Transfers between accounts create duplicates when downloaded from Chase.

bwca7

This is a multi-part problem but I believe they may be tied together.

I have multiple checking and savings accounts which I use in order to keep track of our personal finances and what goes where. Transfers are made during the month in order to save the money required for certain things (rent, car, vacation savings, personal savings) and go to different accounts. This issue has existed for quite a while and I have had problems tracking things so I made sure that all transactions were unique amounts to whatever the transaction belonged to.

Whenever transactions are downloaded from Chase, the purchases or deposits come through fine. The transfers are the issue. It always has to do with the checking account. There will be duplicates.

Example:
The transaction is for a transfer from checking to savings for $75.
Here's what happens:
- Checking will download a cleared transaction of a transfer to checking for $75. A matching transaction is entered in the Savings account.
- Savings will download a cleared transaction to the checking account for $75. A matching transaction is entered in the Checking account.
These two occurrences will happen and there will be 2 duplicate transactions because Quicken will not recognize that these transactions should match. Everything has already been properly setup and configured as a repeating transaction in the Bills & Income tab with the accounts defined.

That's Part 1.

Here's Part 2.

When reconciling the account, the online balance will not match the balance I have in my register. It will be off by a factor which will equate to either one or multiple transfers. I thought it was me when I had to do all the fixing, so I did a balance adjustment so that everything was perfect with what the bank said. Nope. I double-checked all of my transactions with what the bank has listed as the transactions which have cleared. I'm still off. My register says I should have more money than the bank says and I've poured over this. I contacted customer support recently and they had me validate the file. Didn't do any good.

Any help would be appreciated.

Sherlock

I suggest entering the transfer transactions into the registers before they're imported to provide Quicken with a transaction to match.  I also suggest disabling the transfer detection preference: select Edit > Preferences...

Chris_QPW

Quicken has no way to know what is a transfer and what isn't, let alone what accounts they are between.
What is sees is a deposit in one account and a withdraw in another.
It has this preference:


But one has to understand that this purely guessing on Quicken's part.  It is based on the amount and approximate date.  It looks for a withdraw and a deposit of the same amount and changes them into a linked transfer.

Since it is a guess one should always have Confirm on, and make sure they really are a transfer, and to the right accounts.

When using similar amounts for different transfers it becomes more likely that Quicken’s guess will be wrong.

That is why the recommendation is to always pre-enter transfers, so that Quicken can just match to that exiting transaction.

bwca7

That's wonderful. Completely conflicting viewpoints. Well, as a FYI, my transactions are automatically entered 3 days prior to the transaction. I also already have it setup as Chris suggested. So something is either broken, working incorrectly or not working at all. It makes no sense to turn off transfer detection. Logically, that would just make the problem worse. Quicken is not finding the transfers that are there.

As stated earlier, I have made sure that all transfers are unique amounts so that there can be no confusion between different transfers.

A personal savings transfer cannot be confused with a vacation savings transfer because the amounts are different. This has been done by design.

Chris_QPW

The suggestions aren't conflicting. The point is not to trust the automatic transfer detection.  The details on how that is accomplished is a bit different, but not contradicting.

And yes, if you already entering the transfers into the registers, and if the amounts are different there does seem to be something wrong with the matching, which is a completely different subject.

Have you tried manual matching?
Does that work?

Sherlock

bwca7 said:

That's wonderful. Completely conflicting viewpoints. Well, as a FYI, my transactions are automatically entered 3 days prior to the transaction. I also already have it setup as Chris suggested. So something is either broken, working incorrectly or not working at all. It makes no sense to turn off transfer detection. Logically, that would just make the problem worse. Quicken is not finding the transfers that are there.

Where do you see a contradiction?

If you choose to confirm possible transfers, be very careful before accepting the transactions into the registers or you may see the symptoms you have described.

Note:  Disabling transfer detection does not make the problem worse.  It actually prevents the problem you described.

If you are entering the transfer transactions into the registers before they're imported, there is no benefit to having Quicken guess whether a transaction should be made into a transfer.

bwca7

I have been away for a bit because I needed time for multiple things to happen:
- I tried Sherlock's suggestion (don't knock it till you try it) and I disabled the transfer detection. Transfers are already being entered prior to the transaction occurring.
- I needed actual transfers to occur. These are all automated and are setup as recurring events through Chase.
- I then needed to check things.

Prior to doing all of this, I checked my accounts to make sure everything was tight. I eliminated any possible "bad" transactions. Ones that were not tied to anything or did not have a matching transaction in another account (i.e.: the other end of the transfer). I also made my connection to Chase better. Here's how:

Instead of just doing a one-step update like always, I checked how my accounts were connected.
- Right click over an account's name
- Edit/Delete Account
- Go to the Online Services tab.
- Here is where I saw that Chase has what is called Direct Connect. Apparently that is something I was not already doing, but I was already connecting. Hmmmm. So I did it. Now I am using it.

Now I downloaded all the accounts, checked them again (it took forever since it downloaded and checked ALL the transactions since the beginning of time). But I finally got to the important part, the new transfers.

Everything that had been entered was cleared EXCEPT for the transfers. Those transfers had happened and already cleared, it can be verified on the Chase website or app!

So, here is what I am seeing:
- Something is not being downloaded from Chase. As a result, transfers between accounts are not being cleared. In my case it was between checking and savings.
- That "something" is probably what is supposed to trigger Quicken to have you confirm possible transactions before entering them. I say this because I cannot remember the last time I have gotten a popup or question asking me to confirm a transaction.
- Because of that issue, I have been manually clearing all of my transfers and matching them up as they download (If I let it go too long it's a world of hurt).

I just wish it would get fixed. There's a reason I do not write code. I don't want to have to figure this stuff out. I deal with enough stuff at work, I don't need to deal with junk like this when I get home.

Sherlock

bwca7 said:

I have been away for a bit because I needed time for multiple things to happen:
- I tried Sherlock's suggestion (don't knock it till you try it) and I disabled the transfer detection. Transfers are already being entered prior to the transaction occurring.
- I needed actual transfers to occur. These are all automated and are setup as recurring events through Chase.
- I then needed to check things.

Prior to doing all of this, I checked my accounts to make sure everything was tight. I eliminated any possible "bad" transactions. Ones that were not tied to anything or did not have a matching transaction in another account (i.e.: the other end of the transfer). I also made my connection to Chase better. Here's how:

Instead of just doing a one-step update like always, I checked how my accounts were connected.
- Right click over an account's name
- Edit/Delete Account
- Go to the Online Services tab.
- Here is where I saw that Chase has what is called Direct Connect. Apparently that is something I was not already doing, but I was already connecting. Hmmmm. So I did it. Now I am using it.

Now I downloaded all the accounts, checked them again (it took forever since it downloaded and checked ALL the transactions since the beginning of time). But I finally got to the important part, the new transfers.

Everything that had been entered was cleared EXCEPT for the transfers. Those transfers had happened and already cleared, it can be verified on the Chase website or app!

So, here is what I am seeing:
- Something is not being downloaded from Chase. As a result, transfers between accounts are not being cleared. In my case it was between checking and savings.
- That "something" is probably what is supposed to trigger Quicken to have you confirm possible transactions before entering them. I say this because I cannot remember the last time I have gotten a popup or question asking me to confirm a transaction.
- Because of that issue, I have been manually clearing all of my transfers and matching them up as they download (If I let it go too long it's a world of hurt).

I just wish it would get fixed. There's a reason I do not write code. I don't want to have to figure this stuff out. I deal with enough stuff at work, I don't need to deal with junk like this when I get home.

I think its a good thing you chose to switch to using the Direct Connect connection method.  When we switch connection methods, Quicken may initially import duplicate transactions which may be deleted.

I don't understand what you mean by:

Everything that had been entered was cleared EXCEPT for the transfers. Those transfers had happened and already cleared, it can be verified on the Chase website or app!

If the transfer transactions are really not being imported, you should report the issue to Chase.  They're responsible for the transactions provided when using the Direct Connect connection method.

Given your earlier difficulties, it is possible the transfer transactions are being provided by Chase but matching earlier unmatched transactions.  You may confirm the theory by viewing the Posted Date column: open the register, press Ctrl + Shift + N, select Register columns..., check Downloaded posting date, select Done