Unrealized Gain

Unknown

I have a security that was bought and sold in entirety in 2016.  QUicken has recorded an unrealized gain.  How do I Fix it?

Unknown

Hi Mindy,

I'm sorry for any inconvenience this has caused. To help us provide you with the most appropriate answer, please let us know which Quicken product (QWin or QMac), what version (2015, 2016,etc.) and what release you have installed. Also, let us know whether you using the US version of Quicken or Quicken Canada.

Thanks,
Dave

Unknown

Hi Dave,

I'm using the US version Qwin 2015 release 13.

Thanks,

Mindy

Tom Young

Every time the price of a security changes in Quicken, Quicken updates the market value of the security and calculates the unrealized appreciation (gain) or depreciation (loss) on the security, but it doesn't "record" that anywhere in the sense of seeing some sort of entry in the register of an "investment" Account.  The only place you see an unrealized gain or loss is when you look at the "Holdings" screen in the Account or in "Portfolio" view.

Accordingly, your statement "QUicken has recorded an unrealized gain" is confusing.  Where, exactly, are you seeing this unrealized gain recorded.  If you run a "Capital Gains" report for 2016 you should be seeing the realized gain reported there, and you should see a corresponding "Sold" transaction in the investment Account in which the trade took place.

A screen shot of where you are seeing this would be helpful.

Unknown

Tom Young said:

Every time the price of a security changes in Quicken, Quicken updates the market value of the security and calculates the unrealized appreciation (gain) or depreciation (loss) on the security, but it doesn't "record" that anywhere in the sense of seeing some sort of entry in the register of an "investment" Account.  The only place you see an unrealized gain or loss is when you look at the "Holdings" screen in the Account or in "Portfolio" view.

Accordingly, your statement "QUicken has recorded an unrealized gain" is confusing.  Where, exactly, are you seeing this unrealized gain recorded.  If you run a "Capital Gains" report for 2016 you should be seeing the realized gain reported there, and you should see a corresponding "Sold" transaction in the investment Account in which the trade took place.

A screen shot of where you are seeing this would be helpful.

cancel all replys

Unknown

Tom Young said:

Every time the price of a security changes in Quicken, Quicken updates the market value of the security and calculates the unrealized appreciation (gain) or depreciation (loss) on the security, but it doesn't "record" that anywhere in the sense of seeing some sort of entry in the register of an "investment" Account.  The only place you see an unrealized gain or loss is when you look at the "Holdings" screen in the Account or in "Portfolio" view.

Accordingly, your statement "QUicken has recorded an unrealized gain" is confusing.  Where, exactly, are you seeing this unrealized gain recorded.  If you run a "Capital Gains" report for 2016 you should be seeing the realized gain reported there, and you should see a corresponding "Sold" transaction in the investment Account in which the trade took place.

A screen shot of where you are seeing this would be helpful.

Tom - Thanks for answering this before I got to it. I concur with your comments. Dick

NotACPA

Tom Young said:

Every time the price of a security changes in Quicken, Quicken updates the market value of the security and calculates the unrealized appreciation (gain) or depreciation (loss) on the security, but it doesn't "record" that anywhere in the sense of seeing some sort of entry in the register of an "investment" Account.  The only place you see an unrealized gain or loss is when you look at the "Holdings" screen in the Account or in "Portfolio" view.

Accordingly, your statement "QUicken has recorded an unrealized gain" is confusing.  Where, exactly, are you seeing this unrealized gain recorded.  If you run a "Capital Gains" report for 2016 you should be seeing the realized gain reported there, and you should see a corresponding "Sold" transaction in the investment Account in which the trade took place.

A screen shot of where you are seeing this would be helpful.

@Andrew & @Blue Spruce, what replies are you talking about?  Until your messages (immediately above this one) you hadn't replied on this thread.

Did you, perhaps, click on the FOLLOW icon at the top of the page?  That would cause you to receive follow-up replies.  IF this is the case, you can end the replies yourself by simply clicking what is now the "Unfollow" icon.

If this isn't the case, please explain further.

Unknown

Thanks Tom.

The security is not showing in the portfolio view at 12/31/2016.  When I run a report on unrealized gains, however, it is showing a unrealized gain of $1,212.03.  This is distorting my Statement of Changes in Net Assets and not allowing my equity account to roll properly.

NotACPA

Mindy said:

Thanks Tom.

The security is not showing in the portfolio view at 12/31/2016.  When I run a report on unrealized gains, however, it is showing a unrealized gain of $1,212.03.  This is distorting my Statement of Changes in Net Assets and not allowing my equity account to roll properly.

Mindy, can you take a snapshot of the actual Q report?  This picture from Excel is of mixed help.

Direct the report to a PDF, and then take a snapshot of that (while it's in preview mode).

Also, in your 2nd graphic, what's the formula of the F17 cell in your 2nd graphic.  Because it's curious that the number there is the same as F7 ... which makes this look like an Excel error rather than a Q error.

Tom Young

Mindy said:

Thanks Tom.

The security is not showing in the portfolio view at 12/31/2016.  When I run a report on unrealized gains, however, it is showing a unrealized gain of $1,212.03.  This is distorting my Statement of Changes in Net Assets and not allowing my equity account to roll properly.

That first picture looks like an Investment Transactions report where you've clicked (Advanced > Include unrealized gain) though I have to admit my Investment Transactions report doesn't look exactly like that, for some reason.

How does that report look with the "Include unrealized gain" box unchecked?

Unknown

Thanks NotACPA.  The formula in the Excel is adding all of the numbers in the cell before it.

Unknown

Tom,

Here is the report w/o the box checked.

UKR

Mindy said:

Tom,

Here is the report w/o the box checked.

That looks better, much more in line with reality.
IMHO, forget reporting on the Unrealized Gain. I have no idea what smoke and mirrors Quicken is doing to get at these numbers.

Unknown

Mindy said:

Tom,

Here is the report w/o the box checked.

I like your idea UKR, but unfortunately unrealized gain flows into my statement of net assets.

Unknown

FYI, in QWIN 2017 Premier: If you click on Reports, then select Net Worth & Balances, then click on Net Worth report is rendered. Clicking on the settings gear, click on Advanced, there is a check box to Include unrealized gains. I have tried both options and the report renders correctly for me. Maybe, they has been a recent update.

Unknown

Blue,
I can see my equity in this statement, but when I try to roll it forward from 2015 using the ending balance from the Statement of Changes in Net Assets, it is overstated.  It is because the unrealized gains are overstated.

Tom Young

I've not used the 2015 version, I'm using the 2016 version, but as a long time user of Quicken I've never seen a "Statement of Changes in Net Assets" report.

However, I do "prove" my accounting by running a Net Worth report at year end - all Accounts including hidden, all Categories including hidden, etc., and including unrealized gains - then take the difference between that Net Worth Report and the prior year's Net Worth report, and ensure that the difference agrees to a Spending report, (Income and expense by Category), for the year, configured similarly.  This has always worked with the two number within pennies of one another.  (I expect the small difference has to do with rounding going on in Quicken's calculation of unrealized gain.)

Are you saying that you are doing this and have identified the difference to an unrealized gain on that one security, a security that you've only owned, and sold, in 2016.?  Maybe a validation issue?

NotACPA

Tom Young said:

I've not used the 2015 version, I'm using the 2016 version, but as a long time user of Quicken I've never seen a "Statement of Changes in Net Assets" report.

However, I do "prove" my accounting by running a Net Worth report at year end - all Accounts including hidden, all Categories including hidden, etc., and including unrealized gains - then take the difference between that Net Worth Report and the prior year's Net Worth report, and ensure that the difference agrees to a Spending report, (Income and expense by Category), for the year, configured similarly.  This has always worked with the two number within pennies of one another.  (I expect the small difference has to do with rounding going on in Quicken's calculation of unrealized gain.)

Are you saying that you are doing this and have identified the difference to an unrealized gain on that one security, a security that you've only owned, and sold, in 2016.?  Maybe a validation issue?

I've never seen a NATIVE Q report by that name either.  Perhaps, Mindy, is this a report that you've customized and saved under that name?

Also, how was that "Transactions - Last Year" report produced?  Because it looks like a banking account report rather than an Investment account report.  Because I've never seen the "Num" or "Tag" columns in an investment report.

Unknown

Thanks all.  I have inherited this setup from my predecessor.  He must have built these reports.  I use Quicken to administer a company profit sharing plan.  The statement of Net Assets is the "balance sheet" and the statement of changes in net assets is the "income statement".  I have to present the two statement to auditors as part of compliance.  The beginning equity + net gain(loss) does not equal the ending equity.  It is off by the unrealized gain for the iShares equity.  Since all of the equity has been liquidated at 12/31/16, it shouldn't have an unrealized gain.  My goal is to remove this unrealized gain and balance the two statements.

Unknown

Tom Young said:

I've not used the 2015 version, I'm using the 2016 version, but as a long time user of Quicken I've never seen a "Statement of Changes in Net Assets" report.

However, I do "prove" my accounting by running a Net Worth report at year end - all Accounts including hidden, all Categories including hidden, etc., and including unrealized gains - then take the difference between that Net Worth Report and the prior year's Net Worth report, and ensure that the difference agrees to a Spending report, (Income and expense by Category), for the year, configured similarly.  This has always worked with the two number within pennies of one another.  (I expect the small difference has to do with rounding going on in Quicken's calculation of unrealized gain.)

Are you saying that you are doing this and have identified the difference to an unrealized gain on that one security, a security that you've only owned, and sold, in 2016.?  Maybe a validation issue?

Unknown

Tom Young said:

I've not used the 2015 version, I'm using the 2016 version, but as a long time user of Quicken I've never seen a "Statement of Changes in Net Assets" report.

However, I do "prove" my accounting by running a Net Worth report at year end - all Accounts including hidden, all Categories including hidden, etc., and including unrealized gains - then take the difference between that Net Worth Report and the prior year's Net Worth report, and ensure that the difference agrees to a Spending report, (Income and expense by Category), for the year, configured similarly.  This has always worked with the two number within pennies of one another.  (I expect the small difference has to do with rounding going on in Quicken's calculation of unrealized gain.)

Are you saying that you are doing this and have identified the difference to an unrealized gain on that one security, a security that you've only owned, and sold, in 2016.?  Maybe a validation issue?

Tom, that sounds like what I am doing.  How do I correct a validation error?

Tom Young

Tom Young said:

I've not used the 2015 version, I'm using the 2016 version, but as a long time user of Quicken I've never seen a "Statement of Changes in Net Assets" report.

However, I do "prove" my accounting by running a Net Worth report at year end - all Accounts including hidden, all Categories including hidden, etc., and including unrealized gains - then take the difference between that Net Worth Report and the prior year's Net Worth report, and ensure that the difference agrees to a Spending report, (Income and expense by Category), for the year, configured similarly.  This has always worked with the two number within pennies of one another.  (I expect the small difference has to do with rounding going on in Quicken's calculation of unrealized gain.)

Are you saying that you are doing this and have identified the difference to an unrealized gain on that one security, a security that you've only owned, and sold, in 2016.?  Maybe a validation issue?

UKR's second answer here:

https://getsatisfaction.com/quickencommunity/topics/budget-report-does-not-reflect-some-entries-corr...

give the step by step "best practices" for validating a file.

q_lurker

I realize you are getting a lot of direction from a variety of users.  This reply is intended as FWIW and as information - to the OP (Mindy) and to the other repliers.

For most reports where Unrealized Gains are chosen to be computed, Quicken will look at each price change of the security and compute an 'unrealized gain' for the security based on that price and the prior price.  That could be a frequent as daily or possibly end of each month - all depending on the price history data on file.  

I have a vague recollection that changes in share quantity may generate bad numbers for that computation.  That is, the Unrealized Gain = Yesterdays shares x (todays price - yesterdays price) even though some shares were sold today (unrealized gains became realized) at a different price.  That error (if it really was one) may have been corrected in more recent versions.  

My general assessment would be to include Unrealized Gains only with great caution and suitable cross-checks.  I would not think it would be relevant to generating income statements and balance sheets.  I have not attempted at this time to follow all the comments offered.

HTH

Tom Young

That might have been the case somewhere along the line, though I have proofs of my accounting going back into the 90's without this problem cropping up.  Although I've never been an active trader I doubt that any of those years didn't have quite a few "Buys" and at least a few "Solds".

I've always assumed that Quicken didn't actually carry unrealized gains and losses in its data base but instead calculated those amounts when called upon to do so, and I've never understood why clicking through to the "detail" shows a figure for every day that there's a market price.

Unknown

Good news!  The validation process fixed the error...however... it created a new one.  The equities on my statements are missing about $200K in transactions.  They are accurate in the holdings screen.

Tom Young

Mindy said:

Good news!  The validation process fixed the error...however... it created a new one.  The equities on my statements are missing about $200K in transactions.  They are accurate in the holdings screen.

I assume by "my statements" you are referring to Net Worth or Account Balances reports?  Any chance that Customize > Securities reveals some unchecked securities?

Unknown

Mindy said:

Good news!  The validation process fixed the error...however... it created a new one.  The equities on my statements are missing about $200K in transactions.  They are accurate in the holdings screen.

Net worth.  The boxes are all checked.