Wells Fargo direct connect bill pay

denmarfl

Searching for a bank now that Bank of America has stopped direct connect. Have been looking at Wells Fargo who still offered direct connect and Bill pay, both free. I have open the checking, it is authorized for direct connect and Bill pay. As I add my payees and quicken I see most of the payees are 4 to 7 Days lead time. I created a couple at the Wells Fargo website which I knew were electronic and they are 2 days the time. How does quicken determine the lead time when you're not even connected to the bank as you create the Bill pays in quicken? So for now what concerns me is the five to seven lead time on all my payments using quicken with Wells Fargo

Mark1104

the lead time has nothing to do with quicken.... it has to do with the Bank process.  I can only speak for BofA, but I suspect other large banks do similar.

for 'critical mass' payments, think local utilities, mortgage companies, etc., BofA send an electronic payment to the Biller - there is no traditional paper check placed in the mail.  The biller simply gets an electronic  file with everyone's payments for that day - given the size of BofA in your community and a utility that could be a LOT of payments.  Those are the ones that are two day lead time.

But for the "small fries' where there are just a few payments - maybe your dentist or a tradesman, those are still sent via paper check and the US mail. they have 5 day lead times to account for the mail time as well as the processing time to create the check and for the post office to pick it up from company that manages all this for the BofA and others. 

the risk of moving to Wells (and I will admit my bias), is that Wells will also move to EWC+ in the near term.  They just have too many other issues to deal with in the mean time.  

my comments are based on using the BofA Billpay system via their Online Banking app /website NOT using  quicken's billpay from within quickem

Frankx

Hi @denmarfl,

The lead time for bank online bill pay (i.e Direct Connect bill payment through Quicken AND payment via a bank's website) is actually not set by Quicken but by the individual banks.  But please keep in mind that there is difference between payment times, between those payments that are entered using Quicken for Wells Fargo bill payment, and those that are - in your words - "created ... at the Wells Fargo website".  Typically those that are created within Quicken have a longer lead time than those that you enter on the bank's website.

Hope this helps to explain lead time issue, but the main lesson (especially when dealing with a brand new bank account) is to learn the lead time for each type of transaction - i.e they differ if you are using Quicken to submit the payment versus using the bank's website to do so. 

Let me know if you have any additional questions.

Frankx  

mshiggins

Frankx said:

Hi @denmarfl,

The lead time for bank online bill pay (i.e Direct Connect bill payment through Quicken AND payment via a bank's website) is actually not set by Quicken but by the individual banks.  But please keep in mind that there is difference between payment times, between those payments that are entered using Quicken for Wells Fargo bill payment, and those that are - in your words - "created ... at the Wells Fargo website".  Typically those that are created within Quicken have a longer lead time than those that you enter on the bank's website.

Frankx  

Can you cite an authoritative reference for the statement that lead times for a given payee are different depending on whether the payment is initiated from Quicken or from the FI website?

Mark1104

@mshiggins - .  

1) call Wells and ask them what the lead times are when using THEIR Billpay system. 
2) compare that to what Quicken states 

that is your authoritative reference. 

mshiggins

Mark1104 said:

@mshiggins - .  

1) call Wells and ask them what the lead times are when using THEIR Billpay system. 
2) compare that to what Quicken states 

that is your authoritative reference. 

I don’t bank with Wells Fargo so doubt they will give me the time of day.  I am using QW2017 so have not downloaded any transactions or paid any bills via Quicken since April 2020. 

I’ve been using Quicken for 20+ years and reading about Quicken on the various iterations of Quicken forums for almost as long. In all that time, I don’t recall ever seeing or reading that lead times are different for payments initiated via Quicken than for payments initiated on the FI website. It sounds like hogwash to me. But I’ve been wrong before so would like to see an authoritative reference stating how the lead times work.

denmarfl

mshiggins...CiTi Credit card; this is an Electronic payee.  Created this payee at Well fargo Online Site....lead time shows 2 days.  Created it in Quicken, it shows 4 days.

Mark1104..I have spoken to Wells fargo who by the way unlike BofA, they have a unit that is called Quicken and their agents know about Quicken and how it works.  When however I asked the questions, why different Lead times, I got that is a Quicken thing you need to soeak to Quicken.

I suspect, as it is with Truist (Truist connects with DirectConnect), Bills sent to Wells fargo via Quicken are processed by a 3rd party Contractor..but the Wells fargo Agent could not, or would not confirm.  The Truist Agent did confirm they use a 3rd party contractor to Pay bills sent via Quicken, but those entered at their site they process.  There is also Lead times differences at truist...Citi Bill, 2 Day if entered at the website via Quicken, 5 days if sent via Quicken.... 

Mark1104

@denmarfl - as I recall, all the large banks may all use the same 3rd party processor.  (I used to work at BofA and they certainly use a 3rd party).  It may be the same firm that runs Zelle - I don't remember the history any longer.  (the company behind Zelle is owned by the largest banks in the country, including BofA, Wells, Trusit)

Why does the lead time matter to you?  If you want to bill paid on let';s say November 30 and the Wells Bill Pay system says it's a 2 days lead (Nov, 28) and Quicken says it's a 4 day lead (nov 26), it's not important when the 'train leaves the station', it's important "when the train arrives'.,,, and both payments arrive at the same time.

I can only speak for BofA, but the funds don't leave your account until the check clears, not when the payment "leaves the station" in case that is why the lead time is important to you.  Let me know, I am curious.

mshiggins

Frankx said:

Hi @denmarfl,

The lead time for bank online bill pay (i.e Direct Connect bill payment through Quicken AND payment via a bank's website) is actually not set by Quicken but by the individual banks.  But please keep in mind that there is difference between payment times, between those payments that are entered using Quicken for Wells Fargo bill payment, and those that are - in your words - "created ... at the Wells Fargo website".  Typically those that are created within Quicken have a longer lead time than those that you enter on the bank's website.

Hope this helps to explain lead time issue, but the main lesson (especially when dealing with a brand new bank account) is to learn the lead time for each type of transaction - i.e they differ if you are using Quicken to submit the payment versus using the bank's website to do so. 

Let me know if you have any additional questions.

Frankx  

A data point to refute your assertion that lead times differ when the payment is initiated from within Quicken vs. initiated on the FI website:

I checked my BofA online payee lead times in Quicken and on the BofA website. 

- The internal to BofA payees, like my BofA credit card and BofA mortgage, are 0 days lead time in Quicken and on the BofA website.
- The electronic payment capable payees, like Citibank and Chase credit cards, are 1 day lead time in Quicken and on the BofA website. 

- The payees that need a check mailed show 3 day lead time in Quicken and 5 day lead time on the BofA website. 

My Quicken info is from April 2020 when QW2017 was sunsetted. I am presuming the slow down in postal mail since that time would explain why the payees needing a check mailed now have a longer lead time. The internal payees and electronic payees have matching lead times. 

My conclusion is not all FIs have different payment lead times if the payment is initiated in Quicken vs. initiated on the FI website. 

denmarfl

BofA Creating Payees are different than Wells fargo and Truist.  If you try to create a BofA Payee which of course you cannot anymore, but whrn you could.....you would get a Popup that alerted you that you could ONLY create a Payee at the BofA Website...after which it downloaded into Quicke.  That is why Lead times at BofA were always the same at the Website and in Quicken.  With Wells fargo and Truist, you MUST create payees in Quicken because Payees that you may create at Wells fargo or truist online WILL NOT download into Quicken.  What boggles my mind is, when you create a Payee either at Wells fargo or Truist, the Quicken software KNOWS the Lead times for that Payy and sets the Lead times.  Even as between truist and Wells fargo in Quicken, laed times are different for the same payee.  

Mark1104

@denmarfl -so just out of curiosity, how many BillPays do you do in a month? As I have posted elsewhere, Billpay is in declining use as there are so many othe ways to make payments these days than there were 25 years ago:  1) credit cards - so many more billers accept them than years ago , 2) auto-debit, 3) pay at the biller's website (credit or debit card), 4) Zelle.

I only make maybe 1 BillPay every 90 days! where I used to make a heck of a lot more years ago.  

is it time to pivot to other payment methods (e.g. #1, 2,3 oir 4 above)? and make the few that remain from the Bank's website? (I've never understood the benefit of doing them from the Quicken side).

denmarfl

I pay about 15 bills a month through banks bill pay.  I don't like to use credit cards because I want any one to debit any of my accounts. I don't pay at a website again for the same reason, I don't want anyone to have my checking account number. I never thought about Zelle.  It can be used to pay many bills such as credit cards, electric, cable, etc?


Also, using quicken to pay my bills I have all my financial records saved on my computer. But Zelle is a possibility if it'll work to pay my bills I pay even though it means I would the financial history in my computer

Mark1104

@denmarfl - things to thing about

1) using a credit card at another website is protected transaction by federal law, if there is any fraud the Bank is responsible for it by law.  I can only speak for BofA but they are VERY good about that. they will provide automatic credit if there is an issue.  in 20 years I have never had a problem. 

2) every time you write a check, you are giving the other person your checking account number.  it's printed on the bottom of the check (called the MICR line). Don't kid yourself! it has been that way for over 100 years.  Computers and the internet didn't change that.  

Even if you change banking to Wells or Truist, you are probably going to run into EWC+ in the not to distant future and have the same problem as you are now having with BofA.  That is because this switch is occuring for security reasons, which is a big issue with the Banks.  When one does it, the regulators begin asking why the others are not doing it.  It just a matter of time until Wells and Truist move in this direction. 


All I can say is 'times are a changing' and that makes using BillPay harder.... might be worth a "pivot'? 

denmarfl

Thanks; all you have written is true...but, just going thru the process when your CC is compromised is time comsuming and aggravation.  For me its about not putting myself in the postion for all that to happen.  Happy Thanksgiving Day