Bug: Transfer to Account

Hornman5659

When I set up a Transfer to Account transaction, once I've tabbed to Select Account, if I hit the Down Arrow, I get an error message stating No "Transfer to Account" Selected. However, I'm unable to clear this error message by clicking on OK, or by hitting Return, Escape, or any other key or key combination. I also can't quit the program, causing me to have to Force Quit. This has happened every time I hit the Down arrow (presumably, the same problem would occur with any other arrow key as well).

What would be nice, and what I have hoped the arrow key would allow me to do, is to be able to use the Down arrow key to navigate to my preferred destination account - this is the only part of this transaction box that I have to use a mouse on, owing to the fact that I have more than one account name that begins with the same words.

jacobs

First question: are you using Quicken Mac? Your question is in a Quicken Mac section, but some of your terminology doesn't seems to match exactly with Quicken Mac.

But if you are on Quicken Mac, then please take a step back and let us know what type of account you're entering this transaction in (checking? credit card? investment?).

You say you "set up a Transfer to Account transaction"; could you provide additional description of what you're doing. There is not a separate type of transaction for a transfer, but perhaps you're just using that name to describe what you're attempting to do. So next, please clarify if you are tabbing to the Category column or the Transfer column.

Hornman5659

Yes, I'm using Quicken for the Mac, and I'm using Transfer Shares to move shares from one brokerage account to another. I start by hitting Command-N to create a new transaction. I type in the date, then tab to the transaction type and type T to select Transfer Shares. I confirm that selection by then tabbing down to where I enter the name of the security (at this point, I'm only moving one security at a time). I type in enough of the security name for the full name to appear. I confirm that by tabbing again, which then takes me to Transfer to Account. This is where I get into trouble if I hit the Down arrow key instead of using my mouse to click on Select Account and select the account I want to move the shares to.

Hornman5659

By the way, there's another bug in regard to transactions, at least in Brokerage accounts - if I create a new transaction, then click Cancel, Quicken leaves an empty transaction in the Transactions list, which I then have to separately select and delete. It would be nice if clicking Cancel would just make the transaction disappear.

jacobs

Hornman5659 said:

By the way, there's another bug in regard to transactions, at least in Brokerage accounts - if I create a new transaction, then click Cancel, Quicken leaves an empty transaction in the Transactions list, which I then have to separately select and delete. It would be nice if clicking Cancel would just make the transaction disappear.

Yes, this is true in all registers, investment and banking, in Quicken Mac. The developers don't consider it a bug, though; it is, as the engineers say, "working as designed".

I thought there was an existing Idea thread (request for change/enhancement) regarding this, but I just did a search and didn't see one — so I created a new one about this. Please take a few seconds to visit this Idea topic and add your vote by clicking the little arrow in the yellow box.

jacobs

Hornman5659 said:

I'm using Transfer Shares to move shares from one brokerage account to another.

Ah, thanks for clarifying; I originally thought you were talking about transferring money from one account to another.

I tried following your steps, and after I select the Security and press Tab, it takes me to the Shares to Transfer field. I can't get Tab to take me to the Transfer to Account field. If I click on the Transfer to Account field, I can use the down arrow to highlight the account I want, and then press Enter to select that account. So I can't replicate the problem you've described.

It seems unlikely, but I wonder if there is a difference in the Tab order depending on Mac operating system? I've tested on Mojave and Catalina, but don't have a Mac running Big Sur or Monterey. what version of macOS are you running? Otherwise, I can't figure out how you are tabbing into the Transfer to Account dropdown menu.

Hornman5659

Monterey. And yes, for me, after I enter the name of the security, pressing Tab first takes me to the transfer all securities radio button (I forgot that it did that when I wrote my previous posts), then pressing Tab a second time highlights Select Account. Currently, as I alluded to earlier, I have two destination accounts that have mostly the same name, except for the last few characters. Previously, when I was working with a different source account that went to the first of these two destination accounts, once I tabbed to Select Account, I could type the first letter of the desired account, then Tab from there to the Share Number box to confirm my selection. I assume I can do this in my current circumstance, but it's faster in this case to click and select the account I want rather than type its name, so I then go ahead and click on the Share Number box as well.

jacobs

So what you describe is that the Tab order takes you to all fields on the screen, including those with radio buttons and dropdown choices. I can't get it to do that.

Ah, I think I figured it out: I think this is a setting you have set in macOS. It may be slightly different in Monterey, but here's what it looks like in Mojave in system Preferences > Keyboard >Shortcuts:

 

At the bottom, do you have it set to "All Controls"? If so, and you change it to Text boxes and lists only, I suspect you'll no longer tab into the Transfer One/All securities radio button field or the Transfer to Account field.

I changed mine to All controls and repeated trying to enter the Transfer shares transaction. Now, I'm able to tab through the Transfer One/All securities radio button field, and when I land on the Transfer to Account field, I clicked the down arrow. That resulting in this dialog popping up:

And then I was stuck. Pressing Okay just causes it to try to save the transaction which calls up the same dialog box. I can't cancel the transaction. I can't select the dropdown list with a mouse. I can't do anything other than repeatedly press OK. The only way out for me now is to Force Quit. (And after doing a Force Quit, it took two minutes for Quicken to open my file on re-launch; I'm guessing it was doing some sort of database consistency check; I've never seen that before.)

I think this the same as what you described, correct? And it definitely seems like a bug. I don't think the programmers coded for the possibility someone would land on their field via the keyboard. Please take a moment to use Report a Problem on the Help menu to document this problem. I'll do so as well. Hopefully a few reports will get them to replicate the problem and enter it as a bug in their database. I'm guessing this will be assigned a pretty low priority, unless they view it as a crashing bug. 

Hornman5659

Glad you were able to reproduce the issue. My Keyboard preferences pane doesn't have the choice between Textboxes And Lists Only and All Controls. I have only a single option, Use Keyboard Navigation To Move Focus Between Controls. Apparently this is roughly the equivalent to All Controls in Mojave and earlier. I've unchecked that and will see how the keyboard behaves. I'll also report the bug using Report a Problem, which is probably what I should have done in the first place. I tend to think first about reporting bugs through the website rather than directly in the program itself.

jacobs

It's usually good to report a problem here to ask if others are seeing the same thing as you. It sometimes helps isolate issues, such as problems that occur only with one specific operating system, or in this case, isolating it to a system keyboard preference setting which is required to encounter the problem. Without details like this, if you use Report a Problem and the person at Quicken can't quickly reproduce the same issue, they just toss it. 

lhossus

Follow-up to the side discussion on keyboard navigation (as it is named in Monterey) ...

Monterey Keyboard > Shortcuts preferences look like this:



Compare this to the screenshot @jacobs provided earlier for Mojave. And note the reference to Control-F7 at the bottom.

I selected Keyboard shortcuts in the sidebar rather than Screenshots shortcuts to point to the definition of Control-F7: Change the way Tab moves focus. This is the same definition that Control-F7 has in Mojave.

Toggling Control-F7 has the effect of checking and un-checking the checkbox at the bottom of the preference pane in Monterey, and moving between the two radio buttons in Mojave. In applications, Control-F7 has the same effect in both Mojave and Monterey.

The checkbox at the bottom of the pane, and adjacent text, is the same no mater the selection in the sidebar. I note this just in case someone wonders if this varies with the sidebar selection.

Hope this helps tie up some loose ends.

Hornman5659 said:

... My Keyboard preferences pane doesn't have the choice between Textboxes And Lists Only and All Controls. I have only a single option, Use Keyboard Navigation To Move Focus Between Controls. Apparently this is roughly the equivalent to All Controls in Mojave and earlier. 

I would say that this option is exactly equivalent.

I can't say that the new description is an improvement though. The old description hinted at what the difference between the two states was ... the new seems like it is a total on/off for keyboard navigation. Perhaps the term "controls" is key to understanding: just what is a control, and what is not.

Hornman5659

I tried unchecking the box, and the keyboard then behaved as it did for Jacobs when he checked Textboxes and Lists Only. In my situation, in the Transactions box, after unchecking Change the Way..., tabbing bypassed the Select Account box (where I could previously crash Quicken by typing a Down Arrow) and went directly to the Shares box. So, this is a very good workaround until such time as Quicken fixes the Down Arrow bug. And so far, I haven't noticed any problem with other websites with that box unchecked.