Hidden accounts transactions showing up in 'All Transactions' sidebar selection, shouldn't they not?

LDScott

Has something changed with hidden accounts, or am I just remembering wrong and it's always been this way?
It seems to me that if you've hidden accounts, that their transactions shouldn't show up in the transactions register. I do realize that the title of the function is 'All Transactions' but isn't that assuming all visible transactions only? Or, maybe the settings bars at the top of the transactions register for accounts included in the display, could have an 'All Visible Accounts' selection? Personally, I'd prefer the assumption that hidden means that it's not included in ALL transactions and accounts, and that their names are assumed to mean All Visible transactions or accounts. I would also assume that goes for the Uncategorized transactions list as well? I'd hate to have uncategorized transactions in hidden accounts clogging up the important active and visible uncategorized transactions list.

John_in_NC

Nothing has changed.

I suspect you wish to go into Accounts:"Hide and Show Accounts" and select the checkbox to "Keep Separate." That will segregate them.

If you do not, those accounts will still be available searching via "All Transactions". There are use cases for this, and that is why it is possible.

jacobs

Well, I'll disagree in part. It did not work this way in older versions. I just launched an old copy of Quicken 2017 to confirm my recollection: if you hid an account, the transactions in that account disappeared from the All Transactions register. But before the change to All Transactions, it required unhiding accounts to search in them, and that was a huge pain for people with a good number of hidden accounts, @LDScott . So I cheered the change (version 5.17 in June 2020) which made searching All Transactions include transactions in hidden accounts.

That said, I do think it would be possible to have it both ways: the default All Transactions register could exclude transactions in hidden accounts, but Search results with All Transactions selected could include transactions from hidden accounts. But that would probably cause as much, or more, user confusion than the way it currently works.  

RickO

As jacobs indicates, you can search only Hidden accounts by selecting the Hidden account group. But that doesn't solve the situation where you don't know if the transaction(s) you're searching for live in hidden or non-hidden accounts or both.

I think the best solution is if Quicken would add one additional popup filter on the All Transactions register next to Dates, Accounts and Status to include or exclude hidden accounts. Or it could be a checkbox on that same line in the interface. Best of both worlds.

John_in_NC

Nothing has changed.

I suspect you wish to go into Accounts:"Hide and Show Accounts" and select the checkbox to "Keep Separate." That will segregate them.

If you do not, those accounts will still be available searching via "All Transactions". There are use cases for this, and that is why it is possible.

RickO

As John says, there are use cases for this. In particular, if you have old accounts that are hidden, but you want to be able to include them in a search for a particular payee, memo, etc., this is the only way to do that. So it's important that hidden accounts are included in All Transactions.

That said, if you want a search to exclude hidden accounts, just start your search from the Banking or Investing group. Chances are you know off the top which of these groups the transaction(s) you're looking for belong to.

LDScott

I understand what you are saying, that there are use cases for being able to see all transactions, even the hidden ones, but the way you are describing it, what’s the use in hiding them if they are just there any way? Wouldn’t i just unhide them to search through them? I guess you could call it a search, but its just really a different way to display the transactions, meaning instead of looking at only my checking accounts transactions, I want to look at all my transactions in date order. I don’t want to see the hidden ones, that’s why I hid them. Just seems counter intuitive to me.

Jon

Hidden accounts aren't "just there anyway" - they're hidden from reports, charts, the dashboards, the sidebar, etc. Pretty much the only place those transactions still show up is in the All Transactions register.

Personally, I like that register the way it is - I don't want to have to unhide dozens of accounts just to go looking for one old transaction & then re-hide them again.

RickO

What Jon said...exactly.

jacobs

Well, I'll disagree in part. It did not work this way in older versions. I just launched an old copy of Quicken 2017 to confirm my recollection: if you hid an account, the transactions in that account disappeared from the All Transactions register. But before the change to All Transactions, it required unhiding accounts to search in them, and that was a huge pain for people with a good number of hidden accounts, @LDScott . So I cheered the change (version 5.17 in June 2020) which made searching All Transactions include transactions in hidden accounts.

That said, I do think it would be possible to have it both ways: the default All Transactions register could exclude transactions in hidden accounts, but Search results with All Transactions selected could include transactions from hidden accounts. But that would probably cause as much, or more, user confusion than the way it currently works.  

LDScott

Thank you all, for your prompt helpful responses and perspectives on the issue.

Thanks especially @jacobs, for confirmation that I'm not loosing my memory entirely.

'Keep Separate' seems to work for my current situation, however it would be nice for Hide to work in the All Transactions window and still have an easy way, for those who have multiple hidden accounts, to go around it, as what seems to be the general consensus of preferred behavior.

To that end, I think a super easy way, and perhaps more communicative way, to portray this behavior would be to either have an 'All Hidden Accounts' selection, like 'All Banking Accounts,' or 'All Visible Accounts,' or 'All Accounts (incl. Hidden)' sort of selection in that middle drop down filter in the All Transactions window.

Thanks again for your help.

jacobs

LDScott said:

To that end, I think a super easy way, and perhaps more communicative way, to portray this behavior would be to either have an 'All Hidden Accounts' selection, like 'All Banking Accounts,' or 'All Visible Accounts,' or 'All Accounts (incl. Hidden)' sort of selection in that middle drop down filter in the All Transactions window.

I think the key to understanding how Quicken views the accounts is looking at how they are displayed in the left sidebar if the sidebar preferences are set to display all types of accounts. Under All Transactions, there are four top-leave groups: Banking, Investing, Property & Debt and Hidden. So if you click All Transactions at the top, it makes sense that it includes all the accounts under it, including Hidden Accounts. 

I've found I can pretty easily get what I want — current accounts only, or all accounts including closed/hidden ones from the past. For current accounts, if I'm looking for transactions, I always know whether it's a banking transaction or an investment transaction, so I click on Banking or Investing in the left sidebar; I can then scroll the register, or use Search to find what I'm looking for. Using Banking or Investing, I won't see hidden accounts. Conversely, if I'm looking for something and know it's in a defunct account, or don't remember if it's in a current or former account, then I click on All Transactions and then do my Search. I don't think I've ever had an occasion where I wanted to search all my current accounts across all types, but excluding closed accounts. 

RickO

As jacobs indicates, you can search only Hidden accounts by selecting the Hidden account group. But that doesn't solve the situation where you don't know if the transaction(s) you're searching for live in hidden or non-hidden accounts or both.

I think the best solution is if Quicken would add one additional popup filter on the All Transactions register next to Dates, Accounts and Status to include or exclude hidden accounts. Or it could be a checkbox on that same line in the interface. Best of both worlds.