Simple View vs. Complete - Positions and Transactions

SomeItalianGuy

I have a company 401(k) account tracked in Quicken. The funds are spread across several investment funds, all of which appear as a single investment account that I monitor with "Simple View".

I also have a rollover IRA account in my own name and a Personal IRA account in my spouse's name. Each of these accounts are invested in multiple funds and each of these funds appears separately in Quicken's Investing account list.

I find that I like the consolidated view of my 401(k) as I can see the total dollar amount invested and the total return in a single place. With the two IRA accounts (mine and my spouse's), I can only see the total positions by manually adding the individual investment accounts.

Is there a way that I can combine the individual investment accounts of my rollover IRA into a single entity in Quicken so that I can view it the same way that I view the 401(k) account?

Boatnmaniac

@SomeItalianGuy - As stated by @Jim_Harman above, T Rowe Price downloads each fund as an individual account. There is nothing you can do to merge them all together into a single account in Quicken unless you stop downloading via OSU and instead set up and manage all those MFs as a signle offline manual account. That is not something I would consider doing because it will involve a fair amount of manual management of the account in Quicken but it is an option for those who wish to do that.

I had the same situation in the past with my mother's American Funds as you are having with your T Rowe Price MFs. What I did to get a single view of the AF portfolio holdings and performance was as follows and you might want to consider doing the same:

1. Opened, customized and saved the following Investing reports: Portfolio Value and Investing Performance. These reports were customized to show only the AF accounts and saved. Then I added those saved reports to the Toolbar so I could quickly retrieve them (with all the updated data already in them) at any time by simply clicking on the report icons in the Toolbar. The Toolbar with customized saved reports added to it looks something like what is shaded in yellow in the following picture.:
   
2. To get a Dashboard view for all of your T Rowe Price MF accounts you can go to the Investing tab and then click on Dashboard. There you can customize the Dashboard to include only the accounts you want to see. Unfortunately, I don't think there is any way to set up and save separate Dashboards so you can quickly view different portfolio scenarios. Instead, every time you want to see a difference portfolio you will need to customize the Dashboard there.
   

Jim_Harman

This is not really a Simple vs Complete mode question in Quicken terminology.

As I understand it, you have two real life accounts, each with multiple holdings but each holding is currently in its own account in Quicken. You want to set up Quicken so that all the holdings for each real life account are together.

Are you downloading transactions for these accounts, or are you recording everything manually? If downloading, the instructions to do this will be different.

SomeItalianGuy

"This is not really a Simple vs Complete mode question in Quicken terminology."

Yeah, I get that. I normally have the 401(k) displaying in Complete mode, but I recently had to disable and reenable online and when I did it defaulted to Simple mode - and, to be honest, I like it. In particular, the fact the way it shows a breakdown of my investments and the total return (hopefully) for the entire account.

Anyway, I should have said that, yes, I use Online Services to download transactions for all of my accounts, including my rollover IRA and my spouse's Personal IRA.

Thanks for your help!

NotACPA

How about using the Portfolio (Investing, Portfolio) and creating a view with only the pertinent accounts and select "Group By" Security?

But keep the accounts separate since they're separate in real life. Q should always reflect reality.

SomeItalianGuy

@NotACPA

"But keep the accounts separate since they're separate in real life. Q should always reflect reality."

I'm not sure that they are "separate" in actuality. When I visit the portal for my rollover IRA, I see a single page that summarizes all of my investments under the heading, "Rollover IRA". What I do not see, however, is an account number or other identifier for the entire portfolio.

Jim_Harman

What are the brokerage(s) for the IRA accounts?

When downloading, some brokerages require each mutual fund to be in its own account and some give you the option to have them separate or consolidated. I think T Rowe Price and maybe American Funds for example require the "Single mutual fund" accounts for IRAs and personal accounts. On its old mutual fund only platform, Vanguard allowed either separate or combined accounts; with its new brokerage platform, they only support combined accounts.

SomeItalianGuy

@Jim_Harman

The IRAs are both with T. Rowe Price. There are separate logins for myself and my spouse; in each case, when logged in it shows the entire portfolio of investments and the quarterly statements are similar - one combined statement for each of us.

I was able to find our "Investor Numbers" on those quarterly statements, so I am thinking about making a database backup and then try to create a new account entry based on the Investor Number then see what happens.

NotACPA

BY LAW, the IRAs for yourself and your wife MUST be separate. They can't be combined. That you can login and see both is irrelevant … they're separate accounts.

SomeItalianGuy

@NotACPA They are separate; sorry if that wasn't clear.

But, within each separate account are multiple sub-accounts for each of the funds in the portfolio.

NotACPA

By "sub-accounts" do you mean Account positions/holdings? Or are they actually separate in some way? Because, there's no such thing, in Q, as a "sub-account".

And, if you want to see total holdings of particular securities, the Portfolio view grouped by Security is still the way to go.

SomeItalianGuy

@NotACPA

Obviously, I am not explaining myself well. :)

My 401(k) is invested in multiple different stock funds. In Quicken - perhaps due to the way that I originally setup that account (?), I have one entry in the Investing group and it is currently set to Simple View. When I click the 401(k), I see a display divided into quarters:

top left is my holdings listed by fund name, with the current share count, price, value and last change amount and percent. It also shows grand total and total change since last update

top right is a donut chart showing the relative proportions of each fund as a percent of the total

bottom right is a value over time bar chart

bottom left is "Top Movers"

This account was originally set to "Complete" view, at which time the transaction log showed all transactions for all funds in the single log.

Now, for the two T. Rowe Price accounts - let's forget about my spouse's and just discuss my own. When I go to the T. Rowe Price web portal, I log into my account and the dashboard shows my total account value plus a listing of the various funds that I am invested in.

But, in Quicken, I cannot find a way to setup an account for my Rollover IRA in the same way as my 401(k) described above. Instead, the T. Rowe Price funds each come through to Quicken as separate investment accounts and I do not see any way to view them as a combined portfolio as I can with the 401(k).

Boatnmaniac

@SomeItalianGuy - As stated by @Jim_Harman above, T Rowe Price downloads each fund as an individual account. There is nothing you can do to merge them all together into a single account in Quicken unless you stop downloading via OSU and instead set up and manage all those MFs as a signle offline manual account. That is not something I would consider doing because it will involve a fair amount of manual management of the account in Quicken but it is an option for those who wish to do that.

I had the same situation in the past with my mother's American Funds as you are having with your T Rowe Price MFs. What I did to get a single view of the AF portfolio holdings and performance was as follows and you might want to consider doing the same:

1. Opened, customized and saved the following Investing reports: Portfolio Value and Investing Performance. These reports were customized to show only the AF accounts and saved. Then I added those saved reports to the Toolbar so I could quickly retrieve them (with all the updated data already in them) at any time by simply clicking on the report icons in the Toolbar. The Toolbar with customized saved reports added to it looks something like what is shaded in yellow in the following picture.:
   
2. To get a Dashboard view for all of your T Rowe Price MF accounts you can go to the Investing tab and then click on Dashboard. There you can customize the Dashboard to include only the accounts you want to see. Unfortunately, I don't think there is any way to set up and save separate Dashboards so you can quickly view different portfolio scenarios. Instead, every time you want to see a difference portfolio you will need to customize the Dashboard there.
   

SomeItalianGuy

@Boatnmaniac Thanks! This is very helpful information.

SomeItalianGuy

@Boatnmaniac

Ugh. I went ahead and setup a portfolio view and encountered a weird issue.

If I add my 401(k) account (which is with Voya, fwiw), to the portfolio view, it shows me the Total Value and Today's Change in dollars and percent. Under that, it shows a list of each fund that is invested with the Shares, Price, Value, Today $ and Today %. All of these columns are populated accurately.

However, if I add the T. Rowe Price funds to the portfolio, the Today $ and Today % columns are 0 and 0.00% respectively. The Shares and Value are correct, but the daily change is zero and the daily change is not reflected in the top heading.

Bug? Feature? Something specific to T. Rowe Price accounts?

Boatnmaniac

The Today $ and Today % are shown when there is an actual share price change that occurred for the day in question. Today is Saturday and the stock markets are closed so the $0.00 and 0.00% numbers for the T Rowe Price funds are valid. If you change the date for the portfolio view to yesterday you should see the correct change numbers for that day.

I am not familiar with Voya but since it is a 401(k) maybe it is similar to a 401(k) I used to have. The manager of my 401(k) would report MF price changes for the day only after midnight. So, the new prices from Friday would not be reported on Friday as Friday price changes but would instead be reported in Quicken on Saturday as Saturday price changes.

Another thing that will cause Saturday price changes: Most people primarily invest in mutual funds instead of in stocks and ETFs. If the MF has an international allocation exposure then the daily price changes for the international allocation securities are sometimes not received by the MF company until the next day so the MF price change for Friday, for instance would not be reported until Saturday.

Also, investments in commodities, crypto and currency can also have price changes on Saturdays because these things can often be traded on weekends and not just on business days.

SomeItalianGuy

@Boatnmaniac

Well, this is an interesting conundrum…

In my earlier comment, I was actually referring to the Dashboard view which does not permit changing the date.

You are correct - in Portfolio view, the T. Rowe Price accounts display correctly when I change to any previous day. And, yes, Voya updates after midnight (actually, at around 5:00 AM), so that explains why, in Dashboard view, the 401(k) shows $ and % change data while the T. Rowe Price accounts show zeroes.

And now, all of this defeats the purpose of the entire exercise: to see in one place the total gain/loss $ and % across all of the retirement investments (one 401(k) and two personal IRAs) in a dashboard-style view.

Oh well.

Boatnmaniac

And now, all of this defeats the purpose of the entire exercise: to see in one place the total gain/loss $ and % across all of the retirement investments (one 401(k) and two personal IRAs) in a dashboard-style view.

I'm not sure why you are thinking that it defeats the purpose of the entire exercise. I guess it would be if you will only be reviewing the Dashboard on weekends and holidays but if you review the Dashboard on business days after when most MF prices are updated, would that not give you the view you want to see?

BTW, you would probably also be disappointed if you try to review the Dashboard on weekday mornings or afternoons because MF prices will not be updated for the day until later that evening. Until that evening, you would also see the $0.00 and 0.00% for the day because the day's changes will not yet have occurred. (The snapshot of the Dashboard picture I posted above was taken on Thursday during the day….note that it shows no info for price changes for the day because those changes had not yet occurred.)

Now, if you were to be invested in stocks, ETFs, cryptos, currencies, commodities, those prices are real time and updated throughout the day. Those price changes would be reflected in the Dashboard when the markets are still open.

For me, I generally will not pay much attention to the Dashboard until later in the evening when most of the MF prices are set and downloaded. If I want to see that information at any other time, I will usually pull up those two Investing reports that I'd mentioned (Portfolio Value and Investing Performance).

Jim_Harman

Also due to a longstanding bug in Quicken, even if prices have been downloaded for the current day, the Price Day Change and Price Day Change (%) columns in the Portfolio views sometimes read zero. Setting the As of date back by one day then returning to the desired date causes the Portfolio view to be updated. See this discussion

https://community.quicken.com/discussion/7883007/update-of-security-prices-in-portfolio-view-vs-security-detail-price-update