Budget Monthly Average - all zeros

Keith Davis

Windows, R54.9

I have not used Budgets in a long time (because I could never make it very useful). I thought I would give it another shot and now, for every budget category, when I open Edit Yearly Budget, the Monthly Average is 0.00:

When I click Calculate Average, the same thing:

However, if I click the Category History (graph) icon:

Quicken Jasmine

Hello @Keith Davis,

This sounds like there could be a data file issue.

To start with, I suggest that you please try validating and/or super validating your data file. However, I do recommend that you first save a backup file prior to performing these steps.

Validate: 

1. File
2. Validate and Repair File...
   
3. Validate File
   
4. Click OK
5. Close the Data Log
   
6. Close Quicken (leave it closed for at least 5 secs)
7. Reopen Quicken and see if the issue persists.

If the issue persists, proceed to Super Validate. If the issue is resolved after performing validation, then please disregard the instructions to Super Validate.

Super Validate:

1. File
2. Hold CTRL + Shift and click Validate and Repair File...
   
3. Super Validate File
4. Click OK
5. Close the Data Log
   
6. Close Quicken (leave it closed for at least 5 secs)
7. Reopen Quicken and see if the issue persists.

I hope this helps!

mshiggins

I may be able to  explain what you're seeing and why.

It appears to me you have chosen to budget at the Parent Category level (a Parent Category is a Category that has one, or more, subcategories - AKA: Child Categories). "Auto & Transport" is a default out-of-the-box Quicken Parent Category with some 9 Child Categories.

It also appears that when you record your actual automobile-related expenses, you always categorize them to one of the child categories of "Auto & Transport" - therefore you have no transactions categorized to the parent category, "Auto & Transport".

Since you never recorded any transactions to the parent category, "Auto & Transport" last year, it's Monthly Average is zero.

But - and this is where I think Quicken may have unnecessarily added confusion; when you click on the Monthly Average amount and view the category "History" bar graph, Quicken is showing bars that include amounts for every transaction for every child category of the parent category you are budgeting for.

Last year you had no non-zero actual transaction amounts categorized to the parent category, "Auto & Transport", but some number of non-zero transaction amounts categorized to child categories of "Auto & Transport" (producing a monthly average of $1193 for the Child categories).

Quicken should be consistent here: if the Monthly Average is only going to include transactions categorized to a specific parent category, then clicking on the Monthly Average amount should also only include transactions assigned to that parent category (ignoring transactions assigned to any Child Categories). If that was the way Quicken worked, you would have had a Monthly Average of $0.00 for "Auto & Transport".

I believe the same transactions - and ONLY those transactions - that are used to compute the Monthly Average should be used in the History bar graph.

For your case, Quicken could just as easily have chosen to compute the Monthly Average as the average of all transactions assigned to Child Categories of Auto & Transport (making the History bar graph consistent with the Monthly Average); which would probably be what users would expect.

I suspect you can simply ignore the "Monthly Average" amount, if you really want to budget at the parent category level.

Alternatively you could budget just for the child categories; your budget and budget reports can still provide sub-totals for parent categories. And if you want to see the budget report results only at the parent category level, you can customize the budget report to "Hide" subcategories.

-JP

Keith Davis

thanks

Tthat makes sense and perfectly inline with just how difficult this product is to use at times.

I stopped trying to use the budget a long time ago because it’s too complicated. I’ve decided to try it again but only use parent categories. I actually only use budgeting for projections and so I want the amounts to be the averages, but I guess I’ll just do that manually.

mshiggins

I want to partially walk back one of my previous comments, and to attempt to address one of your comments.

I previously said: "I believe the same transactions - and ONLY those transactions - that are used to compute the Monthly Average should be used in the History bar graph".

After further thought, I don't believe that would be the best way to address the confusion caused by Quicken's current approach, and in fact, it would deprive the user of some potentially useful information.

While the individual monthly amounts shown in "Edit Yearly Budget" are "budget" amounts, the "Monthly Average" is based solely on "actual" recorded transactions. 

So to the extent the user finds previously recorded actual transactions useful in determining new budget amounts, the Monthly Average should be the net of transactions recorded to the specific category ... and to any of its child categories (as is now the case).

When a budget report is run, generally the amount of current actual transactions for a selected parent and all its child categories will be included in the report - even if the budget and budget report only display amounts at the parent category level. 

In a Budget report, your $900 monthly budget for Auto & Transport will be compared to the net amount of all actual transactions for Auto & Transport and all its child categories.

So rather than exclude child categories from the Monthly Average when only a parent category is budgeted for, I think the Monthly Average should continue to be based on the parent and all its child categories and the History bar graph should have some sort of legend or description that informs the user that child categories, not specifically selected in the budget, are nevertheless included in the Monthly Average and the History bar graph.


Your response included the following: "I actually only use budgeting for projections and so I want the amounts to be the averages, but I guess I'll just do that manually".

If I'm understanding you correctly, I may have diverted you from an attainable goal.  Quicken WILL compute an average "budget" for you (it's just that the "Monthly Average" you see in your screenshot is an average of "actual" transactions, not "budgeted" amounts).

Clicking the "Calculate Average" button in the "Edit Yearly Budget" dialog, will give you a dialog that will compute an average "budget" amount.

If, for example, if you want to budget $1200 for a category for the year, but you want Quicken to show the monthly average ($100) of that $1200 in each month of your budget: 
- Click "Calculate Average"
- Key $1200 in the "Budget $" box
- Select "Yearly" from the dropdown just to the right of "Budget $"
- Choose "to all of 2024" (assuming you're creating your budget for the entire year 2024)

-JP

Keith Davis

What you are suggesting is basically what I'm doing - it's just more manual than it needs to be. Since I use this as a projection, not a budget, I update those averages throughout the year to match what we are actually doing.

mshiggins

"What you are suggesting is basically what I'm doing - it's just more manual than it needs to be. Since I use this as a projection, not a budget, I update those averages throughout the year to match what we are actually doing."

I'm not sure I follow you: can you elaborate? 

You might want to consider submitting your desire as an "Idea" discussion here.

-JP

Keith Davis

I mean, I just updated the budget throughout the year for the new averages so that it gives an overall project of profit/loss.