Share balance in 401(k) register does not match Online Center

Unknown
Unknown Member
edited January 2019 in Investing (Windows)
I am using Quicken Premier 2018 in Windows 10. I have a Vanguard 401(k) account where the Vanguard Institutional Index Fund Institutional Plus Shares were switched to Vanguard Institutional 500 Index Fund Trust Shares. The account register shows .0002 shares of the original fund but Online Center shows 0 share. I have run Super Validate & Repair several times, but nothing fixes this issues. Please advise.

Comments

  • UKR
    UKR SuperUser ✭✭✭✭✭
    edited January 2019
    Online Center shows what the brokerage is reporting as of the last transaction and holdings download.
    Somehow, somewhere, the last Sell transaction or one or more of the prior Buy transactions were not recorded properly, with the share quantity entered to exactly three decimal places for a mutual fund.
    You may even have a Placeholder transaction in your register begging for a fix.
  • markus1957
    markus1957 SuperUser, Windows Beta Beta
    edited March 2018
    UKR said:

    Online Center shows what the brokerage is reporting as of the last transaction and holdings download.
    Somehow, somewhere, the last Sell transaction or one or more of the prior Buy transactions were not recorded properly, with the share quantity entered to exactly three decimal places for a mutual fund.
    You may even have a Placeholder transaction in your register begging for a fix.

    Assuming the transactions were recorded as a Sell and then a Buy, I would edit the Sell transaction and click the box to "sell all shares". That should clear out the fraction of a share. The original Vanguard Sell probably came down as a fixed number of shares and that fractional leftover share likely accumulated over time as a result of rounding.
  • Quicken_Tyka
    Quicken_Tyka Moderator mod
    edited July 2018
    Hey Rick,

    Were you able to resolve the fractional shares issue using the ideas above?

    Let us know if you need more steps or more clarification to get this taken care of!

    -Quicken Tyka
    ~~~***~~~
  • Unknown
    Unknown Member
    edited January 2019
    Hello Tyka,

    Yes, I am still having the issue with the residual fractional share. The fractional shares resulted when Vanguard switched the Vanguard Institutional Index Fund Institutional Plus Shares for the Vanguard Institutional 500 Index Fund Trust Shares. The transactions download from Vanguard as Shares Added and Shares Removed. When I updated my 401(k), these transactions created a Placeholder transaction requiring me to add 0.0002 shares since Quicken showed -0.0002 shares less than what Vanguard reported. After adding the 0.0002 shares, I checked Online Center and it my holding in Quicken matched my holdings at Vanguard. When I clicked the Investing tab, it showed the 0.0002 fractional shares of Vanguard Institutional Index Fund Institutional Plus Shares fund that should have been 0. When I deleted the transaction, Online Center says Quicken is -0.0002 shares than Vanguard. I have tried adjusting one of the original Vanguard transactions and it creates the same issue. Super Validate & Repair does not fix the issue. Adding/Deleting shares to get Online Center in balance, creates residual fractional shares in the account. At this point, I do not know what else to try.

    Thank you,

    Rick
  • Quicken_Tyka
    Quicken_Tyka Moderator mod
    edited July 2018
    Hey Rick,

    Thank you for your response.

    If you are unable to add an adjustment to 0 out the amount of shares, the Financial institution is reporting this data incorrectly.

    Brokerage accounts use a direct connect method that means we don't have access to the information that is being reported incorrectly.

    I would recommend contacting them directly.

    -Quicken Tyka
    ~~~***~~~
  • markus1957
    markus1957 SuperUser, Windows Beta Beta
    edited March 2018
    Rick said:

    Hello Tyka,

    Yes, I am still having the issue with the residual fractional share. The fractional shares resulted when Vanguard switched the Vanguard Institutional Index Fund Institutional Plus Shares for the Vanguard Institutional 500 Index Fund Trust Shares. The transactions download from Vanguard as Shares Added and Shares Removed. When I updated my 401(k), these transactions created a Placeholder transaction requiring me to add 0.0002 shares since Quicken showed -0.0002 shares less than what Vanguard reported. After adding the 0.0002 shares, I checked Online Center and it my holding in Quicken matched my holdings at Vanguard. When I clicked the Investing tab, it showed the 0.0002 fractional shares of Vanguard Institutional Index Fund Institutional Plus Shares fund that should have been 0. When I deleted the transaction, Online Center says Quicken is -0.0002 shares than Vanguard. I have tried adjusting one of the original Vanguard transactions and it creates the same issue. Super Validate & Repair does not fix the issue. Adding/Deleting shares to get Online Center in balance, creates residual fractional shares in the account. At this point, I do not know what else to try.

    Thank you,

    Rick

    Did you try recalculating investment lots when you validated the file? It Appears the lots table is sideways if different share balances are being carried. Did you check Show hidden entries" in Preferences? Is the placeholder deleted?
  • Unknown
    Unknown Member
    edited March 2018
    Rick said:

    Hello Tyka,

    Yes, I am still having the issue with the residual fractional share. The fractional shares resulted when Vanguard switched the Vanguard Institutional Index Fund Institutional Plus Shares for the Vanguard Institutional 500 Index Fund Trust Shares. The transactions download from Vanguard as Shares Added and Shares Removed. When I updated my 401(k), these transactions created a Placeholder transaction requiring me to add 0.0002 shares since Quicken showed -0.0002 shares less than what Vanguard reported. After adding the 0.0002 shares, I checked Online Center and it my holding in Quicken matched my holdings at Vanguard. When I clicked the Investing tab, it showed the 0.0002 fractional shares of Vanguard Institutional Index Fund Institutional Plus Shares fund that should have been 0. When I deleted the transaction, Online Center says Quicken is -0.0002 shares than Vanguard. I have tried adjusting one of the original Vanguard transactions and it creates the same issue. Super Validate & Repair does not fix the issue. Adding/Deleting shares to get Online Center in balance, creates residual fractional shares in the account. At this point, I do not know what else to try.

    Thank you,

    Rick

    When I ran Validate & Repair, I checked 'Super validate file' and 'Rebuild investing lots'. In Preferences, I do have 'Show Hidden Entries' checked. When I delete the placeholder entry, Online Center says Vanguard is 0 and Quicken is -0.0002. When I add the placeholder back in, Online Center says Vanguard is 0 and Quicken is 0, but when I click on the Investing tab, it shows the fund with 0.0002 shares instead of being removed from the portfolio..
  • Unknown
    Unknown Member
    edited March 2018
    Whenever I have contacted Vanguard about an issue where Quicken is involved, I am always told that they are sending the data correctly and to contact Quicken. 
  • markus1957
    markus1957 SuperUser, Windows Beta Beta
    edited March 2018
    Rick said:

    Hello Tyka,

    Yes, I am still having the issue with the residual fractional share. The fractional shares resulted when Vanguard switched the Vanguard Institutional Index Fund Institutional Plus Shares for the Vanguard Institutional 500 Index Fund Trust Shares. The transactions download from Vanguard as Shares Added and Shares Removed. When I updated my 401(k), these transactions created a Placeholder transaction requiring me to add 0.0002 shares since Quicken showed -0.0002 shares less than what Vanguard reported. After adding the 0.0002 shares, I checked Online Center and it my holding in Quicken matched my holdings at Vanguard. When I clicked the Investing tab, it showed the 0.0002 fractional shares of Vanguard Institutional Index Fund Institutional Plus Shares fund that should have been 0. When I deleted the transaction, Online Center says Quicken is -0.0002 shares than Vanguard. I have tried adjusting one of the original Vanguard transactions and it creates the same issue. Super Validate & Repair does not fix the issue. Adding/Deleting shares to get Online Center in balance, creates residual fractional shares in the account. At this point, I do not know what else to try.

    Thank you,

    Rick

    My advice-
    1. Delete the placeholder.
    2. Delete the Remove Shares transaction
    3. Close Quicken
    4. Open Quicken and run OSU
    5. Open Online Center, Compare and make note of the number of shares to Remove
    6. Manually enter a Remove Shares for the shares in #5
    7. Check all is right in Online Center and Investment Portfolio Holdings
  • Unknown
    Unknown Member
    edited March 2018
    Rick said:

    Hello Tyka,

    Yes, I am still having the issue with the residual fractional share. The fractional shares resulted when Vanguard switched the Vanguard Institutional Index Fund Institutional Plus Shares for the Vanguard Institutional 500 Index Fund Trust Shares. The transactions download from Vanguard as Shares Added and Shares Removed. When I updated my 401(k), these transactions created a Placeholder transaction requiring me to add 0.0002 shares since Quicken showed -0.0002 shares less than what Vanguard reported. After adding the 0.0002 shares, I checked Online Center and it my holding in Quicken matched my holdings at Vanguard. When I clicked the Investing tab, it showed the 0.0002 fractional shares of Vanguard Institutional Index Fund Institutional Plus Shares fund that should have been 0. When I deleted the transaction, Online Center says Quicken is -0.0002 shares than Vanguard. I have tried adjusting one of the original Vanguard transactions and it creates the same issue. Super Validate & Repair does not fix the issue. Adding/Deleting shares to get Online Center in balance, creates residual fractional shares in the account. At this point, I do not know what else to try.

    Thank you,

    Rick

    Thank you for the info! What is OSU?
  • Jim_Harman
    Jim_Harman SuperUser ✭✭✭✭✭
    edited March 2018
    Rick said:

    Hello Tyka,

    Yes, I am still having the issue with the residual fractional share. The fractional shares resulted when Vanguard switched the Vanguard Institutional Index Fund Institutional Plus Shares for the Vanguard Institutional 500 Index Fund Trust Shares. The transactions download from Vanguard as Shares Added and Shares Removed. When I updated my 401(k), these transactions created a Placeholder transaction requiring me to add 0.0002 shares since Quicken showed -0.0002 shares less than what Vanguard reported. After adding the 0.0002 shares, I checked Online Center and it my holding in Quicken matched my holdings at Vanguard. When I clicked the Investing tab, it showed the 0.0002 fractional shares of Vanguard Institutional Index Fund Institutional Plus Shares fund that should have been 0. When I deleted the transaction, Online Center says Quicken is -0.0002 shares than Vanguard. I have tried adjusting one of the original Vanguard transactions and it creates the same issue. Super Validate & Repair does not fix the issue. Adding/Deleting shares to get Online Center in balance, creates residual fractional shares in the account. At this point, I do not know what else to try.

    Thank you,

    Rick

    OSU = One Step Update
    QWin Premier subscription
  • Unknown
    Unknown Member
    edited March 2018
    Rick said:

    Hello Tyka,

    Yes, I am still having the issue with the residual fractional share. The fractional shares resulted when Vanguard switched the Vanguard Institutional Index Fund Institutional Plus Shares for the Vanguard Institutional 500 Index Fund Trust Shares. The transactions download from Vanguard as Shares Added and Shares Removed. When I updated my 401(k), these transactions created a Placeholder transaction requiring me to add 0.0002 shares since Quicken showed -0.0002 shares less than what Vanguard reported. After adding the 0.0002 shares, I checked Online Center and it my holding in Quicken matched my holdings at Vanguard. When I clicked the Investing tab, it showed the 0.0002 fractional shares of Vanguard Institutional Index Fund Institutional Plus Shares fund that should have been 0. When I deleted the transaction, Online Center says Quicken is -0.0002 shares than Vanguard. I have tried adjusting one of the original Vanguard transactions and it creates the same issue. Super Validate & Repair does not fix the issue. Adding/Deleting shares to get Online Center in balance, creates residual fractional shares in the account. At this point, I do not know what else to try.

    Thank you,

    Rick

    I followed the steps and it did not work. I still ended up with fractional shares albeit a different amount. Any other suggestions? I have installed the latest updated and ran another Super Validate & Repair, but the 0.0002 fractional shares remain.
  • markus1957
    markus1957 SuperUser, Windows Beta Beta
    edited March 2018
    Rick said:

    Hello Tyka,

    Yes, I am still having the issue with the residual fractional share. The fractional shares resulted when Vanguard switched the Vanguard Institutional Index Fund Institutional Plus Shares for the Vanguard Institutional 500 Index Fund Trust Shares. The transactions download from Vanguard as Shares Added and Shares Removed. When I updated my 401(k), these transactions created a Placeholder transaction requiring me to add 0.0002 shares since Quicken showed -0.0002 shares less than what Vanguard reported. After adding the 0.0002 shares, I checked Online Center and it my holding in Quicken matched my holdings at Vanguard. When I clicked the Investing tab, it showed the 0.0002 fractional shares of Vanguard Institutional Index Fund Institutional Plus Shares fund that should have been 0. When I deleted the transaction, Online Center says Quicken is -0.0002 shares than Vanguard. I have tried adjusting one of the original Vanguard transactions and it creates the same issue. Super Validate & Repair does not fix the issue. Adding/Deleting shares to get Online Center in balance, creates residual fractional shares in the account. At this point, I do not know what else to try.

    Thank you,

    Rick

    I'm running out of ideas. That is pretty weird. Have you verified there are no other placeholders in the register? Replace any with manual entries or modify the original downloads with matching values.

    The only other thing I can suggest is to go to Preferences and set up reports to display maximum decimal point places (6). Then run a customized Investment Transactions report filtered for the problem account and security. Check for any entries that might be suspicious. You could go so far as to export to Excel to see what share total is reported there versus in Quicken.

    Maybe one more thing. You might try changing the Remove/Add transactions to Sell/Buy transactions. It's a 401k so there are no Cap Gains tax consequences to worry about. Sell has an option to sell all shares and view the underlying lots table for any errors.
  • Unknown
    Unknown Member
    edited April 2018
    Rick said:

    Hello Tyka,

    Yes, I am still having the issue with the residual fractional share. The fractional shares resulted when Vanguard switched the Vanguard Institutional Index Fund Institutional Plus Shares for the Vanguard Institutional 500 Index Fund Trust Shares. The transactions download from Vanguard as Shares Added and Shares Removed. When I updated my 401(k), these transactions created a Placeholder transaction requiring me to add 0.0002 shares since Quicken showed -0.0002 shares less than what Vanguard reported. After adding the 0.0002 shares, I checked Online Center and it my holding in Quicken matched my holdings at Vanguard. When I clicked the Investing tab, it showed the 0.0002 fractional shares of Vanguard Institutional Index Fund Institutional Plus Shares fund that should have been 0. When I deleted the transaction, Online Center says Quicken is -0.0002 shares than Vanguard. I have tried adjusting one of the original Vanguard transactions and it creates the same issue. Super Validate & Repair does not fix the issue. Adding/Deleting shares to get Online Center in balance, creates residual fractional shares in the account. At this point, I do not know what else to try.

    Thank you,

    Rick

    I finally eliminated the fractional shares. I checked Online Center and it showed Quicken was .0002 shares less than Vanguard. I adjusted the last transaction where Vanguard removed the fund and reduced it by this fractional amount. I checked Online Center and both accounts were in balance. I checked my holdings via the Investing tab, which now showed .00013 fractional shares. I adjust the last transaction again by this fractional amount. I checked Online Center again and continued the process of adjusting the fractional from the last transaction until Online Center was in balance and the fund did not show up in my holdings. Apparently somewhere in the process, Quicken or Vanguard made adjustments out to five decimal places and this was causing the issue when the fund was replaced by another furn. Thank you for all of your help and suggestions!!
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