Dataset Confusion - between Desktop QMac vs creating data from Q on Web or Mobile App

quidster

Hello,

I recently purchased the Deluxe subscription. The Quicken website suggested I try the Web service, indicating that my data would sync down to the desktop application.

So, I went ahead and added a few bank accounts with Quicken Web. After installing the desktop app and signing in, I was dismayed to see that my data was nowhere to be found.

Afterward, I returned to Quicken Web and found that the data I had previously entered was now gone as well.

Or, so it seemed.

As it turns out, one can have multiple datasets associated with their Quicken profile. After starting up Quicken Desktop for the first time, it had created a new data-set (call it data-set that then synced up to Quicken Web.

Where it gets confusing is that data-set B became the primary data-set and so is shown by default on Quicken Web. However, Quicken indicated that it's fine to build up a profile starting with Quicken Web. So, why isn't that data-set (data-set A) my profile's primary?

There's zero communication to the user that any of this is occurring; it's broken and should be fixed ASAP. Of course, it's too late for that, because Quicken was made aware of this problem at least as early as March 2021.*

It's a bit late here. My grammar's not the best at the moment. Basically, my questions are these: 1) why hasn't this been fixed, and 2) is there a workaround?

Thanks!


* https://community.quicken.com/discussion/7890154/sync-from-quicken-on-the-web-to-newly-installed-quicken-desktop-mac

volvogirl

I don't know anything about your question but you screen shot shows your personal info like name and email.   You should redact that.  This is a public user forum and the whole world can see it and try to scam or spam you.  Or contact you and say they are from Quicken.   

quidster

Thank you volvogirl. I flagged my own post. Hopefully a mod will take care of that; apparently, my account is too new to edit my own posts.

Quicken Jared

quidster said:

Hello,

I recently purchased the Deluxe subscription. The Quicken website suggested I try the Web service, indicating that my data would sync down to the desktop application.

So, I went ahead and added a few bank accounts with Quicken Web. After installing the desktop app and signing in, I was dismayed to see that my data was nowhere to be found.

Afterward, I returned to Quicken Web and found that the data I had previously entered was now gone as well.

Or, so it seemed.

As it turns out, one can have multiple datasets associated with their Quicken profile. After starting up Quicken Desktop for the first time, it had created a new data-set (call it data-set that then synced up to Quicken Web.

Where it gets confusing is that data-set B became the primary data-set and so is shown by default on Quicken Web. However, Quicken indicated that it's fine to build up a profile starting with Quicken Web. So, why isn't that data-set (data-set A) my profile's primary?

There's zero communication to the user that any of this is occurring; it's broken and should be fixed ASAP. Of course, it's too late for that, because Quicken was made aware of this problem at least as early as March 2021.*

It's a bit late here. My grammar's not the best at the moment. Basically, my questions are these: 1) why hasn't this been fixed, and 2) is there a workaround?

Thanks!


* https://community.quicken.com/discussion/7890154/sync-from-quicken-on-the-web-to-newly-installed-quicken-desktop-mac

Hello @quidster,

I am sorry for any confusion you may have experienced, and I thank you for asking about this here on the Quicken Community. 

In order to view your data, you would simply switch back to the first data file that you had been working with in the Mobile App. To do this, you would go to Profile in the lower menu of the app and then a window with your name at the top should appear. You should then be able to see a list of the names of data files you have under a bolded heading, often Finances. At this stage, you would select the previous data file you had been working with from the list.

Let us know if you have any additional questions or concerns, or if you notice anything unusual while attempting these steps.

Thanks,

Quicken Jared 

quidster

Hi Jared, thank you so much for your assistance. Real quick aside, I want to clarify that my OP was supposed to say "dataset B", not "dataset " not sure how that happened. Anyway, it definitely wasn't meant as a joke!

Before my OP, I hadn't tried Quicken Mobile. This morning, I installed it onto my iphone and followed your instructions. I have to data files to choose from (let's forget the whole "A", "B" thing): "Christopher's Finances (web)" and "Christopher's Finances". However, this did not cause Quicken Desktop to switch to Christopher's Finances (web)".

"Christopher's Finances (web)" is the name I gave to the data file created on Quicken for the Web. "Christopher's Finances" is the one that was created when I selected the "scratch" option when starting up Quicken Desktop for the first time. Curiously, there is no option to continue with Quicken for the Web data.

Going back to Quicken Mobile, "Christopher's Finances (web)" was interpreted by the app as the default; I saw the data generated on Quicken for the Web right away.

With that said, I couldn't select "Christopher's Finances" on Quicken Mobile, because the says I need to enable "Quicken mobile access." This, however, was already done in Quicken Desktop.

Perhaps this setting has to be done for each data file? If so, there's no way for me to select the "Christopher's Finances (web)" file in Quicken Desktop (from what I can tell, at least it's not in Application Support folder).

I've attached screenshots that make clear that these two data files are at least "known" to each of the three apps (Quicken Desktop, Quicken Mobile, and Quicken for the Web).

I guess the crux of the issue is that there is no obvious way to me to select "Christopher's Finances (web)" in Quicken Desktop.

Halp, please. Thank you.

PS: If this is simply a bug with no horizon for fixing, it might be simpler to abandon my work and startover with the Desktop. If it is a bug, Quicken should not be telling new customers that they can start with Quicken for the Web!

Ps56k2

@quidster -

Just to clarify - think of everything related to Quicken as being anchored in the Quicken desktop software....

The Quicken APP and Quicken On The Web feature merely use the desktop software and the Quicken Cloud to display a mirror of your "selected" Quicken Accounts..... NOT the other way around -
It always begins with and is anchored by the desktop Quicken software and your datafile.

https://www.quicken.com/support/what-quicken-cloud

Quicken Jared

quidster said:

Hi Jared, thank you so much for your assistance. Real quick aside, I want to clarify that my OP was supposed to say "dataset B", not "dataset " not sure how that happened. Anyway, it definitely wasn't meant as a joke!

Before my OP, I hadn't tried Quicken Mobile. This morning, I installed it onto my iphone and followed your instructions. I have to data files to choose from (let's forget the whole "A", "B" thing): "Christopher's Finances (web)" and "Christopher's Finances". However, this did not cause Quicken Desktop to switch to Christopher's Finances (web)".

"Christopher's Finances (web)" is the name I gave to the data file created on Quicken for the Web. "Christopher's Finances" is the one that was created when I selected the "scratch" option when starting up Quicken Desktop for the first time. Curiously, there is no option to continue with Quicken for the Web data.

Going back to Quicken Mobile, "Christopher's Finances (web)" was interpreted by the app as the default; I saw the data generated on Quicken for the Web right away.

With that said, I couldn't select "Christopher's Finances" on Quicken Mobile, because the says I need to enable "Quicken mobile access." This, however, was already done in Quicken Desktop.

Perhaps this setting has to be done for each data file? If so, there's no way for me to select the "Christopher's Finances (web)" file in Quicken Desktop (from what I can tell, at least it's not in Application Support folder).

I've attached screenshots that make clear that these two data files are at least "known" to each of the three apps (Quicken Desktop, Quicken Mobile, and Quicken for the Web).

I guess the crux of the issue is that there is no obvious way to me to select "Christopher's Finances (web)" in Quicken Desktop.

Halp, please. Thank you.

PS: If this is simply a bug with no horizon for fixing, it might be simpler to abandon my work and startover with the Desktop. If it is a bug, Quicken should not be telling new customers that they can start with Quicken for the Web!

@quidster,

Thank you for continuing to work with me on this, and for being so patient.

In order to change the data file on your desktop version of the app, you would go to File > Show "(file name will be here)" in Finder via the upper menu at the top of the screen while Quicken is open. You should then be shown where the files are stored on your desktop computer and you can select between them there. You can also check File > Open Recent in the same menu, as well.

Let me know if any further clarification is needed, as I am happy to help.  

Thanks, 

Quicken Jared 

Ps56k2

I have updated the topic title to better reflect the actual Q&A -

AND also added QMac to focus on the MAC version.

quidster

Thank you for updating it, @Ps56k2

> @Ps56k2 said:
> @quidster -
>
> Just to clarify - think of everything related to Quicken as being anchored in the Quicken desktop software....
> The Quicken APP and Quicken On The Web feature merely use the desktop software and the Quicken Cloud to display a mirror of your "selected" Quicken Accounts..... NOT the other way around -
> It always begins with and is anchored by the desktop Quicken software and your datafile.https://www.quicken.com/support/what-quicken-cloud

This is definitely a helpful, um, "visual." And, it goes someway to explaining why the financial data I input originally into Quicken for the Web is, I suppose, obfuscated in Quicken Desktop. I'm not even sure it's there, but there is at least a reference to it in the "Cloud Accounts" tab in Quicken Desktop.

You're welcome, Jared. I'm actually familiar with this storage directory. It's "$HOME/Library/Application Support/Quicken/Documents/" for me.

This directory, however, only contains the file created by Quicken Desktop -- "Christopher's Finances".

Referring back to the "Cloud accounts" list in Quicken Desktop, I just noticed that "File Name" is listed as "unknown" for "Christopher's Finances (web)".

If there's a bug, it would be good if we could find out.

Summary of the problem:
One who starts their Quicken adventure with Quicken for the Web, and who then subsequently uses Quicken Desktop does not have desktop access to the data input into Quicken for the Web.

If we could get some confirmation of this, it would go a long way toward fixing the problem. From what I've gleaned from the mac forum, I'm not the only one contending with this issue.

Thank you.

Greg_the_Geek

You can't input financial on the web first. You MUST create the desktop data file first and then sync it to the Quicken cloud. I never understood why you can create data on the web without a desktop data file.

quidster

@Greg_the_Geek , it seems that is so. If that is the design, why does Quicken tell new users otherwise?

Greg_the_Geek

I have no idea. It seems strange to me as well.

quidster

OK, well, that's that, I suppose. [Removed-Speculation]

Ps56k2

quidster said: I recently purchased the Deluxe subscription. The Quicken website suggested I try the Web service, indicating that my data would sync down to the desktop application.

So... where does it suggest this....
Sort of like they don't tell you to put gas in a car to drive it - they just guess that you will...
Why would they even offer a desktop software program install - if all you needed was a web browser or smartphone App ?

Chris_QPW

I have seen other threads on this subject and there are definitely something very screwy about it.

It seems that if somebody first goes to either Quicken On The Web or Quicken Mobile App - and starts entering data it'll create a data set and allow this. But the moment that you go to the Quicken Desktop and Sync - it will create another data set, and the original data set will get orphaned.

And from that point on it's impossible to create data sets that are not connected to the desktop data file.

And as such, any long-term user can't even test this.

I sort of wonder if it's tied in with their Simplifi product.
This is clearly a bug.

Ps56k2

Chris_QPW said:  It seems that if somebody first goes to either Quicken On The Web or Quicken Mobile App - and starts entering data it'll create a data set and allow this. But the moment that you go to the Quicken Desktop and Sync - it will create another data set, and the original data set will get orphaned.

So - you purchase Quicken and create a brand new Quicken User ID - QID-A -
and then go to Quicken on the Web or Mobile App - and sign in -

Since there is nothing... Quicken "services" creates a new dataset - DS1 - to be  associated with QID-A.....
Now have a pairing of QID-A + DS1.

Next, go install the desktop software, and sign in with your User ID - QID-A ....
Why would DS1 not be seen & used ... the mystery of Quicken Sync & Cloud ?

Chris_QPW

Ps56k2 said:

Next, go install the desktop software, and sign in with your User ID - QID-A ....
Why would DS1 not be seen & used ... the mystery of Quicken Sync & Cloud ?

Because the Quicken Desktop data file is the “master” in the sync relationship.
It doesn’t expect to “connect to an existing one”.

Remember that the connection between the Quicken Desktop data file and the Quicken Cloud dataset has two parts.
First is the Quicken Id, but there is also the unique Id for that data file.  You need both to connect the two.

Clearly when first starting out and it lets you create a Quicken Cloud dataset, it is impossible for it to “know” the unique Id of a Quicken Desktop data file that has yet to be created.  So, I assume it creates some unique Id, but there isn’t anyway that it could be connected to the Quicken Desktop data file at a later time.

What’s more it is important to understand why the Quicken Desktop data file is the master.  It has far more information in it than the Quicken Cloud dataset has.

And to show how strange this is, remember that normally you can’t create accounts in Quicken Mobile/Web.  The normal process is to create them in the Quicken Desktop data file, and then sync to the the Quicken Cloud dataset.

When first starting out it seems that not only does it create a dataset out of the blue, it allows you to add accounts, which shouldn’t even be part of the GUI!

Ps56k2

Chris_QPW said: It doesn’t expect to “connect to an existing one”.

It's an interesting program dev discussion... but we will never know - and as mentioned - the only way to test it out is with a brand new valid QID - that hasn't created any desktop software installations or QDF files.