Is there a way to control when scheduled mortgage payments are entered? (Q Mac)

JoelC

I am a long time WQuicken user - dating backing to 1995 - but am considering moving to MQuicken.

I spent part of the weekend setting up MQuicken to run in parallel with WQuicken until I decide whether to not MQuicken will meet my needs (note: here is to hoping so as the though of Quicken + Parallels + Windows ARM on M silicon is not appealing).

In order to make sure that I do not run into any problems I am comparing the Net Worth on MQuciken to W Quicken to make sure that everything is in sync.

In the process of further fine tuning MQuicken I noticed the following:

1. MQuicken Net Worth was no longer the same as the WQuickenNet Worth;

2. The culprit was that MQuicken had entered my scheduled mortgage payment in my Property & Debt mortgage account (with a little clock beside the entry) whereas WQuicken had not; and

3. When digging into this further I noticed that there does not appear to be a "clock drop down list" to control / show when scheduled mortgage payments are entered presumably because my mortgage account is a Property & Debt account rather than a Banking account which does that the "clock drop down list" to control / show when scheduled payments are entered.

It would be greatly appreciated if someone could assist me / tell me:

1, Is there the ability to control / set when scheduled mortgage payments are entered into the mortgage account; and

2. If yes, then where and how.

Thank you.

garysmith87

All Scheduled Reminders in Quicken Mac are handled through the Bills and Income tab.

From there, select Projected Balances.  Search for the NEXT instance of your mortgage payment.  

Double click on the scheduled transaction and select Edit All Instances in the blue bar below the transaction.

From the Details window that pops up, make sure Payment Method is I pay the biller directly and the Mark as Paid is either "Automatically" or "Before Scheduled Date".  If Before Scheduled Date, select how many days in advance you want the payment to be entered into the register.  

Let me know if this answers your question correctly. 

JoelC

@garysmith87

I appreciate you taking the time to assist.

The above did NOT work and here is why:

1. The approach / changes you suggested above DOES impact when the scheduled mortgage payment appears in the Banking account from which the mortgage is paid (i.e. checking account) but DOES NOT impact when the scheduled mortgage payment appears in the Property & Debt account which tracks the outstanding mortgage.

Would appreciate any other suggestions that you may have.

Thanks,

JoelC

Am wondering whether anyone else has an answer to this "annoyance"?

Thx!

Quicken Alyssa

Hello @JoelC,

Thank you for coming to the Community with your question!

You should be able to accomplish the reminder showing in both accounts, by using the transfer category for the mortgage account. So Edit your reminder to have [Transfer:Mortgage Account Name] as the category. Now you should see that it shows in both accounts.


Let us know if this answers your question!


Quicken Alyssa

JoelC

@Quicken Alyssa, thank you for your response but unfortunately it does not answer the question. I will try to be clear.

The issue that I am having is NOT related to a Bill Reminder per say. The issue that I am having is related to the Mortgage Tracking account in the debt section; specifically, whether there is or is not a reminder, the Mortgage Tracking account is automatically adding the NEXT mortgage payment and displaying the outstanding mortgage amount IN THE SIDE bar to be inclusive of the NEXT mortgage payment even though the next mortgage payment has yet to to be made!

What is the way of correcting this?

Thanks!

Quicken Alyssa

Hello again, @JoelC,

Is your sidebar displaying "projected balances"?


Feel free to include screenshots! If needed, please refer to this Community FAQ for instructions on how to attach a screenshot. Alternatively, you can also drag and drop screenshots to your response if you are not given the option to add attachments.



Quicken Alyssa

JoelC

@Quicken Alyssa, I very much appreciate you continuing to assist...the problem is not the projected balances but that Quicken is entering the next mortgage payment in the mortgage account within the Property & Debt section (which, for added clarity , Bill & Income has no impact on).

I hope that helps!

Thanks!

Quicken Alyssa

@JoelC,

I am confused as to how this is happening. If there is not a reminder being entered, and you are not looking at a projected balance, what could be making Quicken show a future amount? Do you know? When you open the Property & Debt account, does it show the next payment that is being deducted from your total in the register? Is the balance in Quicken matching your online balance? Does it seem that Quicken thinks you have paid one more payment than you actually have, so it's always that much off?

Thank you for your patience with my questions, I do hope that we can get to the bottom of this for you. 


Quicken Alyssa

JoelC

@ Quicken Alyssa, the issue / problem is as you note in that Property & Debt Account for my mortgage is showing the next payment that will be made in its register WITHOUT showing the corresponding / similar entry in the Banking Account from which the mortgage payment is actually made.

The other point worth making is that the Bill & Reminders impacts the Banking Accounts but not the Property & Debt account as there is no way -- at least that I can think of -- of stopping the Property & Debt mortgage account from so doing.

I hope this helps.

garysmith87

In the Mortgage loan account...if you double click on the "wayward" transfer transaction in the register, Quicken should prompt you that "This transaction is locked and cannot be edited".  Select Go to Transfer.

Where does that take you?  

Additionally, if you globally have Quicken Mac Property and Debt to show reminders 30 days in advance, your Mortgage loan account will show that scheduled transaction in the register ABOVE THE BLUE LINE...meaning it's in the future.

However, if you have the individual checking account "Show Reminders" set to Don't Show Reminders, the transaction won't appear in the checking register.  

The individual account setting for Reminders supercedes the global setting.  The global settings are set in the account GROUP, above where your checking account is listed.  In most cases, that GROUP above checking would be Banking.  

The global setting for the group is to the far right of the register with the little black clock and down arrow.  Check to see what that says.  Also check to see what the Property and Debt group heading is set for your reminders.  Then check to see what your individual checking account is set for.  

Does that future mortgage payment in the loan register show ABOVE THE BLUE LINE?  If so, that means it's scheduled in the future.  Additionally, it should have a little light blue clock to the far left of the transaction in the STATUS area.  

Is your checking account set for Don't Show Reminders?  If so, you may want to change it to match the Property and Debt global setting.  

JoelC

> @garysmith87 said:

Thank you for your reply noting that my responses are embedded within your post.

> In the Mortgage loan account...if you double click on the "wayward" transfer transaction in the register, Quicken should prompt you that "This transaction is locked and cannot be edited".  Select Go to Transfer.
>
> Where does that take you?  
>

It takes me to the Banking account from which the mortgage payments are paid.


> Additionally, if you globally have Quicken Mac Property and Debt to show reminders 30 days in advance, your Mortgage loan account will show that scheduled transaction in the register ABOVE THE BLUE LINE...meaning it's in the future.
>

Yes and no in that:

1. The Bills & Reminders DOES impact when the mortgage payments are displayed in the Banking Account.

2. The Bills and Remiders ha NO impact on when transactions are entered into Property and Debt mortgage accounts. I deleted the reminder / scheduled transaction from Bill & Reminders but the transition still appeared in my Property and Debt account.

I believe that this is because it is a "mortgage type" account it is a) automatically calculating the payment and b) automatically entering it in the register. This belief is also supposed in that the entries into Property and Debt mortgage account exclude all interest payments (i.e. it is only tracking Principal) which is clearly different from the actual mortgage payments which include interest.


> However, if you have the individual checking account "Show Reminders" set to Don't Show Reminders, the transaction won't appear in the checking register.  
>

Not true! See above!

garysmith87

So, here's the initial Loan Details screen for my mortgage.

Note...I have the First Payment selected rather than the Maturity Date.  I've had issues in the past with using the maturity date and my mortgage being "off" by one month.

Quicken has calculated the correct Principal and Interest, according to the amortization schedule.  Note that the Next Payment is correct for 12/1/2021.



Next, here is the Bill Reminder. Note that I have the Detailed Reminder setup...and this flows to my Bills and Income > Projected Balances list of scheduled transactions.



Next, here is my transaction register for my loan.  In Property & Debt, I have the default global selection set to 30 days.  Note that in the register, the 12/1/2021 transaction appears, but above the blue line signifying a future date...and a blue clock indicating the transaction hasn't been marked as paid yet.

garysmith87

To continue...If I set my checking account to NOT show reminders, that 12/1/2021 transaction does NOT show in my checking register..but WILL still show in the loan register.  

So...I'm not sure what YOU'RE seeing, but my registers will be dependent on the Reminder setting for the registers...or set by the global setting in the appropriate sub group or group.

As you can see, only the principal is showing in the loan register, as that's the amount transferred from the total loan payment transaction in checking.

Additionally, if I double click on the 12/1/2021 transaction, it prompts me to Go to Transfer...and I see the corresponding transaction (unpaid and scheduled) in my checking register, since I have the reminders setting set to 30 days there.

But I can 100% verify, if I change that setting to DO NOT SHOW reminders, the reminder transaction in the loan register STILL shows and it disappears in the checking register.  

Now, also please tell me you're treating the mortgage loan as a manual type loan...and don't have it connected to your bank for downloads.  If so, this throws everything right out the window.

Now...lets see what YOU see.  Visual aids would help, as well.  

garysmith87

To complete the picture...

Here is the transaction in the Bills and Income > Projected Balanced (edit) view.





Let's see how your setup differs from this.  Because mine works just fine.  

Jon

JoelC, I created a test file to try to duplicate what you're seeing. With the checking account set to "Don't show reminders" and the mortgage set to "View projected balance", then I see what you're reporting - the checking account doesn't show the payment but the mortgage already has it deducted from the balance:

If I change either of those settings, then the two accounts match up. If I don't want the payment taken into account until it's made, then I change the mortgage to "View today's balance" and then the displayed mortgage balance doesn't change until the payment is made. The reminder still shows up in the register (and I don't see a way to turn that off) but the balance at the top of the screen & in the sidebar will not reflect that payment until it is made.

If I do want to see the upcoming payment in both accounts, then I change the checking account to show reminders for the appropriate period ("Next 30 days" is what I use most of the time) and then the reminder shows up there as well, matching the mortgage.

garysmith87

What you're seeing above the "Green Line" and with the clock showing is the reminder for the next transaction.  The clock means that the transaction hasn't been marked "as paid" yet.

If you want to get rid of that, you'll need to go the Property and Debt group heading and change the reminders to show to DO NOT SHOW reminders.  Or set the reminder to a setting less than the next interval...perhaps 7 or 14 days.  

Personally, I don't know why this is even an issue for anyone.  So...you see a future transaction in the loan register.  Most Quicken Mac users know that anything "above the green line" indicates transactions dated in the future.

And a lot of us Quicken Mac users WANT to see those transactions in the future...and thus can figure out our future balance, whether it's in a loan account, our checking account or our credit card account(s).  

But if that really bothers you...once again...in Property and Debt set the reminders setting to DO NOT SHOW reminders.  And heck...do the same in your checking account, or all Banking accounts in the main group.  

garysmith87

I do have to apologize.  In my description, I reference the blue line in the registers.  I should have said that its a green line.  

(In slightly older versions of Quicken Mac, it used to be a blue line...until they just changed it recently.)

Jon

garysmith87 said:

If you want to get rid of that, you'll need to go the Property and Debt group heading and change the reminders to show to DO NOT SHOW reminders. 

Ah, that's how you do it. And if you change the setting there it also changes the Payments view for the mortgage.

JoelC

@garysmith87 and @Jon

First thank you both for taking the time to post very detailed responses which were extremely helpful.

I *hope and think* that I understand the problem / situation based on what the two of you have posted which I will try to explain in greater detail here as well as this pictures (assuming I get this to work).

1. I am coming from QWin and want to reproduce that functionality and make sure that everything works. One way of doing that is to make sure the Net Worth amounts at the bottom of the QWin and QMac sidebars match.

I have the sidebars in BOTH QWin and QMac set to show Projected Balances.


2. In QWin the Property & Debt Account Loan Register DOES NOT automatically pre-propolate / show the next mortgage payment (see Image 1). And, as a result the QWin Property & Debt sidebar mortgage account amount and, by extension, the Net Worth sidebar Net Worth amount DO NOT include / reflect the next mortgage payment.


3. In QMAc the Property & Debt Account Loan Register DOES automatically pre-populate / show the next mortgage payment regardless of whether TODAY's BALANCE or the PROJECTED BALANCE is selected (see image 2 and 3) and per @Jon "there is no way to turn that off"; that is there is no way to stop the Property & Debt Account Loan Register from automatically pre-polulating / showing the next mortgage payment



4. With there being no way to stop the the Property & Debt Account Loan Register from automatically pre-polulating / showing the next mortgage payment this means:

a) the next mortgage payment WILL ALWAYS be pre-pouated / shown in the Property & Debt Loan Register; and

b) When the Sidebar is set to show Projected Balances then i) the Property & Debt Loan Register will always include / reflect the next mortgage payment and b) the Net Worth will always include / show the next mortgage payment.


5. The QWin Net Worth and QMac Net Worth amounts will NOT match because:

a) QMac forces the addition / inclusion of the next mortgage payment in the Property & Debt Loan Register and there is no way to turn this off; and

b) QMac Net Worth -- when on a Projected Basis -- includes the next mortgage payment which QWin does not.

So, in the end I think we have the problem explained and understood (see 5 above).

What do you think about the having QMac include / incorporate the ability to NOT have teh next mortgage payment automatically entered in the Property & Debt Loan Register?


@garysmith87 and @Jon , agree / disagree , comments, thoughts or information / screenshots you would like me to post?

Thanks again for everything.


Joel

Jon

JoelC said:

3. In QMAc the Property & Debt Account Loan Register DOES automatically pre-populate / show the next mortgage payment regardless of whether TODAY's BALANCE or the PROJECTED BALANCE is selected (see image 2 and 3) and per @Jon "there is no way to turn that off"; that is there is no way to stop the Property & Debt Account Loan Register from automatically pre-polulating / showing the next mortgage payment

I was wrong about that. As @garysmith87 pointed out, you can set the register in the Property & Debt group to "Don't Show Reminders" and then the projected balance in the sidebar will not include any scheduled bill payments, and that setting applies to the individual loan accounts as well. In this picture I have a scheduled loan payment on December 1st and it isn't being applied to the projected account balance in the sidebar:

garysmith87

Wow...I gave you a very detailed explanation...and you completely ignored it.

Don't you understand the concept of having the reminders show in the register...or not?

Because if you have reminders show...then of course the projected balance will be different IF YOU HAVE ENTRIES IN THE REGISTER!!!

The projected balance is the ending balance that includes whatever transactions are entered in your register.  If you don't want to have those included you either have to have Quicken set to show your Current Balance...and you have to set the reminders in the register to DO NOT SHOW REMINDERS.

I went through this entire detailed explanation, with pictures...and yet here we are.  You've completely ignored the fact that you HAVE reminders showing in your mortgage register.  That's the ones at the bottom of the register with the little clock appearing.  Those ARE reminders.  They are NOT actual entries.

And if you have reminders showing...and you have Projected Balances selected...those NOT PAID reminders (the clock is showing indicating NOT PAID) will be INCLUDED in your Projected Balance.

I TOLD you how to turn that off in the Mortgage loan register. Go to the Property and Debt GROUP and change the reminders setting to DO NOT SHOW REMINDERS.  Then, your next mortgage payment will NOT show in your loan register.  That solves issue #5.  But you seem to have glossed over or completely missed how I explained this IN DETAIL.

You're still under the impression that there is no way to turn off having the next mortgage payment into the loan register (Your point #4).  BUT THERE IS...and I explained in detail how to turn that off.  But you ignored the instructions for that.  So that addresses your points #4 and #5.  

Additionally, in the Quicken Mac sidebar, change the view setting to see the Current Balance.  If you're getting messed up with future scheduled but not paid transactions, just change the balance setting view to see the current balance and NO future transactions (paid or unpaid) will be calculated at the top of the register.  

Next item of business...I know you're coming from Quicken Windows.  Please...and I beg you...forget about how things work in Quicken Windows when you work in Quicken Mac.  They are two distinct and different softwares.  There are minimally few similarities.  You have to have a completely different mindset for the two of them.  What works in one will work differently in the other.  

I'm sorry I'm being short with you.  But I felt my explanation, with all the screenshots, was pretty descriptive in what you need to do.  Instead, we're back here again and it seems as if you didn't read or comprehend my detailed instructions.  I'm sorry again, but I feel as if what I posted was completely ignored by you.  

My frustration, with what I thought was a detailed explanation, is starting to show.  

See my next posts.....

garysmith87

Here is the Property & Debt GROUP register.  The little clock on the right side has the reminders set to 30 days.  Notice that the 12/1/2021 register item is included, ABOVE the green line and with a clock symbol indicating that it's UNPAID as yet.



Here is the Mortgage Loan account register with that reminder in Property and Debt still set to 30 days.  Note that the NEXT mortgage payment is in the register, because the reminder in Property and Debt is set to 30 days.  It too has the clock showing to indicate that its UNPAID...and it's above the green line indicating a future transaction.  

garysmith87

Here is the Property and Debt GROUP register with reminders set to DO NOT SHOW. Note...no future transactions are in the register.  There are no transactions with a future date, without a clock and none above any green line.  



Now, here's the mortgage register with that Property and Debt group reminder setting as DO NOT SHOW.  Note, there is NO future or next transaction showing in the mortgage loan register.  NONE.  EXACTLY AS YOU WANTED.





Does this explain what you want?

[Edited for Readability]

Austin@

JoelC said:

@garysmith87 and @Jon

5. The QWin Net Worth and QMac Net Worth amounts will NOT match because:

a) QMac forces the addition / inclusion of the next mortgage payment in the Property & Debt Loan Register and there is no way to turn this off

@JoelC I'm a little confused with the above statement. You CAN turn off the addition of the next mortgage payment in the Property & Debt loan register (the "reminder" or "scheduled transaction") by clicking on the "Property & Debt" heading in the sidebar (not your actual mortgage account):



Then clicking on the little clock icon in the top-right area of the Quicken window and selecting "Don't Show Reminders":



This will cause the next instance of your mortgage payment to NOT appear in the Mortgage transaction register till it has actually been paid (you can verify this by clicking into your actual mortgage account after selecting "Don't Show Reminders" for the "Property & Debt" heading), and as a result will also not be reflected in the balance shown in the sidebar even with the sidebar set to show Projected Balances:



That being said, I always keep my sidebar set to show "Today's Balance" so the balance shown for my mortgage in the sidebar doesn't include the next scheduled mortgage payment even if the next payment is visible in the register above the green line.

I may be misunderstanding what you are trying to achieve, but it sounds like this might be what you are wanting. I apologize if I'm not properly understanding the issue.

garysmith87

See the HUGE red arrow?  This is the setting you need to change to DO NOT SHOW reminders in the Property & Debt GROUP register.  

Once you do that, the future scheduled transactions will not show in your mortgage loan register.

Got it now????

JoelC

@Jon, @garysmith87, @Austin@ , etc....a HUGE thank you for taking the time to work with me on this...I am tied up with work all day but will read through everything carefully tonight and respond.

Stay tuned and, again, thank you!

JoelC

@Austin@ , @garysmith87 and @Jon

1. A big FIRST. a huge thanks for taking the time to explain -- in painstaking detail -- how QMac works and how to solve my problem. A special thank you to @garysmith87 for keeping at it until I finally got it and no worries about the tone, all good!

2. I re read all of your post and now:
a) Understand GROUP Show Reminder Controls versus Register Show Reminder Controls. I must admit that I did not even know that GROUP Show Reminder Controls existed.

That said, I do find it weird that the Debt registers (i.e. car loans, mortgages, etc.) do NOT have Register Show Reminder Controls (i.e. no little clock in the top right hand corner of the register)

b) Understand that EACH of the Banking registers and the Property and Debt register can be controlled / set to not show / show scheduled transactions in the their respective registers.

c) I have configured QMac to behave how I want it to behave so all good.

AGAIN, A HUGE THANK YOU TO ALL, GREATLY APPRECIATED!

garysmith87

Groups, subgroups, individual accounts.

YIKES!  It's all confusing at times, especially for newbies.  So many nuances in Quicken Mac.