Return (%) YTD is not consistent across accounts

Hi,

From what I have read here, the "Return (%) YTD" ion the Portfolio is a downloaded value, and not calculated.

I am seeing this value displayed for a security in one account - but not in another account _for the exact same security_. I am also not seeing this value displayed at all for some well known securities.

This securities this is happening for are all mutual funds.

What I have tried:
1. Doing a file Validation - including everything but "Delete and Rebuild"
2. Making sure all securities are "Matched with online".
3. Making sure that it is in fact the same security in the different accounts.

Does anyone have any idea why this might be happening?

Many thanks...

Answers

  • Jim_Harman
    Jim_Harman SuperUser ✭✭✭✭✭
    edited September 2021
    Interesting. You are correct that this data is downloaded and not computed based on your holdings.

    In the accounts where it is not displayed, is it blank or N/A?

    If you set the As of date one day earlier then back to the problem date, does that affect the problem?

    If you group by security rather than account, is it correct for all mutual funds? I am seeing that the data is blank for ETFs and money market funds, N/A if I do not hold any shares, and oddly 4 decimal places for stocks.

    What version and edition of Quicken are you running?
    QWin Premier subscription
  • 11dp20
    11dp20 Member ✭✭
    Hi,

    Thanks for responding. Version is the latest: R35.31.

    Interesting question about blank vs. N/A. Most are "N/A". However, some are blank. In fact, I have one case where the same security is blank in one account, and "N/A" in another.

    Setting the date back a day doesn't make any change to that column. I did notice that setting it back two moths doesn't impact the % for the securities that show it - seems weird, but maybe expected. Also the order of the securities change. Again, weird, but maybe expected.

    Great thoughts. Can you think of anything else to check?

    Thanks.
  • Jim_Harman
    Jim_Harman SuperUser ✭✭✭✭✭
    And the N/A's are for accounts where you currently hold the security? 

    The % doesn't change when you change the As of date because the data is downloaded for today only.

    There are other columns that are sometimes not displayed unless you change the date, which is why I asked about that.
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  • 11dp20
    11dp20 Member ✭✭
    Hi,

    Yes, the N/A appears in accounts where I currently hold the security.

    One interesting note, the cases where the "N/A" appears in one account and not another, the accounts are from the same institution. But this only happens from some securities.

    Ignoring the inconsistent securities for a moment - why would the "Return (%) YTD" appear as "N/A" for some well know mutual funds?
  • Chris_QPW
    Chris_QPW Member ✭✭✭✭
    11dp20 said:
    Hi,

    From what I have read here, the "Return (%) YTD" ion the Portfolio is a downloaded value, and not calculated.

    Have you held that security in all the accounts for the whole year?

    The reason the amounts "should be the same" is because each account should be getting the same dividends, and prices changes and such.  If one account didn't get all the same transactions (in proportionally).

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  • Jim_Harman
    Jim_Harman SuperUser ✭✭✭✭✭
    @Chris_QPW, the Return(%) YTD figures are downloaded from Quicken's quote provider, and do not depend on your purchases, sales, dividends, etc. This is not the same as Avg Annual Return.
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  • Chris_QPW
    Chris_QPW Member ✭✭✭✭
    @Chris_QPW, the Return(%) YTD figures are downloaded from Quicken's quote provider, and do not depend on your purchases, sales, dividends, etc. This is not the same as Avg Annual Return.
    Then explain this:


    I haven't own ETV for the full year in any account.
    The VG account is the "old account", and you can see that PTY has a Return (%) YTD value.
    What is going on here is I'm in the process of moving the securities to Chase.  I have yet to process the "remove shares" transactions in the Vanguard account because I haven't decided exactly how I want to do this to preserve the income, and other fields that get zeroed out in this process.
    The "Chris' Roth..." account is the one at Chase with just the buys processed as they came in from downloading.  (Note in the transfer partial shares were sold for cash, not actually transfers).
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  • 11dp20
    11dp20 Member ✭✭
    Yes! This screenshot is exactly what I'm seeing also. Same security, two different accounts, "Return (%) YTD" shows in one and "N/A" in the other.

    When it shows up, it certainly doesn't appear to be calculated. However, the fact that it doesn't show up for some accounts implies there is something about the account (time held?) which influence whether it appears or not.

    I just tested this. I entered a dummy transaction for the security in question on 12/31/2020, and the "Return (%) YTD" shows up! Obviously a downloaded value. I moved that dummy transaction to 1/1/2021, and "Return (%) YTD" shows as "N/A".

    So, we have is a downloaded statistic that won't appear in accounts where you have purchased that security in the current year, even though there is no technical reason it can't be displayed.

    This seems undesirable. If the "Return (%) YTD" is available, it should be displayed for every account that security appears in, even if it was recently purchased. It is interesting info.
  • 11dp20
    11dp20 Member ✭✭
    I've created an "Idea" to suggest this be fixed. Make noise if you care.

    https://community.quicken.com/discussion/7899208/display-downloaded-return-ytd-even-if-security-recently-purchased
  • Jim_Harman
    Jim_Harman SuperUser ✭✭✭✭✭
    That indicates that for some reason Quicken is over-riding the downloaded number with N/A if you did not own the security for the whole time period. They have been fooling around with these N/A's over the past several years. 

    At one time it showed N/A in the Avg annual return columns (a computed value) if you did not hold the security at the beginning of the period. Now it shows the confusing but technically correct result of the IRR computation if you have held a security for less than the full period. That explains why securities that you have held for a short period show the same Avg Annual Return for YTD, 1, 3, and 5 years. 
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  • Chris_QPW
    Chris_QPW Member ✭✭✭✭
    edited September 2021
    OK I will buy that.  The numbers are to "clean" to be anything directly related to the transactions, so I agree you are right it is a downloaded number.  Which of course then it is completely wrong to set it to N/A.

    Edit I tried deleting all the dividend transactions for PTY and Return (%) YTD didn't change.  So it is a downloaded value which should be displayed no matter how long you have owned the security, and so N/A is definitely a bug.
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  • BK
    BK Member ✭✭✭✭
    edited September 2021
    I just checked my AAPL held in multiple accounts.  Everything is fortunately consistent in the Investing tab > Portfolio view, but differ from reports and online.  Here are my results for Return % YTD:
    * Investing tab > Portfolio view:  12.7553%  (they are all identical)
    * Reports > Investment Performance: 19.49%  (wonder if Reinv-Divs elevated this)
    * Online search: ~ 12% > 14%
    Edit/Add: In one account, I did buy it for the first time in that account this year.

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  • Sherlock
    Sherlock SuperUser ✭✭✭✭✭
    BK said:
    I just checked my AAPL held in multiple accounts.  Everything is fortunately consistent in the Investing tab > Portfolio view, but differ from reports and online.  Here are my results for Return % YTD:
    * Investing tab > Portfolio view:  12.7553%  (they are all identical)
    * Reports > Investment Performance: 19.49%  (wonder if Reinv-Divs elevated this)
    * Online search: ~ 12% > 14%
    The Investment Performance report does not provide the Return (%) YTD.
  • BK
    BK Member ✭✭✭✭
    edited September 2021
    You are correct @Sherlock and thank you.  The report title (Inv Perf - YTD) misled me -  the last column says "Avg. Annual Return".  I stand corrected.  Scratch my prior post.

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