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why does my portfolio value report incorrectly calculate balance for a few securites

leonidshower

as of Nov 26 and Nov 27, walmart inc com shows a portfolio value of $12,034.66. the report shows correctly that I have 49.82 shares at the quoted price is $91.31.

my account overview correctly displays this balance as $4549.06

this happens on a number of securities, not just walmart

I checked a few dates and this bug holds

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leonidshower

interesting. I’ll check it out with the broker this afternoon

leonidshower

the broker identified the 81.98 as a stock distribution. This was in fact the result of the 3:1 stock split

This was no dividend or misc income. So whomever codes these things for quicken put in three transactions when one was sufficient. The three transactions were shares added, misc dividend, and stock split. I left the quicken transaction for ‘stock split’ in and deleted the others. Now the cash account, the PV report, the investing view screens all match up correctly

thank you very much for your assistance!!!

All comments

Jim_Harman

Have you backed up your data, then done a File > Validate and repair? Sometimes that fixes this sort of issue.

If not, click on the Holdings button in the affected account and look at Walmart. If that is correct, set the As of date for the Holdings view and the ending date for the report back in time until the error goes away.

Zero in on the date when the error first occurs and look for a transaction on that date that might explain the issue.

Sometimes deleting and re-entering the suspicious transaction will fix a problem like this.

Please let us know what you find.

leonidshower

thank you. Interim report - the error occurred after a stock split transaction on 2/24/2024. the transaction was recorded as a 3-1 split and got the correct number of shares. however the portfolio value report reports the resultant balance incorrectly.

its odd to me that the portfolio and investment displays (portfolio view, holdings view, etc) are correct, while the specific PV report is incorrect

leonidshower

i also did the validate as you suggested. i guess there will be five or six of these kind of problems and tracking down each one is quite laborious

what on your your end, what is the reason for this problem

leonidshower

i think this means you cannot use these reports for tax purposes since the gain calculation will not be correct

i think this is a priority fix for you guys

Jim_Harman

The Portfolio value report is calculated differently from the other reports.

Portfolio Value is cost basis + gain/loss and Net Worth is shares * share price. These should be the same but sometimes they can get out of synch. For example sometimes with a stock split the brokerage will download an Added transaction to correct the share count. If Quicken has anything other than just a Split transaction, it may cause this problem.

See this discussion for more info.

https://community.quicken.com/discussion/7904995/quicken-reports-and-bad-math

For tax purposes, you should compare Quicken's Tax > Capital Gains report to the 1099B you receive from the brokerage and make sure they agree.

leonidshower

Thanks Jim, I suspected it was something like this (cost basis plus gain/loss). I continue to believe this algorithmic issue should be fixed, since it is a clear mistake.

Of course I compare my statements with Quicken, and resolve them, but I don't think I should have to find mistakes like this. Sometimes, I resolve to accept the limitation and sometimes I try to change my data to make the report provide reliable data.

I will read the discussion you linked and thank you for your time

Bill

Jim_Harman

If the problem is as described above, it is not an algorithmic issue but rather incorrect transactions downloaded and accepted.

You should always review downloaded transactions and correct them if necessary before accepting them.

leonidshower

Hi Jim

I'm sorry but I do believe this is an algorithmic issue. My problem is exactly as I specified, and I did check the transaction.

Here is the transaction:

Here is the report:

I have 47.88 shares of WalMart. The price is $94.96. The transaction was entered correctly.

Unless you can explain to me how this transaction was entered correctly, then the three statements above are correct, and the report is incorrect.

Jim_Harman

@leonidshower

This is very confusing, I am dealing with two different sets of data with two users.

So your Walmart also split recently? Set the end date for the Portfolio Value report to just before and just after the split and see if the data goes bad at the time of the split. If it is not at that time, find when it goes bad and see what happened then.

If you hold Walmart in more than one account, check them all to confirm that the split is recorded correctly everywhere.

[edit to add] I see you already identified that the problem had something to do with the split.

I created a test file that started with 33 shares of Walmart as of 1/1/2024 and includes the split on 2/26. After the split there are 99 shares. The Portfolio Value report works correctly for this situation, so there must be something else going on in your data.

leonidshower

Jim

I’ll try the same test. I cannot refute your logic

leonidshower

sorry I tried by deleting the stock split and entering it.

Doesn’t work same incorrect result

i’m moving on. I’ve taken enough time with this. We have to leave it that quicken portfolio value report and capital gains report doesn’t always work for unknown reasons.

q_lurker

@leonidshower I realize you are trying to 'move on', but a couple of questions before you do, maybe.

I see 11/26 your affirmed that 49.82 shares was correct and now 12/12, you state 47.88 shares is correct. So I surmise in between you sold 1.94 shares. Correct? Or did some correction to prior data get made or could some gremlin be changing something that should be looked into?

Real questions toward your underlying problem - Have you bought and sold WMT before, possibly trading in and out of it such that this current holding went from 0 shares to the current level? There have been cases where something happened to an older, closed out holding that then impacted the current holding.

Also, have you ever gone with short selling WMT? If a short sale was not covered correctly, that can yield funny results.

Jim_Harman

I have continued to experiment with my test file but I have not been able to cause any incorrect results in the Portfolio Value report.

Have all of the affected securities had splits?

Have there been any sales of WMT since the split?

Is your cost basis correct after the split - unchanged by the split?

Clicking on the Show lots button in the report may reveal what is going on behind the scenes.

leonidshower

Jim since you are working on this , I will too

maybe we can solve this. I’m at a party right now but I’ll answer tomorrow

bill

leonidshower

Walmart Page 2.PNG

Jim,

here are three files showing ALL transactions for Walmart and Entergy. Yes, this problem only occurs on splits and only on these two securities

Note the next paragraph:

The second of my two incorrect securities is Entergy. Entergy just split 2:1. I received a 2:1 stock split transaction of stock split on Dec 13. I probably edited the stock split transaction to be 2:1 on the pop up page.

Walmart Page 1.PNG

Entergy.PNG

On December 15, I received an Added shares transaction of 20.52 shares. Note, my original holding was 20.52 shares.

This may shed light - my new holding is now 61.56 shares, exactly 20.52 shares too much.

I also included a file showing ALL transactions for Entergy.

leonidshower

Additional comment - acting on a hunch, I deleted the Entergy split stock transaction and the report is now correct.

I attempted the same with the Walmart stock ( at the 2/26 date, I had 40.99 shares. After the 3:1 split, I had 122.97 shares. I deleted the stock split transaction and did an add transaction for 81.98 shares. My shares are correct (now 47.88 after many transactions after 2/26/2024) but the PV report is still wrong.

Jim_Harman

You should keep or re-enter the Splits and delete the Added transactions. With the Added and no Split, the share counts will be correct but you will have two tax lots when you originally only had one. That will seem OK until you sell part of your holding. After the partial sale, your cost basis will almost certainly be wrong.

With the Split and no Added, everything should be OK - one tax lot, correct number of shares, and correct cost basis.

If you have both the Split and the Added, you will have more shares than you should, as you have seen.

Note that the change in the downloaded share price is often not synched with the Split transaction, and you must manually correct the share prices on a few days around the split date. This makes the total value (shares * price) wrong for a few days around the split.

leonidshower

Thanks for trying, Jim I appreciate it

Bill

Jim_Harman

Why do you keep rejecting my answers? Have you tried what I recommend? What was the result?

The Added will look OK for the Entergy, because you have not sold any shares since the split. As soon as you start selling shares, your cost basis will be hosed because after the Add you have 2 lots.

leonidshower

Jim, I have tried the recommendation you gave today in which I deleted the add transaction several times and kept only the stock split transactions several times in various sequences. Entergy is ok Walmart is not ok

do you have other recommendations? I believe I have tried all of the ones you have proposed

i’ve rejected the answers because I thought it was clear. The problem is not solved . The Walmart portfolio in the report is still higher than actual.

I sent you detailed transaction. Maybe those transactions will help you out.

If you want to have a telephone conversation, I can do that

q_lurker

@leonidshower

Regarding your Walmart shares (First I'll note somehow in your listing the column headers got misaligned with the data below. That is Date, Action, Account, etc. should all actually be one column to the right of where they currently show.)

The transaction history you provided shows that before 2/26/24 you had 40.99 shares in four lots. In reverse order: one of 0.37 shares acquired for $54.71, one of 0.82 shares acquired for $122.63, one of 1.71 shares acquired for $258.54. The fourth was originally 40.31 shares but it appears the 3 sales came from that first lot bringing it down to 38.09 shares with a basis now of $5825.11. The realized gain shown for each sale is consistent with that sale using shares from the first lot. That is also consistent with Quicken's default to use a FIFO (first in, first out) selection when sales happen.

The 3:1 split shown for 2/26/24 would have increased the 40.99 shares on a lot by lot basis to 122.97 shares (an increase of 81.98 shares), each lot maintaining it same basis.

Your lists also shows for 2/26/24 an addition of 81.98 shares which should have then increased the total shares to a total of 204.95. That type of listing does not show the basis associated with the Add Shares transaction, but commonly it is $0. This Add Shares is redundant with the Stock Split transaction. Because it is redundant and because it likely does not have any basis associated with it, the Add Shares transaction is the one that should be deleted.

After 2/26/24, the listed transactions sell off 75.09 shares. This would bring the (correct) 122.97 shares down to the (correct) 47.88 point. Or it would bring the (too high) 204.95 shares to a (too high) 129.86 level.

It is unclear to me at this time how your prior post showed the WalMart holding at the (correct) 47.88 level if all those transactions were used. If either of the 3:1 split or the 81.98 shares added transactions were deleted the 47.88 level would have been the result. Because the share count in your tow portfolio value screenshots is inconsistent with the transaction list, I cannot speculate why your basis values are incorrect.

I strongly agree with @Jim_Harman that deleting the Add Shares is the correct remedy. After doing so, you may need to review each Sale transaction to make sure those sales properly reflect the sold lot. I also agree that clicking the Show lots button on the portfolio value report would be very helpful.

leonidshower

Q-lurkers

thank you for this it is a lot of work. The discrepancy you note is a timing one I believe. Trying to solve the problem versus lag in the time you guys reac the message

I’ve entered the transactions just as Jim said and the problem persists. I suspect he is right that the add transaction followed by some sales bollixed the basis calculation.

I am thinking I just have to delete all the transactions after 2/26 and reenter them without the add order

q_lurker

I am thinking I just have to delete all the transactions after 2/26 and reenter them without the add order

I would simply delete the Add Shares, then one by one edit the sales, checking the specify lots selection. You might not have to change anything. You might get by with the reset selection button or the first shares button. Maybe just a 1-character change to the memo field would be enough to reset the calculation.

There is also an option to Ctrl-z from the transaction list to get the account recalculated.

A variety of ways to go before deleting all and re-entering.

Jim_Harman

It is also possible that now that you have a Split and no Added transaction, Validating with the Rebuild investing lots option might fix your problem.

Make sure to back up your data before trying this, just in case.

leonidshower

good ideas

I did all of the suggestions and no impact

will work on later today

leonidshower

There was an 81.98 distribution recorded on the day of the stock split This distribution was recorded as misc inc.

I recategirixed this distribution as dividend and the problem vanished

although this problem disappeared for me I still think there is something wrong with the algorithm. Why would an 82 dollar distribution cause an 8000 dollar change to the reported value

q_lurker

Do you have any evidence on the brokers statements or website of a cash distribution of $81.98?

I do not believe that was supposed to be interpreted as a cash distribution. I believe that was an additional 81.98 shares they were reporting distributed to you, which we have been saying was redundant with the Stock Split transactions entry.

You had 40.99 shares at the time. The split was 3:1 making the new share count 122.97, an increase of 81.98 shares.

leonidshower

interesting. I’ll check it out with the broker this afternoon

leonidshower

the broker identified the 81.98 as a stock distribution. This was in fact the result of the 3:1 stock split

thank you very much for your assistance!!!