duplicate transfer transactions

I'm having an issue with downloading/matching transfer transactions. I found a couple vaguely similar issues posted on the Windows side, but not an exact match to my issue.

For any scheduled transaction that includes a transfer (either the whole transaction or a split line), I'm getting duplicate downloaded transactions, one of which matches and the other is created new.

So for example, I schedule a credit card payment for the future. A transaction is created in my checking account with a transfer to the CC account. When I download transactions after the day of the transaction, this transaction is shown as Matched (auto) and a new unclassified transaction is created for the same amount that shows as Downloaded. Both transactions have the same FITID, but different Sync IDs.

I'm able to delete the duplicates of course, but it's kind of a pain to have to find and delete them before I can trust the account balances.

Any help would be appreciated.

Thanks.

Answers

  • Quicken Anja
    Quicken Anja Moderator mod
    edited February 14
    Hello @nkm,

    Thank you for reaching out to the Community to tell us about your issue, though I apologize that you are experiencing this and for not having received a response yet.

    Could you please provide which version of Quicken you have currently running?
    • Help > About Quicken

    First, I would just like to gain some clarification in order to better assist you further.

    Which financial institution are you downloading transactions from? Which connection type are you using to connect (Quicken Connect or Direct Connect)? Does the duplicate download only occur in the checking account or both the checking and the CC account? How long ago did this issue first start to occur?

    Please, check back and let us know! Thank you.
    -Quicken Anja
  • nkm
    nkm Member ✭✭
    Version 6.1.1 (Build 601.37924.100)

    Direct connect downloads from Chase.

    The issue occurs on the source account (checking in the example, but others as well), but not on the destination account (CC in the example). It has been an issue since I started using Quicken last month.

    Thanks.
  • Quicken Anja
    Quicken Anja Moderator mod
    @nkm Thanks for the additional information.

    In that case, I recommend creating a new (test) file and try adding the account brand new to see if you receive the same result in the test file (please be sure to connect via Direct Connect in the test file as well). If needed, please, review this support article for instructions on how to create a new file and how to switch back to your original file after.

    Let us know how it goes!
    -Quicken Anja
  • nkm
    nkm Member ✭✭
    Sorry for the delay. Had to wait for the next round of scheduled transfers.

    I did not see the same results in the test file. But it is still occurring in my primary file.

    I was mistaken that it only occurs on the source account. It seems that it sometimes occurs on source and sometimes destination. I haven't seen it happen on both for the same transaction (yet).

    Thanks.
  • Quicken Anja
    Quicken Anja Moderator mod
    edited February 28
    @nkm Thank you for the additional information.

    Since the issue does not occur in the test file; next, what I suggest you try is to export and import the data from your original data file into a new data file and move forward using the new data file after the data from your original file successfully imports. Doing this copies your data into a new file without affecting your original file. Should this not work, then you can always switch back to the original file after.

    If you would like to try this, please, follow the steps below.
    1. Navigate to File
    2. Export
    3. Quicken Transfer File (QXF)...
    4. Save the exported file somewhere you can easily locate it (i.e.: DeskTop)
    5. Navigate back to File
    6. New...
    7. Start from Scratch
    8. Follow the prompts until it takes you to the new and empty data file
    9. Close the Add Checking Account pop-up
    10. Navigate back to File
    11. Import
    12. Quicken Windows File (QDF, QXF)... (even if you are on Mac)
    13. Select the .QXF file you previously exported
    14. Click Ok once you receive the message saying that the import was successful
    Once that is done, you should see that all your banking accounts (Checking, savings, money markets, credit cards, etc) were added to this new data file.

    Please note that you will need to re-establish online connections in the new file for any accounts you have set up for automatic downloads. 

    There are also a few features that will not be imported to the new file as these features do not export nor import. Please, refer to this support article under the section titled "More about QXF files" for more detailed information regarding what .QXF files do and/or do not export/import.

    If this resolves the issue for you, then you can rename and move forward using this new file. Below are steps to rename the new file from the name Quicken will auto-assign to it.
    1. Navigate to File
    2. Rename
    If you need to switch back to your original file, please follow the steps below.
    1. Navigate to File
    2. Open Recent
    3. Select the original data file name
    4. Click Open
    I hope this helps!
    -Quicken Anja
  • nkm
    nkm Member ✭✭
    So the only way to address the issue is to throw away 20 years of investment data?
  • jacobs
    jacobs SuperUser, Mac Beta Beta
    @nkm  The reply from Quicken Anja above is incorrect. The procedure for exporting and then importing a QXF file will include your investment accounts and transactions in a Quicken Mac to Quicken Mac process. I was pretty sure of this, but I just did such a test with my data file, and all my investment transactions came through the procedure. You should verify this for yourself, but as far as I know and can see, you will be fine with your investment data doing this process.

    That said, you should be aware that the QXF export/import process will lose any reports, budgets, attachments, and account settings (such as the column setups fo your registers). For some users, this is a minimal problem, for others, it requires quite  bit of work to re-configure everything. So this process is not ideal -- but it appears to be the catch-all approach Quicken support representatives use when there is some problem with the account configurations in the database that users can't access to reset/purge in some other way. By creating a fresh database and importing transactions into it, it does succeed in washing away anything problematic with the old database.

    (I'd love to see the Quicken engineers dive into what the problem are that requires this drastic step, and either fix the problems or create tools within the application to be able to purge accounts without requiring the drastic export/import process, but I'm not sure if they're even aware of these types of problems users run into; because there's no clear cause or way to diagnose them, they don't get reported as bugs.)

    Of course, doing the export/import doesn't require you to continue with the new file; you could always revert to your old file. And if the new file resolves your original problem, you should spend some time switching back and forth between your old file and new file to make sure all your account balances are correct and everything seems in order.
    Quicken Mac Subscription • Quicken user since 1993
  • DannyJ91
    DannyJ91 Member
    Hmm, i don't think you need to reload quicken a new QB file, this is not a glitch, but a function of transaction reporting from different accounts/institutions.

    @nkm I've put my current workaround for this below, i've also included my explanation for what is going on here, maybe old news to you, but assuming others with same issue are googling the problem, i included that portion. Skip to Solution if you already understand the cause.

    This duplicate transaction is caused by 2 things.

    1. When your credit card bank initiates the transaction, say 3/12/2021
    2. When your checking out bank processes the outgoing funds to pay, say 3/15/2021 (13th and 14th weekend, and assuming doesn't happen friday/saturday overnight.)

    Now when this "same" transaction is loaded in to QB, from 2 accounts/banks, you now have "2" transactions, because of the different date.

    Now when you categorize the transaction on the checking account ledger, you choose category "transfer > credit card xyz", and on the credit card ledger, you categorize as the exact opposite " transfer > checking account abc". This process associates the outgoing flow on the checking ledger with the credit card, and the incoming flow on the credit card with the checking account. THIS is what creates the duplication of transaction.
    You have already downloaded the checking account outflow transaction via sync (probably blue pencil on left, no issues), then you have categorized the incoming flow on the CC ledger to associate the incoming flow with the checking account (a transfer), QB creates an inverse transaction within your checking account to balance the *transfer*, now you have a duplicate, created by QB, on your checking ledger, with a red pencil to the left.

    As you mentioned, you can simply delete one, or the other, and everything balances out.

    Solution:

    Note, i am fairly new to Quicken, so this is not a time-tested and proven workaround, but currently my accounts are balanced. I will review and update this strategy as i sync in the future and see how smooth this works (or doesn't).

    Create a new account in both the "credit card" and "checking accounts" section of your accounts list. When creating, choose "offline account".

    I named the new checking account "CC Dupe Catcher", and the new CC account "Checking Dupe Catcher". So the inverse of each other.

    Now go to your real CC account ledger, find and select all of the transfers, they should currently be tied to your real checking account. Now re-categorize those to your "CC Dupe Catcher" checking account. You will now see a massive NEGATIVE value for that account on your chart of accounts, lets say $50,000 for simplicity.

    Now go your real checking account ledger, and do the same/opposite: Find and select all of the transfers, re-categorize them to the "Checking Dupe Catcher" CC account. You will now see a massive POSITIVE value for that CC account on your chart of accounts.

    THE TWO "FAKE" ACCOUNTS MUST BE EQUAL AND OPPOSITE to ensure no effect on the net worth value on your overall accounts.

    What this achieves is separating the real CC and real Checking transfers, but because

    A) the transfer still exists on both real account ledgers, just with different transaction dates

    B) the two fake accounts net to $0

    You now have everything documented, but not getting wires crossed.

    IF THE FAKE ACCOUNTS ARE NOT BALANCED, review the oldest and newest transaction dates in each fake account. I realized that i had 6 months of CC transactions, and 12 months of checking transactions, so had to manually enter the additional, earlier, 6 months of payments received on the CC side, to balance out those 6 months of payments sent on the checking side. This also required fiddling with the "opening balance" line on the real CC ledger to account for this manual previous payments.

    I believe you can "hide accounts", which i considered doing, but i also wanted to keep an eye that these two fake accounts stay balanced at all times, so i choose not to hide them, at least until i can confirm for multiple sync cycles that this approach works correctly.

    **Caveat** to this workaround, and i do not fully understand impact at this time, is when looking at other tabs, when looking solely at your cash accounts, that total will be misstated, low, by the amount of your fake "CC dupe catcher" checking account. The same goes for when looking at credit accounts, misstated, high, by the amount in the "checking dupe catcher" account. **This may be resolved by hiding these accounts, but again, until can confirm this works perfectly each sync cycle, i do not recommend hiding these accounts. I am also making the assumption that hiding an account removes the account balances from all related screens and math.
  • nkm
    nkm Member ✭✭
    Had to wait for scheduled transfers again.

    The duplication did not occur on the new cloned data file.

    However, the export/import process did badly mangle my investment accounts. It appears that every sell transaction has the wrong sign - i.e. every sale shows a decrease in the cash balance instead of an increase. There are over 3,000 of these transactions. Additionally in some accounts, the buy transactions are for zero shares of unspecified security, even though the total shares in the portfolio view appear correct.

    So it's really not feasible to use the cloned test file as my main file.

    @DannyJ91. Thanks for the suggestion, but I'm this issue even with transfers to other accounts at the same bank and with identical transaction dates so I'm not sure its the same issue as you. I haven't tried setting up a clearinghouse account yet but it may come to that.
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