nav[aria-label="Primary Navigation"] { padding: 0; & ul { list-style: none; width: 100%; display: flex; flex-direction: row; justify-content: start; align-items: start; gap: 30px; padding: 0; & li { margin: 0; } & ul li { list-style: none; } } }

Any hope to get proper Fidelity 401k sources? Before vs After Tax Roth sources.

mikek753b

hello Quicken,

I had asked about this already a few times since Fidelity 401k plans started with multiple Sources like Before Tax, After Tax, Roth.

The issue is that Quicken downloads from 401k all regardless of Tax type and as result all go as Before Tax or Tax deferred. This is completely wrong.

I have about half for Tax deferred and Roth after tax contributions, the same for my wife 401k account as well.

Is there any hope that Quicken will properly support modern 401k plans?

Thanks.

Find more posts tagged with

Windows

Accepted answers

All comments

Chris_QPW

You are not going to like it but Quicken has nothing to handle that situation. In fact, I don't even think that the protocols used for downloading transactions have that kind of information in it.

EDIT: The more I think about it, it seems like it isn't even possible in a Quicken account even if Quicken could somehow know what kind of transactions these were. The difference between a traditional 401K and a Roth one would have to be done at the account level because that is the level Quicken decides to treat taxes.

mikek753b

Maybe Quicken can talk to Fidelity about 401k and make Fidelity to add something, the Source ID or Name.
In other Finance software I've updated Roth portion amount, which is used to split for Tax Differed and Roth (Tax Free) my linked account. Sure I do it manually from time to time. But, its better vs nothing IMHO.
The 401k is very specific to Fidelity implementation, as Fidelity inside tracks 5 sources for my single 401k account.
In Quicken I can't set Roth portion.
I only can move some funds to another local Roth account to track Roth, but that is not easy. Also, reconcile fails due to that.

Chris_QPW

Your best bet would be to talk to Quicken Support. Personally, I think it is a failing of how Fidelity treats the accounts.

https://www.quicken.com/support#contact-support

mshiggins

@mikek753b

I did a lot of non-standard things with my Fidelity 401(k) in Quicken. Some due to being on an older Quicken version that no longer has transaction downloading and some because I just don’t like how the paycheck to 401(k) account process works in Quicken.

One thing I did that might help you is I created separate securities for the Roth shares and the traditional shares. They were both for the same target date fund and used the same symbol, so share price imports worked for both securities.

Sceptic

@mikek753b there are several different components that come together to create the 403b account you have. In order to do this, your retirement plan provider, Fidelity has several separate systems that interface with each other. The two main components are:

A Trust/Custodial system that holds the consolidated security positions for all the retirement plans they administer.
A participant recordkeeping system that holds participant information and the individual accounts for each participant by fund and source.

There could be other ancillary systems and databases as well. All these systems interface with each other to create your retirement account. Keeping these systems updated and reconciled daily is an involved process.

While I understand the desire to see contribution-source information in Quicken, that type of data is generally maintained by the retirement plan administrator as part of the participant recordkeeping system. Quicken's focus is on personal financial management and account tracking rather than serving as the official recordkeeper for retirement plan administration details such as contribution sources, vesting, and employer-match accounting.

That being said, in order for Quicken to be able to provide source information, Fidelity would need to send Quicken participant recordkeeping information, which will never happen for various reasons.

mikek753b

@mshiggins
would you provide those steps I can follow? please.
Do you have in your Quicken clear understanding for 401k before and tax free portions?
Did you create extra fake Roth account type to transfer shares from connected 401k account? Or something else?
Thanks

mikek753b

all I'm asking Quicken as minimum to add the "Roth Value".
Which I can update at will.
This will allow me to know and track my Roth or Tax Free total across 401k accounts with Roth IRA accounts.
So I know our total Tax Free Value.
The best to track Tax Free Value over time, so Quicken record time of the Roth Value changes.

I understand that Fidelity might not provide all info via transactions for any reasons.
But, I ask for my manual way to type those Sources values per 401k account.

Sceptic

@mikek753b Just to make sure we're using the same terminology, it sounds like you're looking for the current value of Roth assets rather than Roth basis?

Where would this "Roth Value" field or bucket reside in Quicken? If it is manually updated, what would the number represent, and where would the user obtain the information?

Retirement plan providers such as Fidelity typically maintain the official accounting for the various money sources within a retirement plan, so the most accurate source for those balances would generally be the provider's records and statements.

Would the user pull the Roth value from their online account or statement and then manually update this field in Quicken? If so, what advantage would that provide over viewing the source information directly from the plan provider?

Chris_QPW

Quicken has no concept of the source other than the account itself. One might try using tags but I don't believe you can't put tags on all the different kinds of transactions that are in an investment account. The same goes for using a memo and then filtering a report with either the tag or the memo.

if these were all manually entered then I could see doing things like maybe giving the Roth transactions different security names and then filter by security. On the other hand if you're doing this manually then you would just use separate accounts. But when you're trying to use the automatic downloading and Fidelity is just going to mix them up there isn't going to be a simple way of doing this.

in a way this is sort of like when a financial institution decides to combine two sub credit card accounts into one downloaded account. There just isn't any way to tell them apart. But at least with the credit card transactions you could use tags or memos manually.