SERIOUS issue with Quicken reports

edmondme

Not sure who do I report this, but I have found a SERIOUS issue with Quicken reports.

If I have 2 transactions
Jul-1-2022 - Vendor - net $0 - split between gifts $10 and misc -$10
And
Jul-1-2022 - Vendor 2 - net $7 - split between gifts $10 and misc -$3

When I run a transaction report to see the misc transactions, I expect to see -$10 for the first entry and -$3 for the second, a total of -$13.

But that's NOT what's happening.
Quicken transaction report shows
-$10 for the first and +$3 for the second entry.

This is a huge BUG, How and who do I report this to?
There seems to be a bug on how transaction reports work with split entries.

Thanks for your comments. I am running the latest R42.8 27.1.42.8

[Deleted User]

@edmondme - are you using the same expense category for the $10.00 and $3.00?  Sometimes when you have a transaction that nets to zero, the transactions "flip", so you would need to go back in and change the sign for each split.

Jim_Harman

I think with a net zero transaction Quicken treats it as a deposit so the signs get flipped on the splits.

In your first transaction, try setting the Misc amount to -9.99. Quicken asks if the transaction is a payment or a deposit and records the signs for the split amounts accordingly. 

In your second transaction, did Quicken ask if it was a payment or a deposit when you entered it? that will give you the opportunity to set the signs correctly.

edmondme

No for sure, they are using the same transaction.
The report for certain should have stated -3 and total should have been -$13.

See the image. I don't think I am missing or doing anything wrong?

edmondme

I don't think the issue is the transaction with the net 0. I just deleted that split transaction with the net 0, and the one that had +10 and -3 and the report just shows +$3. It flips the sign. It's a net +$7

I just don't get it, transaction reports should report transactions as they are, why is it flipping the sign?

Can anyone see if they can recreate this issue in their quicken version.

This has huge ramifications for transaction reports

volvogirl

Then flip the signs on the transaction yourself.  That's common.  A lot of times after you make a transaction you need to go check if  the signs went the right way in the categories.  Especially for net zero transactions.  

Sherlock

edmondme said:

No for sure, they are using the same transaction.
The report for certain should have stated -3 and total should have been -$13.

See the image. I don't think I am missing or doing anything wrong?

The image you provided indicates one split transaction is a deposit and one split transaction is a withdrawal.

edmondme

Ok @volvogirl I can do that, but that messes up the original transaction. I am fixing the report but the actual transaction now shows +$10 and +$3 (which is +13???). The net for the transaction should be $7 (+$10 - $3)!!
This is wrong. this is absolutely wrong. I didn't spend $13, net net was $7

Tom Young

"I just don't get it, transaction reports should report transactions as they are, why is it flipping the sign?"

The transaction report isn't doing anything, it's simply reporting the transactions as Quicken (the program) put the transactions in the data base.  The point is that you do have to review any and all $0 split transactions to see that you get the correct result. 

volvogirl

Well you have to change the signs on all the split lines.  And it makes a difference whether you are entering a deposit or withdrawal in the account register.  Sometimes you can't tell which way the amounts will go in the category.  So you have to check the actual category by running a category report.  Then you might have to reverse all the signs on the split.

Sherlock

edmondme said:

Ok @volvogirl I can do that, but that messes up the original transaction. I am fixing the report but the actual transaction now shows +$10 and +$3 (which is +13???). The net for the transaction should be $7 (+$10 - $3)!!
This is wrong. this is absolutely wrong. I didn't spend $13, net net was $7

Sometimes the easiest way to understand what is happening is to enter the split entries as separate transactions in the register even if just temporarily. 

edmondme

Ok there must be something here, since everyone seems to imply I am doing something wrong that I have been doing for the past 30 years.

Ok one more time, here my image is very simple.
I have a transaction +$10 with a credit of -$3. net of +$7

I am running a report on the misc. transactions and I expect the report to show a credit of $3 (-$3), but this report shows +$3.

Yes I can change the transaction to be +$10+$3 and the report will now -$3, but that is just wrong. I didn't spend +$13. I don't expect reports to flip signs at random!

Sherlock

edmondme said:

Ok there must be something here, since everyone seems to imply I am doing something wrong that I have been doing for the past 30 years.

Ok one more time, here my image is very simple.
I have a transaction +$10 with a credit of -$3. net of +$7

I am running a report on the misc. transactions and I expect the report to show a credit of $3 (-$3), but this report shows +$3.

Yes I can change the transaction to be +$10+$3 and the report will now -$3, but that is just wrong. I didn't spend +$13. I don't expect reports to flip signs at random!

The image indicates the transaction is a withdrawal -$7.

The inflow of $3 does imply a credit of $3.

Nobody said to change the transaction to be +$10+$3.  They were suggesting you change +$10-$10 to -$10+$10.

edmondme

It's a credit card charge of $7!! The amount in the transaction is correct. It's a $10 charge, and I got a $3 credit (+$10 - $3) = $7
That transaction is correct and I am not going to change it for the report.
The report should indicate a -$3 charge.

Forget the net 0 (+$10 - $10). Those transactions for the reports are working.
This is a bug with split transactions, I am going to work with Quicken support.

This was not working like this before.

[Deleted User]

@edmondme - you are focusing on and adjusting the wrong transaction.  The one that we are all referring to is the one that nets to zero. ($10.00 Gift, $10.00 Misc)

[Deleted User]

@Edmondme - There is nothing wrong with the reports or the split transactions.   I do net zero split transactions all the time.  Sometimes the transactions get flipped (+ to -, or - to +) depending on the order you enter the split transactions and the category type (expense vs. income) you use.  You just need to verify that each transaction in the split transaction is being reported correctly with a positive or negative number, and if not, you just need to flip the sign (+,-) for each.

Sherlock

edmondme said:

It's a credit card charge of $7!! The amount in the transaction is correct. It's a $10 charge, and I got a $3 credit (+$10 - $3) = $7
That transaction is correct and I am not going to change it for the report.
The report should indicate a -$3 charge.

Forget the net 0 (+$10 - $10). Those transactions for the reports are working.
This is a bug with split transactions, I am going to work with Quicken support.

This was not working like this before.

Correct.  It is a charge of $7.  A net outflow of $7.  A Gifts outflow of $10 and a Misc inflow of $3.  The reports are correct.  The inflow for Misc the transaction is $3.

The net 0 (+$10-$10) as entered is a Misc outflow of $10 and a Gifts inflow of $10.  You indicated you wanted the transaction to be a Gifts outflow of $10 and and a Misc inflow of $10. 

There is no SERIOUS bug with reports.  There is a long existing well understood issue we've described with entering split transactions which net $0 because it is not obvious whether the transaction was entered as deposit or a withdrawal.

volvogirl

I would forget doing a split transaction.  Delete it.  Enter 2 separate transactions, one for a  $10 Charge and another for the $3 credit.  Then it should be clear which way they go.  It seems to be the net zero transactions that is reversed.  Delete that one and try entering it again.  Or maybe put the 0 in the other column (charge vs payment). 

Does the register use the 2 columns?  Or just the single amount column?  There are actually 3 columns...Payments, Deposit (or Charges & Payments) and Amount and then the Balance column.   Don't use the single Amount column.  Delete that column and just use the other 2 columns.