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Vanguard accounts - Conversion Issue

jms2106
jms2106 Member ✭✭
edited September 2019 in Investing (Windows)
Vanguard recently converted all of our accounts from mutual fund type accounts to brokerage style accounts. Two of three accounts converted without issue. The account that did convert well not was actually two accounts, a mutual fund style account and a brokerage fund style account. The balances from the mutual fund account were transferred into the brokerage account but the accounts were not merged.

Without going into a lot of detail the bottom line issue is this: My new Vanguard account # was not added by Quicken. Instead they continue to use the old Vanguard # while Vanguard sees the new number as the primary account. I can update and balance my new account # by deactivating online access for my old account # and adding that # to my new brokerage account in the online update screen of the account information. In the process though, I have lost all my past mutual fund transactions going back 20 years and they no longer appear even in my old account. I have spoken at length with Quicken and Vanguard and so far they have offered no solutions.

Comments

  • Tom Young
    Tom Young SuperUser ✭✭✭✭✭
    This is a bit hard to follow but this sentence: "The balances from the mutual fund account were transferred into the brokerage account but the accounts were not merged" suggests that Vanguard transferred the shares from the mutual fund account to the existing brokerage fund account, (an Account that presumably already existed in Quicken), but that the history of the old mutual fund account was not made a part of the brokerage accounts.
    But then you throw in "My new Vanguard account number was not added by Quicken."  What "new Vanguard account number" are you referring to?  Is the reality that the "old" mutual fund account and the "old" brokerage account all moved to a "new" brokerage account?  The flow here isn't clear.
    If a new brokerage account was established by Vanguard then you need to either:
    1. Create a new Account in Quicken for the new Vanguard account, or
    2. Continue to use the old Quicken Vanguard brokerage Account but deactivate/reactivate downloads to get the new Vanguard account to link to the old Quicken Vanguard brokerage Account.
    "Quicken" does not add Accounts, only "you" add Accounts to Quicken.
  • jms2106
    jms2106 Member ✭✭
    Sorry for the confusion but it was a confusing process :

    1)There were 2 separate accounts - Account A (mutual fund) and Account B (brokerage style account), both had separate transactions.
    2) Since Account B was already a brokerage style account (the format desired) they used it and gave it new account name C
    3) They transferred the fund/fund balances from A into C (formerly B).
    4) C (formerly B) retained it's original transactions with the addition of the fund balances from A
    5) The historical transactions from A were not transferred to C but are no longer in account A.
    6) Quicken does not recognize Account C as a Vanguard account
  • Tom Young
    Tom Young SuperUser ✭✭✭✭✭
    edited September 2019
    "2) Since Account B was already a brokerage style account (the format desired) they used it and gave it new account name C"
    I'd say you have two choices here, after making a backup:
    1. Create a new Quicken Account named C, do a transfer of balances - securities and cash - from Account B to Account C and then establish Account C for downloading from Vanguard into Quicken.  That leaves the history of transactions in Account B and establishes all holdings in Account C with proper cost bases and acquisition dates.
    2. Deactivate Account B for downloading from Vanguard, change the Account name, then reactivate downloading, LINKING the new "C" account at Vanguard to your to established Account.
    "3) They transferred the fund/fund balances from A into C (formerly B )."

    I'm sure Vanguard did that within their own system, the question is "How was that process handled in Quicken?" 

    "4) C (formerly B ) retained it's original transactions with the addition of the fund balances from A"

    I believe you're expressly addressing what went on up a Vanguard?  That's how it should appear in Quicken also.

    "5) The historical transactions from A were not transferred to C but are no longer in account A."

    The last half of that sentence simply doesn't make sense and should not have occurred.  How "recent" is recently?  If we're talking about a few days here and the transaction volume in your other Quicken Accounts is low, then going back to the last good backup before this happened and taking another stab at the changeover.

    "6) Quicken does not recognize Account C as a Vanguard account"

    I'm not sure what that means.  Are you saying that you've tried the deactivate/reactivate process with the old B Account or trying to establish connectivity between Vanguard and a new Quicken C Account and Quicken doesn't find the C account up at Vanguard?
  • TimIsbell
    TimIsbell Member ✭✭
    I have one Quicken file that includes a lot of Vanguard mutual fund data going back to at least 2005. I've never had a brokerage account in my Quicken and it's linked with Vanguard very nicely for a long time. But Vanguard is about to convert me to a brokerage account. I don't need this, but they are doing it with everyone. So I'm worried about what I may run into when this conversion triggers. Any best practices would be greatly appreciated!

    Tim
  • TimIsbell
    TimIsbell Member ✭✭
    I have two Vanguard mutual fund accounts, one is a retirement account and the other is an investment account.
  • volvogirl
    volvogirl SuperUser ✭✭✭✭
    I have Vanguard Mutual funds too.  What's this about changing to a brokerage account?  I haven't heard of that.  Did you get a letter in the mail?  Is it just for your retirement account?  Is it a IRA or a 401K Account?
  • GeoffG
    GeoffG SuperUser ✭✭✭✭✭
    I went through the brokerage conversion, but it's been a year or two. As I recall, I created a new brokerage account in Quicken. In hind sight, I believe I should have deactivated Vanguard when the new account tries to download/activate and link to the existing.
    user since '92 | Quicken Windows Premier - Subscription | Windows 10 Pro version 20H2
  • Greg_the_Geek
    Greg_the_Geek SuperUser, Windows Beta ✭✭✭✭✭
    I went through the same conversion. I did as @GeoffG suggested, and deactivated/reactivated Online Services for my Vanguard accounts. I just linked them to existing accounts though when reactivating, the old account numbers were still showing.
    Quicken Subscription HBRP - Windows 10
  • TimIsbell
    TimIsbell Member ✭✭
    Volvogirl: When I was helping a new college grad set up a Vanguard investment account there was no option to open just a mutual fund account. The only way was to open a brokerage account.

    I called Vanguard Flagship line and learned that Vanguard is moving everyone to brokerage accounts on some schedule. I see the function to do the conversion now on my Vanguard accounts, but I'm delaying until I understand how to do it without messing up my Quicken functions and history.

    So... I'm pretty confident this is coming for everyone with a Vanguard mutual fund account(s). It's just a matter of when they get around to your account(s).
  • volvogirl
    volvogirl SuperUser ✭✭✭✭
    Thanks for the info and heads up.  Guess I'll call them and see.
  • Ps56k2
    Ps56k2 SuperUser ✭✭✭✭✭
    edited September 2019
    It may only be for new accts setup...
    I went thru this type of acct migration or new acct setup recently with Schwab.
    Also, on Fidelity when I did a Roth IRA Conversion - and had to create a new Roth IRA Brokerage acct, but I couldn't perform the conversion from my existing IRA legacy acct to the new Roth IRA Brokerage acct (had to call to complete the conversion)
    Just sent a message to Vanguard - so will see what they say -
    My Quicken files show an old Vanguard conversion for me - back in 2009 -

    Quicken 2020 Deluxe - Subscription - Windows 10
  • TimIsbell
    TimIsbell Member ✭✭
    ps56k I hope you're right, but two different V Flagship reps on two different phone calls a couple of weeks apart told me a required conversion of all mutual fund accounts to brokerage accounts is coming.
  • Ps56k2
    Ps56k2 SuperUser ✭✭✭✭✭
    BTW - here is the reply I received from Vanguard on the question of migration of legacy mutual fund accounts to their brokerage platform.

    Hi XXX,
    
    Thank you for taking the time to contact us regarding our brokerage
    platform and I hope all is well.
    
    We are encouraging our clients to transition to our brokerage platform,
    however we will not forcibly make the change for you. There is no date or
    timeline to reference as we are not forcibly making this change.
    
    If you were interested in upgrading to our brokerage platform, you may do
    so by following these instructions:
    
    1. Log on to vanguard.com.
    2. Navigate to the "Open an Account" link at the top right of the website
    near the search box.
    3. Retrieve your draft.
    4. Click the e-sign button to confirm the request.
    
    Please let us know if I can provide any further clarification or if I can
    answer any follow-up questions.
    
    Additionally, you can speak to one of our knowledgeable Flagship Services
    representatives directly at 800-345-1344 business days from 8 a.m. to 9
    p.m., Eastern time.
    
    Best regards,
    
    Ryan Mastilak
    Registered Representative
    Vanguard Flagship Services

    Quicken 2020 Deluxe - Subscription - Windows 10
  • Jim_Harman
    Jim_Harman SuperUser ✭✭✭✭✭
    Vanguard is gradually converting all legacy mutual fund only accounts to brokerage accounts. Brokerage is the only option for new accounts.  They are putting more pressure on smaller account holders to convert and holding off for now on Flagship and higher customers.

    If you have the option, I would stick with the legacy mutual fund account for as long as possible, because the integration of the brokerage accounts with Quicken is still a little quirky and the mutual fund accounts still have more options for how deposits and distributions are handled.

    On the other hand, if you want one account that can hold mutual funds, ETFs, and individual stocks, you will want a brokerage account.
    QWin Premier subscription
  • volvogirl
    volvogirl SuperUser ✭✭✭✭
    Hey, I've been trying to log into my Vanguard account to see if it says anything about this but it keeps saying Unavailable and try later.  Anyone else getting that?  Should I call them?  
  • Jim_Harman
    Jim_Harman SuperUser ✭✭✭✭✭
    it is working for me at 7:30pm Eastern
    QWin Premier subscription
  • jms2106
    jms2106 Member ✭✭
    Jim_Harman - good advice but just a little too late. I am a Flagship customer and we have a Vanguard advisor. He's been great about working through this issue with me with Vanguard's Quicken expert technician. Bottom line, Vanguard is at the root of the issue. but Quicken and Vanguard do not have a good relationship and now Quickens limitations are creating issues for me, compounding Vanguards miscue. Now I'm trying to find a workaround. I put off converting as long as possible, I've been involved in file conversion processes before and there are ALWAYS unintended consequence.

    The issue for me turns out to be that prior to conversion I had an old Brokerage account and an old style mutual fund account. Vanguard did not realize that in Quicken you cannot link more than one account to a primary account and without batting an eye, selected my old brokerage account to be the converted file. The result is the only transactions I show in my new account are the ones from the old brokerage account plus the stock/balance transfer from my IRA. In fact, my new Vanguard Brokerage style account number does not even show up in the file log for downloads or as a valid Vanguard.

    To make matters worse, you apparently cannot import even the last 18 months of transactions into the new Quicken account because either Vanguard or Quicken has flagged them as "old" or already transferred. I've spent hours on the phone with both Vanguard and Quicken and still no IRA transactions. Both are casting the blame on each other - a typical "he said, she said" dilemma.
This discussion has been closed.