Why doesn't Quicken have separate lines (columns) for payments and credits?

Michael Trombetta

All my credit card statement have separate lines for payments and credits, but Quicken’s reconciliation window has only one line for payments and credits, forcing me to add them. It would be much more convenient if Quicken had separate lines. Please join me and petition Quicken to add separate lines for payment and credits.

Michael Trombetta

Thank you, I didn't know about New Post Ideas.

Boatnmaniac

Michael Trombetta said:

Thank you Boatnmaniac, but I wasn't clear. I'm talking about reconciling a credit card account, where Quicken has one line to enter Payments, credits, so you have to add those two and enter the sum. I'd like Quicken to offer two lines, so I could enter payments on one line and credits on a separate line. This is not really a new user question, but Quicken doesn't have a topic "Suggested Features"

Ah, so you are talking about the manual reconciliation data entry where what is circled in red would be split into 2 lines so you don't need to use the built in or external calculator, right? 

Chris_QPW

Sherlock said:

Michael Trombetta said:

All my credit card statement have separate lines for payments and credits, but Quicken’s reconciliation window has only one line for payments and credits, forcing me to add them. It would be much more convenient if Quicken had separate lines. Please join me and petition Quicken to add separate lines for payment and credits.

I think Quicken should only prompt for the Ending statement date and Ending balance.  Too many users mistakenly believe Quicken actually uses the other fields.

Now that you mention it why do they have those fields there at all?
EDIT I also remember suggesting they just remove the fields, but there were people that claimed they needed them.  I can't see how anyone can need something that does nothing.

These days I reconcile to online balances, but I remember clearly the pain of having to enter zeros in those fields just to get past them.  I never understood why they are there given that the user should have already have the transactions in the register before reconciling, but I just ignored them.

Michael Trombetta said:

To Sherlock: Is it true that Quicken uses only the Ending Date and Balance? But you are still required to enter some value in the other fields. What happens if you enter some arbitrary numbers?

So I just tried this, and like @Sherlock said, it doesn't seem to use them at all.
I expected them to create transaction(s) or something!


And the fact that they force people to put values into these fields is even more of a mystery.
I also remember trying to get them to make them optional for years, and then just gave up.

And ironically I have seen people request having these fields for Quicken Mac reconciling.

Boatnmaniac

Hi @Michael Trombetta .  I am assuming that by "separate lines" you mean "separate columns" credits/payments and charges.  Quicken recently added a default account register view option for new subscribers/accounts and it sounds like that is what your account register is showing.  I don't care for that, either.  Fortunately you can get the more traditional view pretty easily and quickly:  Account Register > upper right Gear icon > Register Columns > check the boxes for "Charge" and "Payment" > Done.  You should now see separate columns for charges and payments/credits.

You will also probably see a column in the register for "Amount".  For me that is an unnecessary redundancy in this more traditional register view.  If you do not want to see this column, follow the same path shown above and uncheck the box for "Amount" and it will then stop being shown.

Edit - added this paragraph:  While you are making changes to the Register Columns to be shown you might want to look at the other column options you have that you might also want to be shown, such as Memo and Tag. Check the box for any/all columns you want to be shown in the register. This new view really went overboard on minimizing the default columns that are shown.

To prevent the undesired view from automatically showing up in new accounts that you set up in the future:  Edit > Preferences > Setup > uncheck the box for "Use New Subscriber settings for new files, accounts, features".

Did this give you the register view you want to see?

Chris_QPW

@Boatnmaniac Wow I missed when they added that setting.
Talk about just the minimum:

I was reading the help on it and they make it sound like you can turn it off and everything would be like it would if you started with it off, but that isn't the case.

They are basically forcing certain settings into Quicken like the above when creating an account.  So switching out of that mode only affects the forcing of the settings at a time like creating the account, not for existing accounts created with the mode on.   One would have to either manually change it or recreate it, or push the settings from another existing account that is setup the way they like it.

Boatnmaniac

Chris_QPW said:

@Boatnmaniac Wow I missed when they added that setting.
Talk about just the minimum:

I was reading the help on it and they make it sound like you can turn it off and everything would be like it would if you started with it off, but that isn't the case.

They are basically forcing certain settings into Quicken like the above when creating an account.  So switching out of that mode only affects the forcing of the settings at a time like creating the account, not for existing accounts created with the mode on.   One would have to either manually change it or recreate it, or push the settings from another existing account that is setup the way they like it.

I remember seeing this setting change but didn't pay much attention to it until the last week or so when I started playing around with it in a new TEST file I'd set up.  I just started SMH about it.  It should be an option, not the default for new subscribers.

I perhaps should have mentioned that even with that setting being unchecked it does not automatically revert all accounts to the more traditional view.  Each established account will need to be changed as noted above. 

But I am under the impression that unchecking that Preferences box will prevent the new register view when setting up new accounts in the future.  At least that is how it worked in my new TEST file.  But then I'm not a "new subscriber" so I don't know it might affect this.

Chris_QPW

I have seen several things where they talk about "new subscribers" and I think it basically works this way.
If you start with an existing data file, you have X settings already set, and so if you create a new data file, it uses those.  But if one was to start completely from a new data file (not while an old data file is open) then Quicken wouldn't have any existing settings and as such use the defaults.  There are a few settings in the configuration files outside of Quicken, but there aren't many.

As for their policies on what a new user should see, well yeah I expect their to be disagreement on that, especially from long time users.

It does cause quite a bit of "friction" since what they hear from "new users" is quite different than what existing users are use to and frankly what they test, and that creates a big gap in understanding what the user is seeing and even finding bugs in the systems the existing users don't use.

An example of this is automatic transaction entry mode, which for new users is on for non investment accounts by default, and off for investment accounts.

Given the new format for the register looks like one might see at a financial institution, it doesn't really surprise me that they figure that is what should be shown.  In a way I'm surprised they didn't force the date sort order to have the latest transactions at the top of the register.

Michael Trombetta

This comment doesn't address my question. I chose new user as a topic because they don't have "New Features Wanted".

Chris_QPW

Michael Trombetta said:

This comment doesn't address my question. I chose new user as a topic because they don't have "New Features Wanted".

To put in an Idea that people can vote on go to the Home page and select New Post -> Idea.

And put in exactly what you are suggesting, instead of asking a question of why something happened, like you did for this question "Why doesn't Quicken have separate lines (columns) for payments and credits?"

Michael Trombetta

Thank you Boatnmaniac, but I wasn't clear. I'm talking about reconciling a credit card account, where Quicken has one line to enter Payments, credits, so you have to add those two and enter the sum. I'd like Quicken to offer two lines, so I could enter payments on one line and credits on a separate line. This is not really a new user question, but Quicken doesn't have a topic "Suggested Features"

Michael Trombetta

Thank you, I didn't know about New Post Ideas.

Chris_QPW

Michael Trombetta said:

Thank you Boatnmaniac, but I wasn't clear. I'm talking about reconciling a credit card account, where Quicken has one line to enter Payments, credits, so you have to add those two and enter the sum. I'd like Quicken to offer two lines, so I could enter payments on one line and credits on a separate line. This is not really a new user question, but Quicken doesn't have a topic "Suggested Features"

When you submit an Idea look for this category:

Sherlock

Michael Trombetta said:

All my credit card statement have separate lines for payments and credits, but Quicken’s reconciliation window has only one line for payments and credits, forcing me to add them. It would be much more convenient if Quicken had separate lines. Please join me and petition Quicken to add separate lines for payment and credits.

I think Quicken should only prompt for the Ending statement date and Ending balance.  Too many users mistakenly believe Quicken actually uses the other fields.

Boatnmaniac

Michael Trombetta said:

Thank you Boatnmaniac, but I wasn't clear. I'm talking about reconciling a credit card account, where Quicken has one line to enter Payments, credits, so you have to add those two and enter the sum. I'd like Quicken to offer two lines, so I could enter payments on one line and credits on a separate line. This is not really a new user question, but Quicken doesn't have a topic "Suggested Features"

Ah, so you are talking about the manual reconciliation data entry where what is circled in red would be split into 2 lines so you don't need to use the built in or external calculator, right? 

Michael Trombetta

Yes, exactly, and only now did I see that I could have added a screenshot that would have made it clear from the beginning.PS I sometimes try to use the build-in calculator, but most of the time I don't get the correct sum. What am I doing wrong?

Michael Trombetta

To Sherlock: Is it true that Quicken uses only the Ending Date and Balance? But you are still required to enter some value in the other fields. What happens if you enter some arbitrary numbers?

Chris_QPW

Sherlock said:

Michael Trombetta said:

All my credit card statement have separate lines for payments and credits, but Quicken’s reconciliation window has only one line for payments and credits, forcing me to add them. It would be much more convenient if Quicken had separate lines. Please join me and petition Quicken to add separate lines for payment and credits.

I think Quicken should only prompt for the Ending statement date and Ending balance.  Too many users mistakenly believe Quicken actually uses the other fields.

Now that you mention it why do they have those fields there at all?
EDIT I also remember suggesting they just remove the fields, but there were people that claimed they needed them.  I can't see how anyone can need something that does nothing.

These days I reconcile to online balances, but I remember clearly the pain of having to enter zeros in those fields just to get past them.  I never understood why they are there given that the user should have already have the transactions in the register before reconciling, but I just ignored them.

Michael Trombetta said:

To Sherlock: Is it true that Quicken uses only the Ending Date and Balance? But you are still required to enter some value in the other fields. What happens if you enter some arbitrary numbers?

So I just tried this, and like @Sherlock said, it doesn't seem to use them at all.
I expected them to create transaction(s) or something!


And the fact that they force people to put values into these fields is even more of a mystery.
I also remember trying to get them to make them optional for years, and then just gave up.

And ironically I have seen people request having these fields for Quicken Mac reconciling.

Boatnmaniac

Michael Trombetta said:

Yes, exactly, and only now did I see that I could have added a screenshot that would have made it clear from the beginning.PS I sometimes try to use the build-in calculator, but most of the time I don't get the correct sum. What am I doing wrong?

There is nothing special about the built-in calculator.  It works pretty much the same way as the built-in Windows calculator.  Some of the main problems with this type of calculator are really human error issues, like "fat fingering" a number, inverting numbers and misreading (or missing) numbers.  Another problem is when using multiplication it doesn't allow one to select which number or group of numbers is to be multiplied...it simply multiplies the total sum of everything that had been entered before it and that will make the end result inaccurate.  Anyway, one or more of these things is probably why you don't always get the correct sum.

I much prefer a calculator like is used in some tax softwares...opening a popup up where each dollar amount can be entered in a separate field so if the total is wrong I can review all the entries to see where the error was made and it can be corrected without needing to do the entire calculation from the start all over, again.

I only use the manual reconciliation process with one manual account.  I much prefer reconciling all my other accounts (the ones that are set up for OSU) to the online balance.  It's much faster, more accurate and more reliable.  I reconcile my accounts every time new transactions have been downloaded during OSU and in most cases the process for each account takes just a couple of seconds so I know exactly where my account balances stand on just about any given day.  About the only time it takes longer than this is with some EWC accounts (and a couple of DC accounts) when the Quicken data snapshot is taken but the Financial Institution has only partially completed processing their server updates.  When this happens newly posted transaction(s) might get downloaded but the online balance has not yet been updated/downloaded or the online balance has been updated and downloaded but the newly posted transaction(s) did not download.  This will prevent reconciliation from completing but just run OSU, again, 12-24 hrs later and everything gets downloaded properly and reconciliation completes properly.

Sherlock

Michael Trombetta said:

To Sherlock: Is it true that Quicken uses only the Ending Date and Balance? But you are still required to enter some value in the other fields. What happens if you enter some arbitrary numbers?

It is true.  The amount values placed in other required fields are ignored.

Michael Trombetta

I will try entering 12.34 in those fields next time. Thanks,