Why?
Why do Quicken files validate fine but won’t download transactions? Why when I restore a backup from a month ago, everything works fine?
Why?
Answers
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Validation checks the integrity of the file and its inner relationships, not the download connections.
I've got not guess why a backup works fine for downloading and your current file doesn't.
-splasher using Q continuously since 1996
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I think there is a lot "myths" associated with Validate and Repair.
Even in the proper domain, which as @splasher says is the data file integrity, it certainly can't fix everything. And there is huge amount of things that fall outside of that domain. Something as simple as a setting for instance. If some setting gets turned off that might cause problems for you, but it isn't something that Validate and Repair is even going to check.
To something much more complicated like the fact that the data file and what is stored on the servers isn't independent from each other. There is a relationship that has to be maintained for instance with the Quicken account and an online account. Or a bill in Quicken and an online bill.
I personally rely on using an older version of my data file than on Validate and Repair, but both have their limitations and use cases. And notice I didn't say Restore. I think that operation is one more dangerous than copy because it will try to "resync" the data file to the online services.
What you haven't described in your post is what got you to do Validate and Repair in the first place.
That might be important to point to the best solution, which might be the use of the old backup file.
But there is a reason that Validate and Repair makes a backup of your current data file before it runs. It neither guarantees that it will fix things or that you will even have a usable data file when it finishes. That last part is something that I don't think people realize or think about enough. Validate and Repair might make your data file "consistent" by removing parts of your data depending on what got corrupted.
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@Chris_QPW Let’s skip the validate and repair discussion. What causes the file to stop downloading new transactions and an older backup when restored fixes things? Why can’t Quicken fix that? This last week with Schwab has been troubling and created angst as to the fragility of connections to banks and downloading transactions. They said restore an older file to fix whatever has been corrupted in my active file. What got corrupted? I have had to do this twice during the Schwab debacle.
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@Paddy sometimes if you take extraordinary efforts to fix a connection, sometimes it does more harm than good. If I encounter an error while doing an OSU, or if Quicken is not working or not working well, here are the steps I take:
- If it's a connection issue I check for notes from the financial institution the error message. Sometimes the note contains the solution.
- Go to the Quicken Support website and read about the issue. Often times there is a solution in the support documentation.
- Check the financial institution website for messages that might provide an explanation for the connection issues. A lot of times the website is down for maintenance.
- Check the Quicken Community to see if other users are experiencing the same issue, and if so, I don't do anything but wait for a resolution, or solution to be provided. In the meantime, I find another way to get information loaded to Quicken, if available.
- If I do any troubleshooting, these are the steps I do -
- Go to the account register and an "Update now"
- Do a data file validation. As said, it is not a "cure-all" or give a detailed issue log, but it does fix some data file issues.
- Sign out of my Quicken ID and sign back in.
- Uninstall and reinstall the Quicken program.
- Check sync settings and make sure syncing for the account hasn't been turned on (if you don't want it to be). Even if you have sync turned off, it still can be turned on for an individual account.)
- Depending on the error code, I sometimes deactivate and reactivate the online connection. I am always reluctant to do this right away unless directed to do so or know from experience that doing this won't cause further issues.
- If I have recurring connection issues or issues that affect multiple financial institutions, I sometimes will do the "File-Copy" process to get a "fresh start" for my online connection. This process also fixes issues by removing some of the file corruption that can accumulate in a file over time.
- If all else fails, and depending on the error, I restore from a backup. I usually only do this if everything else fails.
What I never do is delete out any system files or folders unless directed to do so from a trusted source.
The other thing I never do is a "Ctrl-Alt-Del" to close Quicken because it can cause file corruption. This file corruption doesn't always show issues right away. It sometimes causes issues days, weeks, months after. If I have no choice but to do a Ctrl-Alt-Del, I always then restore from the most current backup immediately after.
Trying to completely stop synching can also cause issues. Even though you may have syncing turned off, Quicken still seems to need to use it for EWC and EWC+ connections (behind the scenes). I am very careful of what Quicken cloud files I delete and only do so if absolutely necessary.
The fact you are having issues is not indicative of an issue with the Quicken program. If you are having issues with Quicken, it could be something unique with your installation. In your case, if you haven't done so already, I would try uninstalling and reinstalling the Quicken program and see if that helps
Lastly, from what you are describing in your situation makes me think that your issue is indeed file corruption. Maybe some of the steps you took to attempt to get the Schwab connection working caused the issue. Maybe then when you restore from a backup your file is working fine, but then the connection attempt process is causing the file corruption again. Maybe Quicken freezes and you do a Ctrl-Alt-Del to exit the program? It is really difficult to determine unless you are able to give a detailed account of all the things you did before the issues started. Quicken is a great program, but it is complicated and sometimes things go awry, and it is difficult to determine how, when, and why.
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@Paddy here is some documentation of the process. The process provides a clean copy of your data file. It also cleans out any existing online connections. This also means you would need to reactivate all of your online connections. It might definitely help your situation.
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@Paddy another important thing - whenever you do any major troubleshooting on your data file, always do a backup. It doesn't hurt to do backups during troubleshooting, just in case you need to go back a step. Making backups can be a lifesaver but it is easy to forget to do so.
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Unfortunately, I can't answer that, I doubt anyone can without digging into the exact cause of the problem. And that might be require people/access to information that just isn't possible (at the worst extreme).
At best other users/moderator can throw out guesses.
And another thing, people tend to work to a "solution", but not to a "cause".
Another words, the moment you say, "a backup works", you can expect Quicken support to stop working on the problem. That is unfortunate, but that is the way it is.
But let me talk a bit about the guesses/troubleshooting that is usually performed.
in general, a problem like this is tends to get divided into three major areas. On the user's machine and the Quicken/Intuit servers and the financial institution.
Let me go back to your original question:
Why do Quicken files validate fine but won’t download transactions? Why when I restore a backup from a month ago, everything works fine?
Why?
On the surface this seems like a simple answer, "There must be something corrupt in your data file." That of course at best is the symptom and not the cause. But I live in a different world than most people. Where they see a simple problem, I see a complicated one.
First off, even your question is more complicated than it seems on the surface. I went off on a tangent because you mentioned Validate and Repair and didn't actually ask questions that needed to be asked to not go out into the shotgun approach. "won't download transactions" can mean multiple different things. And jumping to assumptions of what you meant isn't a good idea. Were there any error messages? Are you just saying you did the update and nothing came down?
The two are quite different to try to troubleshoot.
But back to my complicated world.
First there is the data file. Something might be in it. Then there is the fact that Quicken Inc has built up a complicated "caching" system on their servers, throw in the Intuit servers and then the financial institution. And this reminded that another basic question wasn't asked. Which financial institution? Multiple ones?
And how did you go back to that month-old copy of your data file. Did you use Quicken's Restore?
I can make guesses at all of these, but I can be wrong on one or more.
Here is what I have in my mind about the system they have created. Note that this is only what I can piece together since they won't really tell us how the system works.
I'm going to jump to one assumption because I doubt it is involved, and that is that you aren't talking about accounts setup with Direct Connect or Web Connect. The accounts are either Express Web Connect or Express Web Connect +.
For Express Web Connect and Express Web Connect + about 2 years ago Quicken Inc decided to insert their servers into the mix. ALL downloading using these is "synced", with the same syncing system as "Sync to Mobile/Web". The flow is Desktop data file → Quicken server → Intuit server → financial institution (both directions).
So why does it matter that the Quicken servers are there?
Think about this. Several financial institutions changed from Direct Connect to Express Web Connect +. Since the unique Ids also changed one would have expected a flood of duplicate transactions at change over. But that didn't happen. In fact, what did happen is reports of missing transactions went up (not 100%, but more).
Something changed, and I'm 99% sure that change was on the Quicken server. They have employed some kind of system to determine unique transactions.
Now with that in mind. For whatever reason that system gets messed up, and it starts blocking all transactions. And this isn't just speculation out of nowhere. You aren't the first to mention that transactions just stopped downloading (note I'm jumping to the conclusion since you didn't mention errors, and the fact that there aren't widespread threads about this, that I have the situation right, but I don't even have what financial institution(s) you are talking about. That is a LOT of assumptions!)
You do a Quicken Restore. Well, Quicken Restore isn't just putting your data file back. They changed that shortly after they changed to have Quicken servers in between. It happened at the same time they changed Copy so that it removes all of the online services from the copy.
It is clear to me that Quicken's Restore does some kind of "resync" or maybe even removing what is on the server and recreating it. When you create a system that has to keep two sets of data in sync, you can get out of sync in either place.
So, that right there makes your question extremely difficult to answer without direct access to your data file and the data on the server(s). Not to mention the time and expertise it would take to find the exact cause.
You will notice that one of @CaliQkn's suggestion is Quicken's Copy.
Well, this does more than the old Copy that use to do a record-by-record copy that would clean up some data file problems. It blows away all the online service connections.
It's not hard to see for a downloading transactions program this might "fix" the problem just like the Restore "fixed" the problem. These are equal to "Have you tried deactivating and reactivating the account?" kind of answers. Or even "Have you right resetting the account?".
They are all talking about blowing away some information to try to get things back in sync.
BTW I have noticed with my Chase accounts that are Express Web Connect + that if I do a reset, the behavior is always to "Reauthorize". So, whatever "Reset" used to be in comparison to totally disconnect/reconnect in the past I think has been changed to "just break the connection and redo it".
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I want to say one thing more. For quite some time now I decide stop posting about fixing downloading questions with rare exceptions. And that is because I don't like repeating the same information over and over and I don't like the frustration of dealing with problems that I really can't do anything about.
In my opinion for these kinds of problems you really sort of have to determine one thing. Is this an "individual's problem or something on the server?".
If it is the individual use the shotgun methods because that is all you are going to get.
If it is a server problem (and I don't care which one) then the people should be directed to contacting Quicken Support and have them track down the problem. No one on this forum can help.
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@Chris_QPW I think what you are experiencing is burn-out. There is just so many times you can say the same thing and give the same explanation to provide a solution. It seems like the wheel is being recreated each time a Quicken user requests help, either from this community or Quicken Support. The moderators are doing a good job in consolidating issues as they arise, but there seems to still be a disconnect in getting the Quicken user pointed in the right direction. I hate to say this but it may come down to just plain old lack of knowledge or training when it comes to Quicken Support. It is not easy to provide support for a product you don't use. That is why Quicken relies heavily on Super Users and experienced users. They are one ones with practical experience and first hand knowledge of Quicken. And again, I completely understand your frustration.
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@CaliQkn I'm way past burn-out, I hit that years ago. 😂
It might not seem like it, but how much I'm posting on here these days, is nothing to what I used to post.
I don't really get frustrated any more, I have just put it on my "the things you can't really do anything about list" and go on.
I will note that Quicken has been made a lot more "dangerous" in last ten years or so and as such even what used to be a safety net no longer applies.
I used to troubleshoot people's problems by trying some of them in my data file. For the most part I don't do that anymore since even a copy of your data file isn't a guarantee that you can recover from a given problem.
I described what happens if you use Quicken Restore, but I didn't mention what happens if you just use a copy of your data file. I prefer a copy for "short duration" getting back to where I was, but if it too far in the past you can get into problems where the Quicken Desktop data file is too far out of sync with what is on the server, and it causes problems. That is basically why they changed Restore to "sync/remove server data".
But it is clear to me that they haven't covered all of the possible conditions where the two are out of sync.
So, yes backing up and using that backup file should be done, but it is a 100% any more like it was when Quicken's data file was more self-contained.
BTW one thing I will leave you guys with. It is extremely important to determine if the problem is something that is affecting lots of users before you start trying to "fix it".
I will use the recent Vanguard situation as an example. The people that tried "fix" the problem by doing things like deactivating and reactivating, caused themselves all kinds of problems whereas the people that just waited didn't have the same problems.
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I have an appointment tomorrow with tier 2. I’m burned out. I’ve been using Quicken for so many years now and Schwab has just become troublesome and quicken’s response and Schwab‘s response is the same finger pointing and we’re working on it
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Okay, I met with Quicken support person today. Here is the thing that resolved my issue and I do not know why the 1st line do not tell people this but I had to deactivate the account and then remove the Financial Institution and Account Number. Do not remove the Account Name. I then selected Add Account using the plus sign. By Adding Account it as if I am adding a new account rather than using Set Up Now and all the transactions showed up.
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@paddy that is great that you found and solution for your issue. That process of deactivating and reactivating your online connection is pretty standard. It is item "f" in my post from yesterday. As I indicated I am reluctant myself to deactivate and reactivate accounts, but it looks like that was the solution to your issue. I guess I should be more inclined to use it in the future.
Hopefully now going forward your Schwab account will work without issue, but if you do have any issues, you know you will find support in the Quicken Community and Quicken Support.
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@CaliQkn Apparently deactivating and reactivating was NOT what fixed @Paddy 's problem. I assume by "reactivating" @Paddy means clicking on "Set up now" on the Online Services tab after Deactivating.
If you read the post carefully, the 2nd tier agent had him Deactivate and then go through the Add Account path to relink his account to Schwab. Using Add account rather than Set up now lets you tell Quicken to use a different connection method and if necessary a different account number than the one you deactivated.
This is the same process that some Vanguard users had to use to get their transactions to download correctly after the recent outage.
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@Jim_Harman - yes I went back and reread his comment. "Adding Account" was said instead of "reactivating" by "Set up now". Subtle point, but a very important one. Thank you for pointing it out.
@Paddy - hopefully is this not all confusing to you. But bottom line, when an account is re-setup with online services, the usual practice is to use "Set up now" on the Online Services tab of Account Details. But in some cases, the only way to get a connection to work is to treat the account as "new" and use "Add Account" to re-setup online services.
The important thing is you have a solution for your issue and hopefully things will work smoothly. But again if you have any issues or questions, you know you have support with this Quicken Community or Quicken Support.
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Note when you use "Add account" to reconnect, you do not actually add any new accounts to Quicken, you select the option to link the accounts it shows to your existing accounts.
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Many "Thank Yous" to Paddy and Jim Harmon for their clear and effective solution. I would like to add one more step if your account continues to not show transactions after creating the new account. Right click on your Vanguard account, select "Edit/Delete account" and then inside the "Tracking Method" box, click the "Complete - Positions and Transactions" button on the bottom left. My account took a couple seconds to update and show all of my transactions.
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