What's faster and more reliable - Citibank

jl747 · October 10

This just popped up when I opened Quicken.
They are announcing a connection change for Citibank accounts.

My questions is what's more reliable and faster than the Direct Connect that I am using now?
Are they switching to EWC+?

It would be nice if they mentioned it in the warning.

Have not updated (OSU) yet today.

Edit: I am using Citi Cards to connect via Direct Connect

splasher · October 10

There is nothing better then Direct Connect IF it is available.

In recent history, the trend has been that if a FI changes to EWC+, they sadly drop DC. EWC+ is free to the FI and DC has a fee associated paid to Intuit (the aggregator) and they have to have software on their computers that costs them $ in their IT department to maintain for the DC interface.

jl747 · October 10

I hope that this new connection (EWC+) fixes all of the problems others are currently having with Citi and not add those of use that aren't.

Note: I know about EWC+. My Schwab and Chase were switch way back when.

Scooterlam · October 10

FWIW, I had reauthorized my connection prior to seeing this message tonight. The connection method is EWC+

Boatnmaniac · October 10

I have not gotten that popup, yet. I've been guessing that it would be coming soon because of all the Citi connection issues with both EWC+ and DC that I've experienced over the last couple of months. The latest blow up a couple of weeks ago that seemed to affect all EWC+ connected Citi accounts made me think that DC will probably come to an end soon. It seemed to me that there was a big switch flipped either at Citi or Intuit regarding EWC+ that really messed everything up. (DC and EWC did not appear to be affected at all….at least not for me.)

I currently have 2 Citi cards that are set up with DC (Citi Costco Visa, Citi Rewards+ MC) using the Citi Cards FI so I'm quite "interested" in understanding when this will happen.

If Citi and Intuit can pull off EWC+ like US Bank and Chase have for me (very reliable connections & downloads) then I won't be very concerned.

But if they mess it up like was experienced a couple of weeks ago or like PNC Bank and Fidelity have, then I am very concerned because the Costco Card is a high usage card for me.

Or, is this popup more geared to some of the Citi co-branded retail cards, many of which are still using EWC? I've have a fair number of connection issues the last couple of months with the Sears MC and the Macy's Amex (which is managed by Citi) and they are EWC connected FIs. That would make some sense because EWC+ is more secure and faster than EWC and when it is set up correctly with the FI it is also pretty reliable.

Boatnmaniac · October 10

UPDATE: I decided to close and reopen Quicken just now. When I did this I got this popup, too.

Chris_QPW · October 10

For what it is worth, Citibank never had Direct Connect for non-credit card accounts, it was always Express Web Connect.

I don't have any checking/savings accounts with Citibank, but the threads in this forum have always made that clear. I do have a Costco credit card, and it has always had Direct Connect (well when they didn't it mess up) and it is still work as of now. But there is more to the story, it also had Express Web Connect, until a few months ago, where it changed over to supporting Express Web Connect + (and still supporting Direct Connect).

Now here is where the "messed it up" comes in. When they did change from Express Web Connect to Express Web + they broke Direct Connect for a time where if had to re-setup it wouldn't work. They did eventually get that fixed. There were also reports that it only worked for one Direct Connect account. I'm not sure the status on that.

And here is my "story" on this. Since I was already using Express Web Connect + for Chase (which is all they support now {changed from Direct Connect/Express Web Connect) I decided that it really wasn't much worth keeping just the one account I had with Direct Connect (the Costco card), so I actually changed it over to Express Web Connect + (mostly just to get rid of the Password Vault requirement).

That worked for a time and then as reported by lots of people a couple of weeks ago that stopped working. At that time, I switched back to Direct Connect (which is where I'm at now).

This is a very long-winded explanation that Express Web Connect + for the Citi Cards isn't new, this announcement has to be about the bank accounts. And hopefully they have fixed Express Web Connect + for the credit cards too.

Chris_QPW · October 10

UPDATE: Express Web Connect + for Citi credit cards is working.

Boatnmaniac · October 10

I knew that Citi had previously cut in EWC+ with the Citi Cards FI but I kept my 2 Citi cards set up with DC. I thought it would be better to take a wait-and-see approach to how well Citi's EWC+ worked.

Well, it sure seems that my wait-and-see approach to Citi's EWC+ will be coming to an end real soon.

Chris_QPW · October 10

https://community.quicken.com/discussion/comment/20457038#Comment_20457038

Maybe, Maybe not. Citi has always treated the credit cards differently, so they might not kill off Direct Connect, this might only be for the bank accounts.

I will also note that Chase is been quite reliable using Express Web Connect +, at least for me, others might not agree. This really comes down to how reliable the financial institution is. Express Web Connect + help in the standardizing of the protocol and such, but it isn't a cure all for all the possible problems, and even adds some new possible ones (the "reauthorize" problems).

I think a lot of it depends on the financial institution, but in the case of Express Web Connect + it actually depends somewhat on the user. There isn't any doubt that authorizing it more complicated than just putting the username/password, which most Direct Connect setups had.

On the other hand, for the financial institutions that required you to do something on their site to authorize it, it is about the same (biggest problem has been web browser compatibility problems).

But Express Web Connect + vs Express Web Connect should be "no brainer", as to which is best, especially if the financial institution is forcing MFA for their website.

jl747 · October 11

Just a followup to my OP comment
"Edit: I am using Citi Cards to connect via Direct Connect"

Here is what my Account Details/Online Services looks like.

BK · October 11

@Chris_QPW , what do you mean by "biggest problem has been web browser compatibility problems"?

Chris_QPW · October 11

https://community.quicken.com/discussion/comment/20457082#Comment_20457082

To reauthorize it starts you logging into the financial institution's website with what I guess is a special URL using your default web browser.

For some people, especially if they are using a "restrictive web browser" or "restrictive settings" this might fail to even start, but for even more people they login go through the steps on the financial institution's website and then there should be some "handshaking" that tells Quicken that it has been authorized, and that fails for some people.

To a minor degree the next "biggest" problem seems to be that they have to repeat this reauthorization at times where is really should be a one time event.

Boatnmaniac · October 11

https://community.quicken.com/discussion/comment/20457134#Comment_20457134

The issue(s) you mentioned could very well be a browser problem, at least in part. I know for myself, when I get prompted to reauthorize I almost always need to disable all of my browser extentions (most of which are some sort of security app) and then the reauthorization almost always works on the 1st try. After completing the reauthorization I then re-enable those browser extensions.

But I believe it is also something that Quicken can control from their end without users needing to do anything at all. When I was testing US Bank's EWC+ transition with the Quicken Development Team (about a month before USB actually transactioned to EWC+) I ran into these same errors when trying to get USB to reauthorize my accounts. One of the engineers then made some changes on his end (I could hear him clicking on his keyboard) and then the reauthorization performed perfectly…..and I did absolutely nothing with my browser settings nor the extensions. So I do think that in many if not most reauthorizations the issues that users run into should not be happening at all because there seems to be something that can and should be done by the Development Team on their end to eliminate these reauthorization issues. So, I really don't know why so many are still encountering reauthorization issues.

BK · October 11

Thanks for that @Chris_QPW

To a minor degree the next "biggest" problem seems to be that they have to repeat this reauthorization at times where is really should be a one time event.

From Citi's data management hub, seems like the authorization validity period with Citi is now one year (I reconnected today) - I don't recall seeing this expiration date in the past:

Chris_QPW · October 11

https://community.quicken.com/discussion/comment/20457139#Comment_20457139

Interesting, I looked on the Citi site and see the same, but on the Chase site they aren't showing any expiring date.

jl747 · October 11

When I go to "Manage Your Desktop Apps" this what I see.

I am using Direct Connect, for now.

BK · October 11

I tried everything and it refuses the DC connection - that I had with my re-branded Citi card! When adding Citi Cards > Advanced > DC, The authorization is successful on the Citi side but when the token is sent back to Quicken, it fails. I tried everything for a week, gave up and resorted to EWC+.

So I was thinking that it might be a browser issue when trying DC, but if that was the case, then why would it succeed with EWC+? So I believe that something on my account at Citi (not Quicken) changed where DC is no longer available to me - and perhaps soon for everyone else based on the pop up in the OP.

Chris_QPW · October 11

@BK Direct Connect doesn't do a "reauthorization"/token. And not all Citi credit cards support Direct Connect (especially not "store branded" ones).

And I forgot about one of the things that got messed up when Express Web Connect + on the credit card accounts kicked in. You can't have any Express Web Connect Citibank accounts and get Direct Connect to work.

Process for Direct Connect Citi Credit card:

Type in Citi in the Searc for your financial institution dialog and select Citi Cards → Advanced Options

Then Continue, select Direct Connect → Next, and you have to be getting this dialog next:

If you get the reauthorize dialog instead, you are out of luck.

EDIT:

Note: that if you get this dialog you need to authorize Direct Connect on the Citi Cards website before connecting by going to "Profile" → "More Settings" → "Manage Desktop Apps" → "Add Access".

BK · October 11

@Chris_QPW

I understand what you are saying. However my AT&T Universal Card (Citi) was DC connected up until two weeks ago. But no more.

That being said, using the steps in this specific comment, some users were able to reestablish the DC with "authorization" to my surprise. So I thought there was a back door that I wasn't aware of.

Chris_QPW · October 11

There are multiple things that all have to line up for Direct Connect to work (some financial institutions don't need authorizing by the financial institution, and some you have to actually contact the financial institution to turn it on).

Financial institution has to support it.
Intuit has to put the proper settings in the fidir.txt
Quicken has to properly display the right dialogs (which since they started using Express Web Connect + isn't a given, especially if the financial institution is Citibank and you have banking accounts).
You have to actually select Direct Connect and get the username and password prompt, which might involve things like using a different financial institution name and using the Advance Options.
You might have to authorize it at the financial institution.

There aren't any "back doors", just one or more of these things might not be working/done properly

What's faster and more reliable - Citibank

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