I own one security that uses TWO ticker symbols

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Dana
Dana Member ✭✭✭
edited March 26 in Investing (Windows)

Quicken version: R55.15 The security is UBS Select Treasury Inst. Fund. UBS uses one ticker (SETXX) for portfolio holdings and another ticker (MFIRSD) for the transactions' register. The only solution I have come up with is to enter transactions manually instead of using the download feature, by the holdings' ticker of SETXX. Note: this problem dates to late 2022 and has existed through several Quicken updates.

Does anyone have a better idea?

Thanks!

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  • NotACPA
    NotACPA SuperUser ✭✭✭✭✭
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    Please explain how that MFIRSD symbol is used in/by Q. Because I could only, at Fidelity Investments, find the SETXX ticker … and ALL mutual fund tickers end in the letter X.

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  • Chris_QPW
    Chris_QPW Member ✭✭✭✭
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    The only use Quicken has for the security symbol is downloading of prices when the security is a publicly traded security.

    Quicken uses the CUSIP ID for identifying the different securities. I'm sure that if you go to the security (Ctrl+Y, edit security) and select Other Info the two securities will have different CUSIP IDs.

    It isn't unusual at all that brokers have separate securities for moving money around. Like you sell a security and they put in a temporary account which is shown as moving the money into that security, and then when you buy a security, they move it out of that security/account to buy the new security. These accounts/securities can be quite "hidden" at the financial institution and lots of times the brokers don't download all of these transactions to Quicken.

    At the most, Quicken can only track one of these "hidden/cash accounts/securities" at a time. And in some cases, if the transactions aren't sent to Quicken correctly it can't even track that one as "cash".

    So, I would think that either this is what is going on, or maybe you have the security mismatched with the wrong CUSIP.

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  • Ps56k2
    Ps56k2 SuperUser ✭✭✭✭✭
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    the SETXX is an interesting UBS Institutional fund - and can be easily found in any public listing

    the MFIRSD appears to be another UBS Institutional fund - but is not found listed in any of the usual public financial sites.
    as mentioned - this may be an internal tracking UBS fund,
    and you might need to manually enter transactions with Quicken

    QWin - R54.16 - Win10

  • q_lurker
    q_lurker SuperUser ✭✭✭✭✭
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    @Chris_QPW
    The only use Quicken has for the security symbol is downloading of prices when the security is a publicly traded security.

    I think that is far too broad of a generalization. The ticker symbol is a key aspect to the storage of prices regardless of the source of the price, can be used in multiple manners for reports and data presentations, and can also be useful in selection of securities for transaction entries.

    I agree with you that both the downloaded transactions and the downloaded portfolio holdings are CUSIP based. But that very circumstance seems to negate the possibility of a mismatch. It sounds like the FI is sending two different CUSIPs.

  • Chris_QPW
    Chris_QPW Member ✭✭✭✭
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    @q_lurker you are right too much of a generalization on my part. The symbol is used in other places in Quicken, I really just talking about what happens during downloading. People seem to think that Quicken is matching the symbols to decide during a download if this security is a match or not and it isn't involved. In the case of QIF it uses the Security Name, in all other cases it uses the CUSIP ID in the downloaded information.

    And I agree that it is highly unlikely that it is a mismatch, I threw that out, not really thinking it through.

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  • Chris_QPW
    Chris_QPW Member ✭✭✭✭
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    Actually, I have a question, on this, and it is sort of why I threw out the "mismatch".

    The security is UBS Select Treasury Inst. Fund. UBS uses one ticker (SETXX) for portfolio holdings and another ticker (MFIRSD) for the transactions' register.

    Are you talking about Quicken's portfolio or holding view? The number of shares can only be from transactions in the register. The price is from the symbol downloaded (if publicly traded). If you are getting a price for MFIRSD it is coming in with the downloaded transactions (this is the only way you get nonpublic prices other than manual entry).

    Provided you are talking only about Quicken and not some portfolio information on the broker's website, then I read the problem as this.

    You know the security as SETXX, you might even have it in Quicken and get a price for it, but there are no shares for it.

    You download transactions and they come in as MFIRSD.

    If this all is correct, then it sounds like to me that the broker isn't really holding SETXX shares they are holding private MFIRSD shares that "represent" the SETXX shares. Or maybe they have just totally messed it up. But if you are getting prices for MFIRSD and they line up with the SETXX price does sound like the first case.

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  • Jim_Harman
    Jim_Harman SuperUser ✭✭✭✭✭
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    Note that both funds are money market funds with a share price fixed at $1.00.

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  • Dana
    Dana Member ✭✭✭
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    @Chris_QPW @q_lurker @Ps56k2 Thanks to all of you for your input!

    A new complication: UBS is using THREE Cusip codes. An additional code is used for reinvesting dividends, with a slightly different name.

    @Chris_QPW You wrote; Are you talking about Quicken's portfolio or holding view? I thought those were synonymous terms. What is the difference.

    @Ps56k2 I agree that these transactions will have to be entered manually and not downloaded. If you see my original post, it was my initial inclination. I haven't seen anyone suggesting some kind of work-around.

  • Chris_QPW
    Chris_QPW Member ✭✭✭✭
    edited March 24
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    @Dana The three different places you might have been referring to. The financial institution's website (BTW What is the financial institution?), The Investing tab → Portfolio, or the "Holdings" button in the investment account itself. I was asking mostly just to make sure that you weren't talking about something that was happening on the financial institution's website and not in Quicken. Or that one or more of the securities aren't actually getting downloaded transactions, just prices.

    But more to the point, are you saying they are downloading transactions from for these three securities/CUSIP IDs, and that they are treating them as if they are one?

    In other words, they aren't treating them like one or more of them is the cash account where they transfer in and out of it as you have buys and sells from the other?

    Clearly if you are getting transactions for all these accounts as if they are separate securities your financial institution is doing it completely wrong and, yes, your only resort unless the financial institution fixes the problem is to do manual entry.

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  • Ps56k2
    Ps56k2 SuperUser ✭✭✭✭✭
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    new complication:
    UBS is using THREE Cusip codes.
    An additional code is used for reinvesting dividends, with a slightly different name.

    So weird - what are the 3 different symbols and 3 different codes ?

    QWin - R54.16 - Win10

  • Dana
    Dana Member ✭✭✭
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    @Chris_QPW

    "But more to the point, are you saying they are downloading transactions from for these three securities/CUSIP IDs, and that they are treating them as if they are one?" Yes, that's what they are doing.

    @Ps56k2 Not three ticker symbols, but three Cusip codes.

    Note: I have turned off auto-download so that I can enter them manually.

  • NotACPA
    NotACPA SuperUser ✭✭✭✭✭
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    OK, so what are those 3 CUSIP codes?

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    Now running Quicken Windows Subscription, Business & Personal
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  • Dana
    Dana Member ✭✭✭
    edited March 25
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    @NotACPA
    One is: 3A0JE8 which is used for the holdings.
    Another is: 90262Y802 which is used for transactions on the brokerage website.
    I thought I remembered seeing a third Cusip, but not, I can't find it, at least not yet. I'll get back to you later, one way or another.

  • q_lurker
    q_lurker SuperUser ✭✭✭✭✭
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    3A0JE8 is not a CUSIP identifier, though it could be an identifier UBS is using like a CUSIP for some not-publicly-traded holding. Where in Quicken are you seeing that designation?

    90262Y802 is the CUSIP for the SETXX fund UBS Select Treasury Institutional Fund, a $1 money market fund.

    The UBS Fact Sheet for the SETXX fund states:

    The Fund is a “feeder fund” that invests in securities through an underlying “master fund.”

    That may be a factor in the confusion, I postulate.

    What does the Security List (Ctrl-Y) show for the Security Name, Ticker, and CUSIP for each of the securities related to this discussion?

    I suspect the SETXX security is named "MFIRSD : UBS Select Treasury Institutional Fund" with the ticker "SETXX" and the CUSIP ID "90262Y802". Further I suspect that is the security name being shown in transactions in the account's transaction list (per your screenshot in the original post). That presentation as part of the security name does not make MFIRSD the ticker.

    Given the confusion on who has done what, I have reverted the post title to your original.

  • Ps56k2
    Ps56k2 SuperUser ✭✭✭✭✭
    edited March 26
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    it's amazing that UBS actually has all this going on to support their investments….
    If you go to the UBS website and try to find these funds, it becomes a rats nest of embedded entries -

    Guessing that the MFIRSD is one of the Master Feeder funds -

    https://usmoneymarketfunds.com/sub-pages/CFJA/daily-liquid-assets.html



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