Please add ETF (and other customizability) to security/asset types (70 Legacy Votes)

Diane FarrarDiane Farrar Member
edited February 28 in Investing (Mac)
I don't like using "Other" for my ETFs. Please add ETF to security types.
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  • markus1957markus1957 SuperUser
    edited January 11
    You can add it yourself in Edit Security Details, Edit Types, New. Once your add it in one security, it will be available in the pull-down menu when you modify the others.
  • Diane FarrarDiane Farrar Member
    edited August 2018
    Sorry, I put this in the wrong category. I have quicken for mac. I will repost on the correct forum.
    BTW, Qmac does not have that option.
  • GillesGilles Member
    edited September 2018
    This reply was created from a merged topic originally titled Comment to be merged.


    ETF are automatically shown as Mutual Funds

    but you are right that type of product is big- wide spread enough to have its security type in QM

    Note: This conversation was created from a reply on: Please add ETF to security types.
  • markus1957markus1957 SuperUser
    edited December 2016

    You can add it yourself in Edit Security Details, Edit Types, New. Once your add it in one security, it will be available in the pull-down menu when you modify the others.

    This question was originally posted as a Windows topic. Quicken Windows has the capability requested.
  • smayer97smayer97 SuperUser
    edited September 2018
    Actually, I believe this field should be a user definable field, like in QM2007. Then you can add other types too.

    (If you find this reply helpful, please be sure to click "Like", so others will know, thanks.)

    If you find this reply helpful, please be sure to click "Like", so others will know, thanks.

    (STILL using QM2007, Canadian user since '92)

    Have Questions? Check out these FAQs:
  • edited August 2018
    Gilles said:

    This reply was created from a merged topic originally titled Comment to be merged.


    ETF are automatically shown as Mutual Funds

    but you are right that type of product is big- wide spread enough to have its security type in QM

    Note: This conversation was created from a reply on: Please add ETF to security types.

    Yes ETFs are a much more common investment TYPE than, for example, US Savngs Bonds. I am glad to be able to add an asset CLASS, since both mutual funds and ETFs can contain either bonds or stocks, or a mixture of both. Thanks guys! Looking forward to having ETFs, but other investment features are more important to me (choosing tax lots for sales in personal account). I would really like an asset class for Real Estate, too.
  • Stephen TecotStephen Tecot Member
    edited August 2018
    This reply was created from a merged topic originally titled Security Type----Would like to be able to created additional security types..


    The 8 defined security TYPES provided in the program are not granular enough to allow me to differentiate the types of securities I have. I want to be able to create my own Security TYPEs
  • stephenstephen Member
    edited August 2018
    This reply was created from a merged topic originally titled Add more or customizable Asset Classes (like Morning Star's categories ((large ca....


    At least with your windows version I had the ability to create some (limited #) asset categories in the custom field.  I NEED that with the Mac version to continue using it effectively to balance my portfolio between major asset classes (Domestic Small Cap Value, Domestic Small Cap Growth, Int Small Cap Growth, etc.  Emerging Markets Foreign VS Domestic Bonds, etc.
  • BruceGBruceG Member
    edited August 2018
    stephen said:

    This reply was created from a merged topic originally titled Add more or customizable Asset Classes (like Morning Star's categories ((large ca....


    At least with your windows version I had the ability to create some (limited #) asset categories in the custom field.  I NEED that with the Mac version to continue using it effectively to balance my portfolio between major asset classes (Domestic Small Cap Value, Domestic Small Cap Growth, Int Small Cap Growth, etc.  Emerging Markets Foreign VS Domestic Bonds, etc.

    I whole heartily agree. My FI doesn't use any of the Asset Classes listed in QM2018 except International Stock.
  • NotACPANotACPA SuperUser
    edited October 2018
    Let's start at the beginning.  An ETF is NOT an asset class.  What it holds determines the Asset Class.

    SO, an ETF that holds International Stocks is an "International Stock" class.
    And ETF that holds the Dow 30 is a "Large Cap Stock" class.

    ETF, itself, isn't a class and doesn't need to be added, as a class to Q.
    Q user since DOS version 5
    Now running Quicken Windows Subscription
    Retired "Certified Information Systems Auditor"
  • stephenstephen Member
    edited October 2018
    Yes, but there are many categories of International Stocks that a properly diversified portfolio needs to breakdown.  So while ETF may not be relevant to you, certainly the subtext of "other customizable classes" should.
  • NotACPANotACPA SuperUser
    edited August 2018
    stephen said:

    Yes, but there are many categories of International Stocks that a properly diversified portfolio needs to breakdown.  So while ETF may not be relevant to you, certainly the subtext of "other customizable classes" should.

    while ETF may not be relevant to you
    And WHAT are you basing that statement upon?

    I own ETFs ... and I have them classified upon what they hold ... not that they're an ETF ... which is NOT an asset class.  It's an asset type ... much like funds vs holding stocks directly.
    Q user since DOS version 5
    Now running Quicken Windows Subscription
    Retired "Certified Information Systems Auditor"
  • ConcordmanConcordman Member
    edited August 2018

    Let's start at the beginning.  An ETF is NOT an asset class.  What it holds determines the Asset Class.

    SO, an ETF that holds International Stocks is an "International Stock" class.
    And ETF that holds the Dow 30 is a "Large Cap Stock" class.

    ETF, itself, isn't a class and doesn't need to be added, as a class to Q.

    Make sense to me, I have a few ETFs they trade like a stock
  • QPWQPW Member
    edited August 2018

    Let's start at the beginning.  An ETF is NOT an asset class.  What it holds determines the Asset Class.

    SO, an ETF that holds International Stocks is an "International Stock" class.
    And ETF that holds the Dow 30 is a "Large Cap Stock" class.

    ETF, itself, isn't a class and doesn't need to be added, as a class to Q.

    It seems to me that people are confusing two different terms/settings.

    There is a "Type", and there is an "Asset class".

    There certainly can be a EFT "type", but there shouldn't be a EFT "Asset class".
    image


    In Quicken Windows you can add whatever types you like, but there are only a fixed number of Asset classes.  And note that the Asset classes are use in other parts of Quicken to combine similar investments for performance tracking purposes and assets mixes.

    It makes no sense to track the performance or asset class EFT.

    Like NoTACPA you track what they hold.
  • QPWQPW Member
    edited August 2018

    Let's start at the beginning.  An ETF is NOT an asset class.  What it holds determines the Asset Class.

    SO, an ETF that holds International Stocks is an "International Stock" class.
    And ETF that holds the Dow 30 is a "Large Cap Stock" class.

    ETF, itself, isn't a class and doesn't need to be added, as a class to Q.

    And as a further clarification.  "Types" are used in the reports so that you can filter by "security types".  Basically just grouping your securities for easier selection in the reports.

    The Asset Class on the other hand is tied into what is possible to download from the "quotes service(s)" Quicken Inc pays for.  So even though there would be a concern that if customizable asset classes were added then Quicken would basically have no idea what to do with them.  They would be purely manually maintained.

    For instance they certainly wouldn't update automatically when say an mutual fund/ETF changes its mix, or in the MorningStar X-Ray portfolio.  And the "rebalance portfolio" on the investment tab wouldn't know what to do with them.
  • jakevogeljakevogel Member
    edited August 2018
    This reply was created from a merged topic originally titled More Asset Classes.


    The asset class list should have more items.  Large Cap, Small Cap, International Stocks, Domestic and International Bonds - too broad.  At the very least the list should also include Mid Cap Stocks.  Keep International Stocks for those who want a broad view, but for those who want to see more detail I suggest: International Large Cap Stocks, International Small/Mid Stocks, Emerging Markets Stocks.  Under Domestic Bonds, keep that category for those who want to keep their view broad; but for those of us who would like more detail, I suggest: Short-term Bond, Government Bond, Intermediate-term Bond, Inflation-Protected Bond, High Yield Bond, Multi-Sector Bond.  In addition to International Bond you could add Emerging Markets Bond.  Other basic Morningstar categories (instead of "Mixed/Multiple") I suggest: World Stock, Domestic Balanced, Global Balanced.  Finally, "Alternatives" would be a catch-all for remaining categories.  I'm purposely leaving out "Growth" and "Value" because that would essentially double the stock lists.
  • BruceGBruceG Member
    edited August 2018
    jakevogel said:

    This reply was created from a merged topic originally titled More Asset Classes.


    The asset class list should have more items.  Large Cap, Small Cap, International Stocks, Domestic and International Bonds - too broad.  At the very least the list should also include Mid Cap Stocks.  Keep International Stocks for those who want a broad view, but for those who want to see more detail I suggest: International Large Cap Stocks, International Small/Mid Stocks, Emerging Markets Stocks.  Under Domestic Bonds, keep that category for those who want to keep their view broad; but for those of us who would like more detail, I suggest: Short-term Bond, Government Bond, Intermediate-term Bond, Inflation-Protected Bond, High Yield Bond, Multi-Sector Bond.  In addition to International Bond you could add Emerging Markets Bond.  Other basic Morningstar categories (instead of "Mixed/Multiple") I suggest: World Stock, Domestic Balanced, Global Balanced.  Finally, "Alternatives" would be a catch-all for remaining categories.  I'm purposely leaving out "Growth" and "Value" because that would essentially double the stock lists.

    My FI currently breakdowns securities into US Equities, International Equities, Taxable Fixed Income, Tax-Exempt Fixed Income and Other Assets. I have to use the Asset Classes in QM2018 therefore there is no direct asset class match. The closest match is International Stock for International Equities. I have to mismatch Asset Classes to keep them grouped so it's easier to Reconcile my accounts.
  • stephenstephen Member
    edited October 2018
    simplest is to give the user control over customizable asset classes with no limits to how many.  you can do that with the Premier windows version, though limited to a handful.  If only they extended that same functionality to the new Mac version without a cap on #of custom entries.
  • QPWQPW Member
    edited October 2018
    My "biggest question" for people asking for customized asset classes is "Are you willing to maintain them manually?"

    Currently for the most part Quicken maintains the ones it has because it can get that information from its provider.  So as mutual fund/ETF changes its mix over time, it changes in Quicken.

    It doesn't matter if your financial institution supports different asset mixes, Quicken doesn't have access to that information.  You will have to maintain it for each of your securities that you customize.
  • NotACPANotACPA SuperUser
    edited August 2018
    stephen said:

    simplest is to give the user control over customizable asset classes with no limits to how many.  you can do that with the Premier windows version, though limited to a handful.  If only they extended that same functionality to the new Mac version without a cap on #of custom entries.

    Hypothetical question:  If I own an S&P500 ETF, a domestic bond ETF and a International Bond ETF what do you suppose the asset class is?

    Answer:  Large Cap Stock for the S&P500, Domestic Bond for that ETF and International Bond for that ETF.

    The ETF's are asset TYPES, not asset Classes.

    User assigned asset classes are meaningless.
    Q user since DOS version 5
    Now running Quicken Windows Subscription
    Retired "Certified Information Systems Auditor"
  • BruceGBruceG Member
    edited August 2018
    stephen said:

    simplest is to give the user control over customizable asset classes with no limits to how many.  you can do that with the Premier windows version, though limited to a handful.  If only they extended that same functionality to the new Mac version without a cap on #of custom entries.

    I for one want to be able to group my securities the same way my FI does. That way is is easier to Reconcile my accounts and find and correct errors in my account. The only way I can do that is to assign them to an Asset Class.
  • QPWQPW Member
    edited August 2018
    stephen said:

    simplest is to give the user control over customizable asset classes with no limits to how many.  you can do that with the Premier windows version, though limited to a handful.  If only they extended that same functionality to the new Mac version without a cap on #of custom entries.

    I wouldn't say they are meaningless.  But for sure a lot of people on this thread have no idea what an asset class is, so they have no idea what they are asking for.

    Anyone asking for an asset class of ETF clearly doesn't know what an asset class is.  And that is how this thread started.  On the other hand customized "security types" quite "do able", and Quicken Windows already supports them, so Quicken Mac should probably get them too.

    But then past that there are people in this thread that clearly do know what an asset class is.  Like the request for Mid Cap.  And if they really want/need them, I would say it is a valid request, but I doubt the people requesting it understand all the ramifications, as in Quicken can't support them automatically and tools like the MorningStar X-Ray won't do anything with them either.
  • NotACPANotACPA SuperUser
    edited August 2018
    stephen said:

    simplest is to give the user control over customizable asset classes with no limits to how many.  you can do that with the Premier windows version, though limited to a handful.  If only they extended that same functionality to the new Mac version without a cap on #of custom entries.

    From Investopedia:
    What is an 'Asset Class'

    An asset class is a group of securities that exhibits similar
    characteristics, behaves similarly in the marketplace and is subject to
    the same laws and regulations. The three main asset classes are equities, or stocks; fixed income, or bonds; and cash equivalents, or money market instruments. Some investment professionals add real estatecommodities, and increasingly, cryptocurrencies such as Bitcoin, to the asset class mix.


    Anyone who is arguing for "user defined asset classes" needs to explain how their proposed asset classes meet this definition.

    AND, they need to explain how an S&P500 ETF and a Bond ETF "exhibit similar characteristics".
    Q user since DOS version 5
    Now running Quicken Windows Subscription
    Retired "Certified Information Systems Auditor"
  • QPWQPW Member
    edited August 2018
    stephen said:

    simplest is to give the user control over customizable asset classes with no limits to how many.  you can do that with the Premier windows version, though limited to a handful.  If only they extended that same functionality to the new Mac version without a cap on #of custom entries.

    NotACPA you seem to be under the impression that because some people (including the person the submitted the idea in the first place) don't understand what an asset class is that there is no merit such a request at all.

    That is clearly not the case.  There is clearly a need for Quicken Mac to get the same customization for the "security type" as is already in Quicken Windows.

    On top of that even without them being automatically updated there is purpose for having custom asset classes.

    Here is an example from my INVESTING -> Allocations view:
    image

    The "No Asset Class" is in fact my Lending Club Notes.

    These do not behave like any of the built in asset classes.

    For the people not familiar with these notes these are where a person takes out an unsecured personal loan.  And the investors each take a small part of that loan.
    So investors typically have a large amount of very small loans.  Far more than Quicken could ever track as loans.  So instead most people track them as a security, that is bought (take on part of a loan), sold (received a payment), pays interest, and are charged off (sold for zero).

    I certainly don't want to lump their performance with any of the built in asset classes, so I don't.  I put them in "No Asset Class" and know they are my Lending Club notes.

    But of course this only works for one extra asset class.

    And of course it also means that the guides and such don't have a clue on how to deal with them.  But frankly I don't use those guides anyways.
  • stephenstephen Member
    edited October 2018
    I maintain my asset classes manually.  I don't understand why there is so much discussion over a simple request to put Quicken for Mac on parity with the Windows version which I used for many years to balance my portfolio between user defined asset classes:  Large Cap Value, Large Cap Growth, Foreign Large Value, Foreign Large Growth, EM, Small Cap Value, Small Cap Growth, ETC.  I'd like to break it down more, but Windows version limits the number of customized fields......  This is how you create a truly balanced portfolio.  The discussion above is moot and besides the point of what a user requests or needs to have more control over his or her portfolio.  The Type (of security) is irrelevant for achieving a balanced portfolio as the Asset Class can be made up of different security types.  For instance, you can get 7% of your portfolio mix to be Large Cap Value using a combination single stocks, ETFs or mutual funds (and other exotic instruments that's beyond the scope here).   I ignore the type field as it's irrelevant for my purposes of maintaining a certain percentage mix of ASSET CLASSES, but I cannot ignore the Asset Class, and yes, for every new ticker symbol I purchase (whether single stock, mutual fund or ETF, I will assign the Asset Class usually prescribed by Morning Star.). Can someone please tell me how to convince the programmers how important this is for rebalancing a portfolio as it should be a simple amount of programming to add to Quicken for Mac just like it is on Windows (I'm sick of using visualization software to use Quicken Premier 2017 for Windows to maintain my self directed portfolio of many different securities broken down by ASSET CLASS). 
  • RickORickO SuperUser
    edited August 2018
    stephen said:

    I maintain my asset classes manually.  I don't understand why there is so much discussion over a simple request to put Quicken for Mac on parity with the Windows version which I used for many years to balance my portfolio between user defined asset classes:  Large Cap Value, Large Cap Growth, Foreign Large Value, Foreign Large Growth, EM, Small Cap Value, Small Cap Growth, ETC.  I'd like to break it down more, but Windows version limits the number of customized fields......  This is how you create a truly balanced portfolio.  The discussion above is moot and besides the point of what a user requests or needs to have more control over his or her portfolio.  The Type (of security) is irrelevant for achieving a balanced portfolio as the Asset Class can be made up of different security types.  For instance, you can get 7% of your portfolio mix to be Large Cap Value using a combination single stocks, ETFs or mutual funds (and other exotic instruments that's beyond the scope here).   I ignore the type field as it's irrelevant for my purposes of maintaining a certain percentage mix of ASSET CLASSES, but I cannot ignore the Asset Class, and yes, for every new ticker symbol I purchase (whether single stock, mutual fund or ETF, I will assign the Asset Class usually prescribed by Morning Star.). Can someone please tell me how to convince the programmers how important this is for rebalancing a portfolio as it should be a simple amount of programming to add to Quicken for Mac just like it is on Windows (I'm sick of using visualization software to use Quicken Premier 2017 for Windows to maintain my self directed portfolio of many different securities broken down by ASSET CLASS). 

    Can someone please tell me how to convince the programmers how important this is
    Answer: You click the VOTE button at the top of this page. The developers use these votes to help prioritize improvements. Everybody has their top issues they'd like to see improved. We can't all have our top issue addressed first. 

  • QPWQPW Member
    edited August 2018
    stephen said:

    I maintain my asset classes manually.  I don't understand why there is so much discussion over a simple request to put Quicken for Mac on parity with the Windows version which I used for many years to balance my portfolio between user defined asset classes:  Large Cap Value, Large Cap Growth, Foreign Large Value, Foreign Large Growth, EM, Small Cap Value, Small Cap Growth, ETC.  I'd like to break it down more, but Windows version limits the number of customized fields......  This is how you create a truly balanced portfolio.  The discussion above is moot and besides the point of what a user requests or needs to have more control over his or her portfolio.  The Type (of security) is irrelevant for achieving a balanced portfolio as the Asset Class can be made up of different security types.  For instance, you can get 7% of your portfolio mix to be Large Cap Value using a combination single stocks, ETFs or mutual funds (and other exotic instruments that's beyond the scope here).   I ignore the type field as it's irrelevant for my purposes of maintaining a certain percentage mix of ASSET CLASSES, but I cannot ignore the Asset Class, and yes, for every new ticker symbol I purchase (whether single stock, mutual fund or ETF, I will assign the Asset Class usually prescribed by Morning Star.). Can someone please tell me how to convince the programmers how important this is for rebalancing a portfolio as it should be a simple amount of programming to add to Quicken for Mac just like it is on Windows (I'm sick of using visualization software to use Quicken Premier 2017 for Windows to maintain my self directed portfolio of many different securities broken down by ASSET CLASS). 

     I don't understand why there is so much discussion over a simple request 

    Because the original request and some of the comments on here makes it clear that some of the people don't understand what an asset class is.  Anyone is talking about an ETF as an asset class clearly doesn't know what they are talking about and as such are "voting" for the wrong thing.
    to put Quicken for Mac on parity with the Windows version
    And you are clearly not remembering what the Windows version provides.
    
    image

    It is the "Type" that has an Edit box, not the Asset class.


    So if the Mac version was to have "parity" with the Windows version the only thing that would be added is the ability to edit the security type.  And clearly people really do want to add asset types.

    And as such the feature would need to be added to BOTH Mac and Windows versions.
  • QPWQPW Member
    edited August 2018
    stephen said:

    I maintain my asset classes manually.  I don't understand why there is so much discussion over a simple request to put Quicken for Mac on parity with the Windows version which I used for many years to balance my portfolio between user defined asset classes:  Large Cap Value, Large Cap Growth, Foreign Large Value, Foreign Large Growth, EM, Small Cap Value, Small Cap Growth, ETC.  I'd like to break it down more, but Windows version limits the number of customized fields......  This is how you create a truly balanced portfolio.  The discussion above is moot and besides the point of what a user requests or needs to have more control over his or her portfolio.  The Type (of security) is irrelevant for achieving a balanced portfolio as the Asset Class can be made up of different security types.  For instance, you can get 7% of your portfolio mix to be Large Cap Value using a combination single stocks, ETFs or mutual funds (and other exotic instruments that's beyond the scope here).   I ignore the type field as it's irrelevant for my purposes of maintaining a certain percentage mix of ASSET CLASSES, but I cannot ignore the Asset Class, and yes, for every new ticker symbol I purchase (whether single stock, mutual fund or ETF, I will assign the Asset Class usually prescribed by Morning Star.). Can someone please tell me how to convince the programmers how important this is for rebalancing a portfolio as it should be a simple amount of programming to add to Quicken for Mac just like it is on Windows (I'm sick of using visualization software to use Quicken Premier 2017 for Windows to maintain my self directed portfolio of many different securities broken down by ASSET CLASS). 

    Just to be clear.  "Specify asset class mixture" dialog comes up when you select the Define... button.  And you will notice there isn't any way to add new asset classes.
  • smayer97smayer97 SuperUser
    edited December 2018
    So to keep the discussion clearer, this IDEA thread should be about Security/Asset TYPES only.

    For any discussions or votes dealing with Asset CLASSES, you can add your VOTE to 
    Add ability to customize the asset class menu.

    First, click on the underlined link above to go there, then click VOTE at the top of THAT page, so your vote will count for THIS feature and increase its visibility to the developers by seeking to have the features you need or desire end up in the latest version.

    While you are at it, you may want to add your VOTE to related IDEAS found on the 
    List of Requests Related to Investments. Click on the underlined link, then follow the instructions to add your vote to more related ideas. Your VOTES matter!

    (If you find this reply helpful, please be sure to click "Like", so others will know, thanks.)

    If you find this reply helpful, please be sure to click "Like", so others will know, thanks.

    (STILL using QM2007, Canadian user since '92)

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