Hidden accounts no longer available for transfers?

smvl808

I'm using QMac. I have previously scheduled bills including splits with transfers going to hidden accounts that worked no problem until recently. The scheduled bill still is setup for the correct transfers to hidden accounts but now only marks them as uncategorized and I can no longer find these accounts in the category/transfer drop downs. I just read the "?" description of the difference between separate and hidden and I'm still confused but it seems maybe I have to use "separate" to reestablish these transfers and then deal with the consequences however they may vary between hidden and separate. Is that correct? Thank you!

jacobs

Could you perhaps explain what you're trying to accomplish, and maybe we can then give you some suggestions. Typically, accounts you mark as hidden would be for non-active accounts which are closed or long-term dormant. So I'm curious why you're making active transfers to an account yet wanting it to be hidden. 

Separate accounts are an entirely different thing: accounts you want to track outside your personal finances. Examples of this might be accounts for a child or a parent, or other things which are not part of your net worth. Note that within Separate accounts, accounts can be visible or hidden.

smvl808

Thank you @jacobs . I use it for various open accounts that I don't want to see on my primary open account list. for example: cellphone installment payment accounts (tracked as liabilities, reduced each month), cellphone trade in credits owed to me paid out monthly (tracked as cash, reduced each month), accounts at banks that are open but always at 0 balance, ira account funded once a year for roth conversion, cash account (to track physical cash). I don't want to see these accounts mixed in with my every day checking/savings/credit accounts. I also do use the separate accounts for family members various accounts as you mentioned and don't want that section clogged up either. Until a very recent update, I had no trouble transferring from an active account (not hidden or separate) to a hidden account. I guess if this is no longer possible, open to suggestions.

Jon

Hidden accounts may no longer show up in the suggested list but if you type in the full account name it will still accept the transaction. I was able just now to set up a scheduled transfer to a Hidden account.

smvl808

Thanks @Jon . The scheduled transfers (done via splits) still exist and show the correct hidden accounts, but when they are matched to downloaded transactions, all those transfers to hidden accounts are now recorded as uncategorized. I wonder if I hate to recreate them or type the names as you suggest to get them working again.

Jon

I'm not sure if recreating the scheduled transactions would help if it's changing the categorization when it matches them.  I don't know what to do about that (other than fixing them by hand after the fact).

jacobs

@smvl808 Thanks for the explanation. While I understand your intent, I guess I would disagree with hiding non-zero accounts, because then your net worth as shown isn't correct. An "account at banks that are open but always at 0 balance" seem fine to hide, but your petty cash account or cellphone liability/loan account I personally wouldn't hide. Hidden accounts are intended to be out of sight and out of mind, not used for active transactions. 

That said, I just tried hiding one of my accounts, and then entering a transaction in another account with a transfer to the hidden account. It worked. Quicken wouldn't let me type the transfer account name in the Category field, but it was accepted in the Transfer field. You have to type the full account name, exactly, since it is hidden from the pop-up list. (The Transfer field will show the red "invalid transfer" arrow until you tab out of the Transfer field.) 

[EDIT: I was testing and typing while Jon posted his reply above. Sorry for the duplication.]

jacobs

@smvl808 Wait, are you saying that the Transfer transaction or split doesn't allow you to have a category on it? If so, that is by design. Transfers as not expenses, and therefore should not have categories. A Quirk in the history of the development of Quicken has allowed users to in some cases apply a category and a transfer to the same transaction, but that's really a violation of accounting rules, and it causes odd problems with reports which aren't programmed to expect transfers to have categories. The Quicken team has said it would remove the capability to have category + transfer transactions a while back, but they haven't made such a change; perhaps there was something in the latest release which started to close that loophole. 

Sorry, I can't test this with downloaded transactions and matching. If the scheduled transaction is working correctly, you may simply need to un-match the downloaded transaction and delete it, leaving the original scheduled transaction with your transfer.