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YTD Total returns in Portfolio View don't agree with Brokerage.

My YTD total returns in Portfolio View don't agree with my Vanguard Performance returns for the same periods.
They agree with T. Rowe Price and Fidelity but never with Vanguard. My Vanguard statements agree with the performance numbers on Vanguards site.
Anyone else having issues with performance YTD not in agreement with your brokerage statements

Answers

  • Jim_Harman
    Jim_Harman SuperUser ✭✭✭✭✭
    Exactly what column(s) are you looking at in the portfolio view to see the YTD returns, and how much are the returns off by?
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  • Gary R
    Gary R Member ✭✭
    Return Year to Date-----They are off by a lot----Not even close----I've called Vanguard and they have no idea why Quicken is off.
    Like I said, my other brokerage statements agree.
  • Jim_Harman
    Jim_Harman SuperUser ✭✭✭✭✭
    edited July 2020
    Let's use the exact names of the columns, because there are similarly named columns and it gets confusing otherwise.

    The Return (%) YTD column is based on data downloaded from Quicken's quote provider as of the last time you updated quotes. It assumes distributions were reinvested and does not reflect Buys or Sells you have made during the year. If this does not match the return for the security on Morningstar's website for example, there is a problem with the quote feed. Please identify the security(s) if this is the case.

    The ROI (%) YTD shows the straight percentage gain or loss of your investments - not annualized, not including compounding, and includes the impact of your Buys and Sells and any distributions you have received  IMO this is Quicken's best measure of short term performance and generally matches the YTD numbers reported by FIs.

    The Av Annual Return (%) YTD is the annualized IRR for your investments. This is the same calculation as the Investing Performance report. It assumes your YTD performance will continue at the same rate for the rest of the year, not necessarily a good assumption. If you set the As of date for the portfolio to 12/31, it assumes the performance will be flat for the rest of the year. This generally matches the ROI(%) YTD quite closely.
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  • Gary R
    Gary R Member ✭✭
    Jim---Thanks for taking the time to try and troubleshoot this issue--I really do appreciate it.
    I'm not using any percentages----Just the total Return Amount.
    I like to compare my total investment returns to my brokerage statements to see if they agree. Like I said, they are good to go when comparing Fidelity and T. Rowe Price. Unfortunately, Vanguard is way off and never even close.
    Simple example would be Vanguard Roth for June--Total Return is -$1000. Quicken Total Return for June would be -$300?????????????????????
  • Jim_Harman
    Jim_Harman SuperUser ✭✭✭✭✭
    Please provide the exact name of the column you are looking at in Quicken and the name of the corresponding data on the Vanguard website.
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  • markus1957
    markus1957 SuperUser, Windows Beta Beta
    I believe there is an error in the way that column is computed but that it is not necessarily related to Vanguard.  The description of the Return YTD field indicates it should match the results of an Investment Performance report.

    I cannot get a total dollar match in Quicken between the Return YTD column added to the Portfolio view and the dollar difference in the Investment Performance report customized to show only one account.

    Best I can tell, the Investment Performance report displays and computes the correct values.  The dollar difference in the report does not match the value shown in the Return YTD column in the Portfolio view for any account except one. The exception account had no activity during the period so only beginning and ending market values come into play.  I doubt this is related to Vanguard, but rather to the type of activity taking place; the Portfolio view column is not being computed correctly.  I couldn't readily discern any specific type of transaction causing the discrepancy.
  • Gary R
    Gary R Member ✭✭
    Jim:
    Investing Tab, Portfolio, Customize columns, Return Year to Date (Return YTD)
  • Gary R
    Gary R Member ✭✭
    Markus:
    I just went to Reports and clicked on Investing, Investing Performance. The report shows Investments of $309,130, Returns of #311,414 or 2284 return.
    However, YTD Return in my Portfolio view shows $2816 YTD Return.
    Vanguard shows YTD returns of $3575
    This is really nuts!!!!
    I have a feeling that Vanguard is the winner----
  • Jim_Harman
    Jim_Harman SuperUser ✭✭✭✭✭
    Whether the Return YTD column is being computed correctly is related IMO to the long-standing discussion of the Amount invested column. You have to study the definitions of these columns carefully (not helped by the fact that they are defined differently in different places in Quicken) to decide whether the numbers presented are useful to you.

    In my experience Amount Invested and Return are useful mainly as components of other performance measures, ROI for example, and not by themselves.

    For more info please search "Amount Invested" in the in-product help 
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  • Gary R
    Gary R Member ✭✭
    Jim:
    Amount invested YTD shows $562063, market value $248,107, REturn YTD $2816 in Portfolio View. Honestly, no idea how Quicken came up with $562063---what a joke-----My original question was simply why REturn YTD does not agree with Vanguard. I'm just wondering if I will be wasting my time calling someone from tech support from Quicken to troubleshoot this.
  • Jim_Harman
    Jim_Harman SuperUser ✭✭✭✭✭
    Also @Gary R are you looking at individual securities or at the account level return?

    If account level, you may want to review this discussion
    https://community.quicken.com/discussion/comment/20097732#Comment_20097732
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  • markus1957
    markus1957 SuperUser, Windows Beta Beta
    For each of my accounts at Vanguard, website Personal Performance selected by Account, matches to the dollar, the difference between the Returns and Investments columns in the Quicken Investment Performance report.

    To the extent any of the Vanguard transactions are fee related, that takes special handling in Quicken.

    My taxable Vanguard account which only had Sells and cash distributions matches the Return YTD value.

    My IRAs which include Roth Conversions do not match.  It appears to me that Vanguard and the Quicken report are using market value at time of conversion whereas Return YTD appears to be using the original cost basis of the removed/added shares to calculate return.  Arguments can be made on both sides for either use case.
  • Gary R
    Gary R Member ✭✭
    Marcus:
    I have four separate accounts at Vanguard. I just matched up three and they actually agree. I used the Investment report like you said and it worked for three accounts. One account is off by $1281. I went over all transactions YTD and compared them to all transactions in Vanguard. I can't find the difference.
    Thanks for all your help. I never used the investment report under reports in Quicken. I always relied on Total Return. It looks like Total return works in some cases and not in others.
  • Gary R
    Gary R Member ✭✭
    BTW---My other two Brokerage accounts, Fidelity and T. Rowe Price in Quicken agree with Return Year to Date and Reports Investment Performance to to $$$$$
    Now, if I could just figure out why Vanguard one account is off by $1281
  • markus1957
    markus1957 SuperUser, Windows Beta Beta
    Any Add or Remove shares transactions in the account that won't match?
  • Gary R
    Gary R Member ✭✭
    No
    I checked every transaction twice and just can't put my finger on it--
    But you really helped me big time--I've been using Quicken for years and never looked at the report--Investing performance----Thanks for your help and time.
  • Jim_Harman
    Jim_Harman SuperUser ✭✭✭✭✭
    Are you sure there are no hidden Placeholders in the problem account? That can cause all sorts of confusion. Go to Edit > Preferences >Investing transactions and make sure Show Hidden Transactions is checked.
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  • Gary R
    Gary R Member ✭✭
    OMG---------------------------Holly Crap!!!!!!!!!!!!!!!!I've spent the entire afternoon trying to figure this mess out. I printed out 12 pages of statements from Vanguard for 1/1/2019 and 7/12/2020. I compared every entry.
    I found the discrepancy and now the return figures agree to the penny.
    YOU WILL NEVER BELIEVE WHAT THE ISSUE TURNED OUT TO BE--
    The closing price of Apple per Vanguard was off $10 a share compared to Quicken price on 12/31/2019. I edited the price in Quicken and that made everything agree. I just don't believe it---Finally issue was resolved.
  • Jim_Harman
    Jim_Harman SuperUser ✭✭✭✭✭
    Was the 12/31 Apple price missing in Quicken's price history originally? If a price is missing it uses the last price it has.

    You can have missing price history entries if you update quotes less often than monthly, because the historical price downloads switch to weekly and eventually to monthly intervals. The weekly interval can lead to confusing performance numbers because Q is missing the month end numbers.
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This discussion has been closed.