Changes to the Backup and Copy menus

GLE81342

Why does Quicken need to make changes. Just changed where to go to do back ups and restores. I don't have the time to be hunting for things when I am used to going where I need and finding it. Just makes things more difficult and time consuming.

The Keeper

Typically, changes are made to improve a product however, some customers may not like a change. Backups are still the same but it appears an additional step has now been added to give you the option to create a complete backup, create a copy or template, or create a year-end archive. If you want to bypass this new step don't click on the "backup" icon above the menu bar. Instead, hit Ctrl and B on your keyboard and it will take you directly to the backup winding

Rocket J Squirrel

Users are always clamoring for changes and improvements. I don't recall seeing a single user ask for this change.

The problem is that we've lost functionality. For decades, File > File Operations > Copy was the only way to create a record-by-record (as opposed to bit-by-bit) copy of a Quicken database. This was useful to prune the database after large deletions, and also helped prepare a file for validation.

The new "Create a copy or Template" presumably performs the same record-by-record copy, but disconnects all online accounts! Who asked for that change? What a pain to have to reconnect all the accounts! I have 12 combinations of financial institution and user name I'd have to reconnect individually.

Chris_QPW

Rocket J Squirrel said:

The new "Create a copy or Template" presumably performs the same record-by-record copy, but disconnects all online accounts! Who asked for that change? What a pain to have to reconnect all the accounts! I have 12 combinations of financial institution and user name I'd have to reconnect individually.

Personally I see this change as "We need to fix this problem."  And they didn't really give too much thought that they are taking away the record-by-record functionality.

From the time they started "syncing to the cloud" (and maybe even back to Express Web Connect) there was a fundamental problem.  Each Quicken data file has a unique Id that could never be changed.

It is that Id decides "Is this the same data that I have in the 'cloud'?"

So if I create a copy of the Quicken data file and then treat it as if it is a different data file, changing what accounts are in it and such when the "syncing" happens it creates a terrible mess because the unique Id being the same means that two different sets of Quicken data file accounts and such will be syncing with the same "cloud data".

So the first part of this fix is a "Template", as in you need to change that unique Id.  But more than that, you are basically saying that you need a new "cloud data account".  Well it seems to me that they decided that if in fact you are getting a new cloud data account it shouldn't start connected to the old online accounts because there might be situations where carrying that over might confuse things down the line.
Not to mention that I think in some cases disconnecting all the online accounts might be a good troubleshooting step.

So it is this that has been "asked for" and is desperately needed.

It looks like they then said "Change the copy function to do this." not really thinking much about the fact that the original copy has the "side-effect" that it is a record-by-record copy that sometime clears up problems or figuring that is quite rare and maybe doing everything including disconnecting the online accounts might be an even more through troubleshooting step.

Rocket J Squirrel

I agree generating a new File ID is an important new feature. I just want the option to preserve my online connections.

Chris_QPW

Rocket J Squirrel said:

I agree generating a new File ID is an important new feature. I just want the option to preserve my online connections.

At this point I think what is needed is an Idea thread stating that so that everyone can vote on it.

Ps56k2

The whole "file ID" topic is interesting in so many ways.... with lots of scenarios and lots of challenges.

WHY and HOW is the "copy" going to be used......
A - replace the orig,
B - as a dup file with its own new life,
C - as a dup for testing, etc.
AND... what about just making a Windows "copy & rename" or portable backup copy... to mess with.
Just lots and lots of scenarios - and they all point to that black hole - the SYNC - the root of all evil.

I only have enabled SYNC for a "test" file - and have made sure all Cloud sets are deleted except for that "test" file.

Rocket J Squirrel

Chris_QPW said:

At this point I think what is needed is an Idea thread stating that so that everyone can vote on it.

Here it is:

https://community.quicken.com/discussion/7896975/option-to-preserve-online-account-connections-when-performing-file-copy

Chris_QPW

Ps56k2 said:

I only have enabled SYNC for a "test" file - and have made sure all Cloud sets are deleted except for that "test" file.

Unfortunately "sync to cloud" is no longer just Sync to Mobile/Web that you can choose not to use.

First off Express Web Connect is now using this flow:
Quicken -> QCS -> Intuit servers -> financial institution's website.

QCS == Quicken Connection Services == Quicken Cloud data set

Second off you will notice that from time to time on here people have had problems with resorting from backups doing strange things, not to mention people that did them for moving data to another machine have run into the famous "You have exceed the number of data sets" error.  Bottom line is that there is "sync" in every single data file, and how much depends on the services you use.

If you look at those threads the recommendation is to first delete the "cloud data set" and then do the restore.  Implying that during the restore it is syncing with the data set, and in some cases can get messed up if the restored data and the data in the cloud data set are too much different.

Chris_QPW

Rocket J Squirrel said:

Chris_QPW said:

At this point I think what is needed is an Idea thread stating that so that everyone can vote on it.

Here it is:

https://community.quicken.com/discussion/7896975/option-to-preserve-online-account-connections-when-performing-file-copy

Thanks.  I added my vote.