the splits), and add a split line for "refund".
    So now I want to have:
    services ... 50
    rental....... 10
    refund .... -110
    net payment: MINUS 50 (a refund deposit, as you rightly state)

    But when that edit is done, and I am ready to "save" the reminder, quicken puts up a popup that says " I am going to make this a plus, not minus ", and then it adds the uncategorized split for plus 100 to make the net at PLUS 50, not minus.

    The idea is, next month, I would edit all instances AGAIN, this time taking out the refund, and then its good to go forward.

    I would edit "this instance only", but when you do that, you only get the net amount and you don't get access to the splits, which is also dumb. But thats another issue and the work-around is to always edit "all instances"., so I don't care.
  • jrich75
    jrich75 Member ✭✭✭✭
    edited February 22
    When you edit the splits, any disparity between their total and the reminder total would show as a new split, below all the others, without a category or description.  To delete that number you need to adjust the split total using the button in the split window to get the reminder total to equal the sum of the splits.  
    Actually, if you were to edit just this instance so that the total is what you want, Quicken would add an uncategorized split equal to the disparity (the refund in this case).  You could then just edit the entered transaction to include the category & description of the refund.  If you have preferences set to notify you of uncategorized transactions, Quicken should ask you if you want to categorize it before completing the entry.
    Quicken user since 1995
    Win10 Deluxe Subscription thru 2021
  • Sherlock
    Sherlock SuperUser ✭✭✭✭✭
    That is exactly what is SHOULD be.... a deposit.
    But I am not sure what you mean by "parent" transaction????.

    This is a reminder which repeats monthly, and normally looks like:
    services..... $50
    rental..........$10
    Net payment $60

    and is "entered" monthly like that, with maybe some minor amount edits.

    But this time, there is going to be a deposit.... So I "edit the reminder" (all instances" so that I can get at the splits), and add a split line for "refund".
    So now I want to have:
    services ... 50
    rental....... 10
    refund .... -110
    net payment: MINUS 50 (a refund deposit, as you rightly state)

    But when that edit is done, and I am ready to "save" the reminder, quicken puts up a popup that says " I am going to make this a plus, not minus ", and then it adds the uncategorized split for plus 100 to make the net at PLUS 50, not minus.

    The idea is, next month, I would edit all instances AGAIN, this time taking out the refund, and then its good to go forward.

    I would edit "this instance only", but when you do that, you only get the net amount and you don't get access to the splits, which is also dumb. But thats another issue and the work-around is to always edit "all instances"., so I don't care.
    Quicken thinks it's being helpful...

    I suggest you enter the reminder and edit the transaction in the register.  If you need the transaction as a reminder, right-click on the transaction and select Add Reminder.  


  • NotACPA
    NotACPA SuperUser, Windows Beta Beta
    The parent transaction is what appears in the transaction register ... before you split it and input the various child (aka, split) amounts.
    Q user since DOS version 5
    Now running Quicken Windows Subscription, Home & Business
    Retired "Certified Information Systems Auditor" & Bank Audit VP
  • ColdGranite
    ColdGranite Member ✭✭
    > @jrich75 said:
    > When you edit the splits, any disparity between their total and the reminder total would show as a new split, below all the others, without a category or description.  To delete that number you need to adjust the split total using the button in the split window to get the reminder total to equal the sum of the splits.  
    > Actually, if you were to edit just this instance so that the total is what you want, Quicken would add an uncategorized split equal to the disparity (the refund in this case).  You could then just edit the entered transaction to include the category & description of the refund.  If you have preferences set to notify you of uncategorized transactions, Quicken should ask you if you want to categorize it before completing the entry.

    I know all that....
    But the problem is that quicken CHANGES THE TOTAL... from a negative to a positive.... even though I DONT WANT IT TO. THEN, to make the splits work out, it adds an uncategorized split (as you state) that I don't want. Quicken makes two wrongs, and two wrongs do NOT make a right.
  • ColdGranite
    ColdGranite Member ✭✭
    > @NotACPA said:
    > The parent transaction is what appears in the transaction register ... before you split it and input the various child (aka, split) amounts.

    This is not a transaction register issue. This is the REMINDER transaction which you edit with the little "edit" button to the right of the reminder listing. From the "tools" - "Manage Bills & income Reminders" menu item.
  • ColdGranite
    ColdGranite Member ✭✭
    > @Sherlock said:
    > Quicken thinks it's being helpful...
    >
    > I suggest you enter the reminder and edit the transaction in the register.  If you need the transaction as a reminder, right-click on the transaction and select Add Reminder.  

    I can edit the reminder transaction, then let Quicken screw it up like it does, then "enter" it into the register, then edit the register transaction to make it correct.

    That does not alter the fact that Quicken is altering my edit of the reminder incorrectly, and that should be fixed!!!
  • ColdGranite
    ColdGranite Member ✭✭
    I am new to this forum.

    Do we know that Quicken people lurk here?
  • Sherlock
    Sherlock SuperUser ✭✭✭✭✭
    > @Sherlock said:
    > Quicken thinks it's being helpful...
    >
    > I suggest you enter the reminder and edit the transaction in the register.  If you need the transaction as a reminder, right-click on the transaction and select Add Reminder.  

    I can edit the reminder transaction, then let Quicken screw it up like it does, then "enter" it into the register, then edit the register transaction to make it correct.

    That does not alter the fact that Quicken is altering my edit of the reminder incorrectly, and that should be fixed!!!
    If you want Quicken to allow us to change the sign of a bill reminder, I suggest you post an idea. 
  • jrich75
    jrich75 Member ✭✭✭✭
    So is this the message you are seeing?

    If so, it must be a bill reminder and Quicken assumes it should be a positive payment. The easy solution is as @Sherlock suggests.  Edit the transaction after it has been entered.  
    Quicken user since 1995
    Win10 Deluxe Subscription thru 2021
  • GeoffG
    GeoffG SuperUser ✭✭✭✭✭
    If the net affect of a reminder is income, sure sounds like an income reminder to me. Even if it is an expense with an intended refund.
    user since '92 | Quicken Windows Premier - Subscription | Windows 10 Pro version 21H1
  • ColdGranite
    ColdGranite Member ✭✭
    > @jrich75 said:
    > So is this the message you are seeing?
    >
    >
    > If so, it must be a bill reminder and Quicken assumes it should be a positive payment. The easy solution is as @Sherlock suggests.  Edit the transaction after it has been entered.  

    Yes, that is the message.
    But the message is more innocuous than what goes on behind it.
    1. the actual amount is changed
    2. an additional unwanted uncategorized split is added.

    WHY?
  • ColdGranite
    ColdGranite Member ✭✭
    > @Sherlock said:
    > If you want Quicken to allow us to change the sign of a bill reminder, I suggest you post an idea. 

    Just to be clear:
    I don't want to be "allowed to change the sign".
    I want Quicken to NOT change something that I have entered.
  • jrich75
    jrich75 Member ✭✭✭✭
    I am new to this forum.

    Do we know that Quicken people lurk here?
    There are Quicken moderators that chime in sometimes but most responses are from other users.  Moderators don't lurk, they post as @Quicken xx, but they also don't have a direct influence on what gets changed or corrected.  

    Anyway, there are two types of reminders, "Bills" and "Deposits or other scheduled transactions".  The assumption is that bill reminders are for payments and are entered as positive numbers that result in deductions from the payment accounts.  Other reminders can be either positive or negative (Deposits/withdrawals to payment accounts, etc).  So, I'm guessing that negative bill payments just do not make sense to Quicken, there is not an actual deposit occurring to your payment account.  If you are issued a refund check, then there is a corresponding deposit when you process it.  For a biller, the money just stays with them as a credit balance or they issue a separate credit to the credit card account which again would be a separate transaction.  As I say, I'm just another user so this is just a guess as to "Why"?



    Quicken user since 1995
    Win10 Deluxe Subscription thru 2021