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Simple Investing - Net Worth is wrong - Fidelity quotes reset to $1

Michael Zierdt

Tried Simple Investing Beta for all my investing accounts including retirement, then looked at my Home screen, Net Worth by assets and liabilities and the current amount dropped by 80% while the Year ago did not. Glad I did a backup first.

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Rocket J Squirrel

You can just edit the price histories. Easiest would be to delete the $1 prices, turn off Simple Investing, and move on.

The data in the OFX log has the correct closing prices from yesterday, so this is a Quicken bug. Hey, they told you it was "beta". This OFX log fragment is from today:

<SECINFO><SECID><UNIQUEID>316389303<UNIQUEIDTYPE>CUSIP</SECID><SECNAME>FIDELITY BLUE CHIP GROWTH<TICKER>FBGRX<UNITPRICE>148.4500000<DTASOF>20201024033009.000[-4:EDT]<CURRENCY><CURRATE>1.000<CURSYM>USD </CURRENCY></SECINFO>

Boatnmaniac

So, the question remains: Why is it that the 10/24 date and the $1.00/share issues are only present when Simple Investing is enabled?

I set up a new test file today with Simple Investing not enabled and downloaded prices from Fidelity. No 10/24 dated prices and no $1.00/share prices (except for MMFs).

I then enabled Simple Investing and downloaded prices from Fidelity, again. 10/24 prices were downloaded and all of them were $1.00/share.

The exact same results in two different test files on two different days. Something is amiss with Simple Investing.

Update: I double checked my main file with Simple Investing not enabled. Downloaded prices from Fidelity and this issue with 10/24 $1.00 prices was not observed.

All comments

Michael Zierdt

Retried the Beta - it seems ok - probably Quicken was recalculating after conversion to Beta.

Michael Zierdt

This morning I did my usual One Step Update, appeared to work but all of the Fidelity mutual fund quotes are = $1.00. I did not see any errors and tried to go to Investing / download quotes and still nothing. Looking at my accounts at Fidelity the prices appear correct. One ETF quote downloaded, not from Fidelity, is correct.

Boatnmaniac

Odd. I just ran OSU a few minutes ago and all securities quotes (for stocks, mutual funds and ETFs) from Fidelity appear to have downloaded properly with the only $1/share prices being for money market funds (as it should be). Maybe something in your download got corrupted? You could try restoring a recent backup file and running OSU, again, to see if you get better results.

Michael Zierdt

Number of shares match. Price for an ETF is correct. All other mutual fund prices are = $1.00. All was OK after yesterday's (Friday 10/23/220) update.
Did a restore from a manual backup from Thursday (10/22/2020), Prices and net worth looked looked good then
Went to investing "Update Quotes" looked good (fyi: I am using the simple investing Beta)
Did a One Step Update, and prices went back to $1.00
Did another Update Quotes and still $1.00

Rocket J Squirrel

Yes, I see this also when using Simple Investing. Reverting to normal does not restore the prices.

You can delete or edit the erroneous prices in the price histories or restore a backup from before you switched to Simple Investing.

Michael Zierdt

Funny that it worked Thursday, there was not a Quicken update after (Quicken Deluxe Ver R29.22), and now it fails. I switched to the beta several weeks ago so I hate to have find an older backup and reenter my data.

Rocket J Squirrel

You can just edit the price histories. Easiest would be to delete the $1 prices, turn off Simple Investing, and move on.

The data in the OFX log has the correct closing prices from yesterday, so this is a Quicken bug. Hey, they told you it was "beta". This OFX log fragment is from today:

Michael Zierdt

What I did is I clicked on Investing, the Security, More, Edit Price History, Todays Price and changed it from 1 to correct price. It only failed today so I had only 1 price per security to fix. And since I believe in the "Efficient Market Hypothesis" (Bogelhead?) I only have 7 securities (index funds) to correct.

Chris_QPW

I just tried this and see it to. Note though it only with my Fidelity mutual fund, not with any of my Vanguard funds.

Looking at the two in the OFX log I wonder if Quicken is picking up the CURRATE when it should be picking up UNITPRICE.

Image: https://us.v-cdn.net/6031128/uploads/editor/l3/im7pyjmrtvho.png

Image: https://us.v-cdn.net/6031128/uploads/editor/b1/wtxtanay0ae3.png

Boatnmaniac

I'm seeing this, too, with Fidelity when I have Simple Investing Beta enabled and turned on in my test file.

@Chris_QPW 's observation about Quicken perhaps picking up on the CURRATE instead of on the share price might just be spot on.

But what also caught my attention: Why are any prices being downloaded dated for today (10/24) at all? Today is Saturday and the markets are closed. This is not a matter or which price is right and which one is wrong. There should be no prices downloaded with today's date. The latest prices that should have been downloaded should be for 10/23. I went back into my quotes downloads for the last couple of months and there were no downloaded prices dated for weekend days nor holidays...which is as it should be. So why is Fidelity now downloading prices for dates that are not applicable?

Chris_QPW

Boatnmaniac said:

But what also caught my attention: Why are any prices being downloaded dated for today (10/24) at all? Today is Saturday and the markets are closed. This is not a matter or which price is right and which one is wrong. There should be no prices downloaded with today's date. The latest prices that should have been downloaded should be for 10/23. I went back into my quotes downloads for the last couple of months and there were no downloaded prices dated for weekend days nor holidays...which is as it should be. So why is Fidelity now downloading prices for dates that are not applicable?

That is because Fidelity and a few other financial institution have had such a problem in their downloads for years (if not forever).

Fidelity doesn't update their mutual fund prices until early the next morning. So the 23rds price is update on the 24th and given that date instead of the 23rd.

This problem is "covered up" by the fact that Quicken will download the price from its quote provider and override this "stale price". Just a while ago when they changed the order by mistake and the "stale price" was being use there were long threads about this problem.

I also thought to bring up this as a possible problem and why Fidelity might fail and Vanguard doesn't, but you will notice that even though the price is "stale" it isn't 1.00, so that really doesn't explain how Quicken came up with 1.00.

Boatnmaniac

So, the question remains: Why is it that the 10/24 date and the $1.00/share issues are only present when Simple Investing is enabled?

I set up a new test file today with Simple Investing not enabled and downloaded prices from Fidelity. No 10/24 dated prices and no $1.00/share prices (except for MMFs).

I then enabled Simple Investing and downloaded prices from Fidelity, again. 10/24 prices were downloaded and all of them were $1.00/share.

The exact same results in two different test files on two different days. Something is amiss with Simple Investing.

Update: I double checked my main file with Simple Investing not enabled. Downloaded prices from Fidelity and this issue with 10/24 $1.00 prices was not observed.

Ps56k2

Not sure of all the facets....
- just updated to R29.22 -
- had clicked Simple Tracking for a few Fidelity IRA accounts
- it only affects Fidelity securities
- it is Monday

Have selected Simple Tracking for a few Fidelity accounts, not all.
Did the usual full OSU after performing the R29.22 update.

- Fidelity security within an account with Simple Tracking was reset with quote price of $1.00
(and yes, the security quote/price list was showing a downloaded price of $1.00 - which is wrong.... as the quote price download doesn't happen till after market close - appears to be a "placeholder")
- Fidelity 403b account was totally messed up - actual security was gone, and "cash" as listed in error

[NOTE} - In the screen grab - this account was NOT using Simple Tracking,
but the 2 bad ($1) entries were also in another IRA that WAS using Simple Tracking.

EDIT ----

Updated the topic title to include the reference to Fidelity and quote of $1.00

Ps56k2

should merge into ....

https://community.quicken.com/discussion/7882323/tried-simple-investing-beta-now-net-worth-is-wrong-fidelity-quotes-set-to-1

Rocket J Squirrel

Boatnmaniac said:

So, the question remains: Why is it that the 10/24 date and the $1.00/share issues are only present when Simple Investing is enabled?
I set up a new test file today with Simple Investing not enabled and downloaded prices from Fidelity. No 10/24 dated prices and no $1.00/share prices (except for MMFs).
I then enabled Simple Investing and downloaded prices from Fidelity, again. 10/24 prices were downloaded and all of them were $1.00/share.
The exact same results in two different test files on two different days. Something is amiss with Simple Investing.
Update: I double checked my main file with Simple Investing not enabled. Downloaded prices from Fidelity and this issue with 10/24 $1.00 prices was not observed.

My guess is that some computation inside Simple Investing is preparing for download by initializing prices to $1 and dates to today. Then, when there is truly no new price (because it's the weekend or whatever), that initialization remains uncorrected. Why this is only happening with Fidelity mutual funds is not evident to me.

Michael Zierdt

FYI: It also happened with PIMCO INCOME FUND INSTITUTIONAL FUND (PIMIX) which I purchased and track through my Fidelity accounts

Boatnmaniac

Rocket J Squirrel said:

Boatnmaniac said:

So, the question remains: Why is it that the 10/24 date and the $1.00/share issues are only present when Simple Investing is enabled?
I set up a new test file today with Simple Investing not enabled and downloaded prices from Fidelity. No 10/24 dated prices and no $1.00/share prices (except for MMFs).
I then enabled Simple Investing and downloaded prices from Fidelity, again. 10/24 prices were downloaded and all of them were $1.00/share.
The exact same results in two different test files on two different days. Something is amiss with Simple Investing.
Update: I double checked my main file with Simple Investing not enabled. Downloaded prices from Fidelity and this issue with 10/24 $1.00 prices was not observed.

My guess is that some computation inside Simple Investing is preparing for download by initializing prices to $1 and dates to today. Then, when there is truly no new price (because it's the weekend or whatever), that initialization remains uncorrected. Why this is only happening with Fidelity mutual funds is not evident to me.

But, when I set up the test file yesterday (10/25) and downloaded the quotes they were dated 10/24, not 10/25.

I haven't tried downloading quotes into the test file today. I'll do that later tonight and report back here with what happens.

BTW, I'm seeing this with all MFs I have Fidelity, not just Fidelity MFs. It is something that appears to be tied to the FI doing the download, not with the MF company.

Chris_QPW

Boatnmaniac said:

BTW, I'm seeing this with all MFs I have Fidelity, not just Fidelity MFs. It is something that appears to be tied to the FI doing the download, not with the MF company.

It really is just speculation on our part because we can't see the innerworkings, but the problem with "stale" prices wasn't limited to Fidelity, it was just the "most used" one that came up.

The developers just need to dig into it. I'm sure that now that it is a known problem it really shouldn't be that hard for them to find it.

BTW after thinking about it, I agree with @Rocket J Squirrel most likely 1.00 is being retrieved from the wrong OFX field, it is probably just an initialization value.

Note I tried the test today, and so far it hasn't gone to 1.00 Edit: the problem does seem to be tied to the weekend.

Boatnmaniac

Chris_QPW said:

Boatnmaniac said:

BTW, I'm seeing this with all MFs I have Fidelity, not just Fidelity MFs. It is something that appears to be tied to the FI doing the download, not with the MF company.

It really is just speculation on our part because we can't see the innerworkings, but the problem with "stale" prices wasn't limited to Fidelity, it was just the "most used" one that came up.

The developers just need to dig into it. I'm sure that now that it is a known problem it really shouldn't be that hard for them to find it.

BTW after thinking about it, I agree with @Rocket J Squirrel most likely 1.00 is being retrieved from the wrong OFX field, it is probably just an initialization value.

Note I tried the test today, and so far it hasn't gone to 1.00 Edit: the problem does seem to be tied to the weekend.

I just downloaded from Fidelity (and only Fidelity) into my test account. As with earlier downloads into this test file, I did not download quotes from the 3rd party provider.

The quotes for 10/26 downloaded properly for all MFs. No quotes downloaded for 10/25. The $1.00 quotes for 10/24 remained unchanged. Yes, I agree that the problem does seem to be tied to the weekend.

Chris_QPW

Boatnmaniac said:

The $1.00 quotes for 10/24 remained unchanged.

Just a note, at no time would I expect Quicken to fix bad security prices.

Boatnmaniac

Chris_QPW said:

Boatnmaniac said:

The $1.00 quotes for 10/24 remained unchanged.

Just a note, at no time would I expect Quicken to fix bad security prices.

Normally, I would agree with you on this but last summer kind of shattered that expectation for me. There was a relatively long period of time (at least several weeks) where bad MF quotes information was being entered into the history...quotes from the previous day were being entered into the current day before the current day MF prices had been updated. Then that night or the next morning during OSU the bad quotes data was corrected. I'd never seen that happen before but that was one situation in which I was glad to see that it did. I haven't seen that happen again once Quicken got the quotes download hierarchy and 3rd party provider issues resolved.

Michael Zierdt

Does anyone at Quicken see this thread and forward it on to their developers? Are they willing to let their customers know if this problem has been fixed? Or do we just wait until the Beta is complete for Simple Investing.

betrout

I read the CEO email today and learned about simple investing. I've been frustrated for years that my Ameriprise account values were ALWAYS overstated in Quicken. I believed that to be due to all the placeholders in the accounts. So, with great hopes, I switched to new simple investing model and now every account value is BADLY UNDERSTATED. Will this type of functionality EVER work as expected or should I just give up??? Very frustrating to spend monthly subscription on this product and feel it's value is moving backwards not forwards.

teremyj

I have Traditional and Roth IRA accounts through Fidelity. Retrieved latest quotes today (Sunday) and all funds still reset to $1 per share. On version R30.14. Please fix this ASAP.

platipus_

Same happened to me. I got way behind on updates and finally just had time to get account logins corrected and data cleaned up only to find this issue where all Fidelity funds are showing $1 price. What is the deal with this? Searches seem to show this has happened multiple times before, but this is the first time I have run into it. I thought I broke something until I saw these posts about it.

Michael Zierdt

I unchecked "Simple - Positions Only" after the problem first occurred and it hasn't come back though I had to manually correct all the prices.