Password One Drive Patch Update Release (Windows 11Operating System)
Does the patch released today work for both the Canadian version of Quicken as well the US version?
Answers
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QWin Canada and QWin US are two separate softwares and the patches for each are not interchangeable for the other. If you try to install a US patch on a Canada installation, it will not work.
That being said, there were two patch release announcements yesterday…one was for QWin US and one was for QWin Canada. The one you want (since your profile shows you are running QWin Canada) is this one. It includes a fix for OneDrive.:
As a side note: I recommend not using OneDrive (or any other Cloud storage site) for your main data file. There is a long history of Quicken performance and potential data file corruption issues when the main data file is saved/run from OneDrive. In my mind, it is not so much a question of if these issues will happen but when they will happen and how bad will they be. It is, however, OK to save Quicken backup files on OneDrive.
Quicken Classic Premier (US) Subscription: R60.15 on Windows 11 Home
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Not that I suggest it (I strongly discourage it, for two reasons), but in fact Quicken Windows US and Canadian are no longer two different "softwares/branches", and I'm 99.999% sure the patch will install even though it was meant only for Quicken Windows US.
Behind the scenes the Quicken Windows developers have merged the two branches and now it is only subscription/settings in the data file (whether was created "US" or "Canadian") that decides its functionality. Basically, just like how different "editions" have different functionality.
The main reason for not installing this patch on the Canadian version is because it wasn't intended/tested for that purpose.
The second reason for not doing it is because based on the feedback so far in the other threads on this problem, this patch didn't fix the problem with OneDrive.
How do I know? Well, I have mentioned several times that since I was in beta for the Canadian release and got my Quicken Id connected with a Canadian subscription (that has long time expired) when I go to create a new data file it gives me the option of creating either the US or Canadian data file. I also have a Canadian data file created in that way.
So, for grins I went ahead and install the last Canadian patch version on my "US" copy of Quicken.
Here is what it shows for the "About" when in a Canadian data file:
Here is what it shows for the "About" when in a US data file:
And I checked the tax lines on the categories, and they flip too when switch data files that are for the different countries.
This was one of the big flags that they have merged that Canadian version back into the US branch. See it was before that they both got the tax lines out of the same file that would be changed during the install. People were using the fact that they were reading from that data file and adding tax lines. Well, about a year or two again, people noticed that they no longer could do that (the files were still left there but not being used). What they did is bring that information into something that Quicken now switches depending on what data file it is in.
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I have downloaded the latest update and am now running Version 53.17 Build 27.1.53.17 Edition Canada. The fix that was in this update does not work for me. Yesterday I received an email from Quicken suggesting that users apply the following patch, https://assistant.quicken.com/patch/QW27.2.63.19MPatch.zip to fix the problem but there is nothing in the email to suggest which Quicken version, US or Canadian the patch applies to. I am hesitant to try it until I know for sure that it will work with the Canadian version.
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Not that I suggest it (I strongly discourage it, for two reasons), but in fact Quicken Windows US and Canadian are no longer two different softwares/branches", and I'm 99.999% sure the patch will install even though it was meant only for Quicken Windows US.
I was not aware of this "merging" of QWin US and QWin Canada happening. Good to know. Thanks for correcting me.
The main reason for not installing this patch on the Canadian version is because it wasn't intended/tested for that purpose.
I wholeheartedly agree. We should never be installing a version update that is not intended/tested for the installed application/subscription. Too many risks involved with doing that.
The second reason for not doing it is because based on the feedback so far in the other threads on this problem, this patch didn't fix the problem with OneDrive.
Good catch. I meant to mention that in my prior post and to state that if the OneDrive fix mentioned in the QWin Canada release notes is the same OneDrive fix in the QWin US release notes, then there is a high probability that the "fix" won't actually resolve the issue in QWin Canada as well.
Quicken Classic Premier (US) Subscription: R60.15 on Windows 11 Home
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R63.19? I am not aware of anything regarding this manual patch. Nothing about it has been announced regarding it by the Moderators in this Community nor in the Quicken Support Articles.
@Quicken Anja - Do you know anything about this R63.19 that you can fill us in on and why it has been communicated via an email instead of in Community and/or a Support Article?
Quicken Classic Premier (US) Subscription: R60.15 on Windows 11 Home
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To clarify my previous comment, the email I received from Quicken contained a link updating a thread titled "Update 11/27/23 Unable to open data file/file password not working in Quicken for Windows" Anja posted November 29th. The patch was described in her post.
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Hello All,
We would like to try some troubleshooting steps to see if this resolves the issue. Please follow the instructions below.
- Close Quicken
- Restart the system
- Don’t pause or do anything to One Drive
- Install the patch (https://assistant.quicken.com/patch/QW27.2.63.19MPatch.zip)you will need to unzip the file, go to the DISK1 folder, and run Setup.exe
- Open Quicken after the patch is installed. Quicken should open as expected.
- Close and re-open Quicken. Quicken should open as expected.
If Quicken doesn’t open as expected, please come back and report the file path (where it’s stored) and if there were any changes to the prior issue that was occurring (opens the first time, but not the second, vice versa, etc.)
Quicken Subscription HBRP - Windows 100 -
As I said before I want to make sure the patch applies to the Canadian version before I try it.
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Thanks for the clarification. I had searched for R63.19 in the New Release Announcements and in the Support Articles and did not find it mentioned there. I was also offline most of yesterday so I had not seen her update to that Alert thread until just now.
Whether or not R63.19 is applicable to QWin Canada as well as QWin US is something that perhaps @Quicken Anja can clarify. I doubt that any users posting in Community will be able to provide a definitive response regarding that.
Quicken Classic Premier (US) Subscription: R60.15 on Windows 11 Home
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@Boatnmaniac the "announcement" for R63.19 was a couple of comments in two Windows US threads on the OneDrive problem:
Here is one of them:
This is clearly an internal build straight from the developer's area. This would be a pre-staged version or a pre-pre-release version. 😉🤣
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Thanks. That post you referenced is the one I found and read this morning. I was out of pocket most of the day yesterday so I didn't catch this before this morning.
It's a fairly rare occurrence that they will post a pre-staged (or, I agree, in this case perhaps a pre-pre-release) version to address an issue. I wonder if it is specific to the One Drive issue or if it includes other stuff. Well, I don't use One Drive for anything so I don't have much incentive to try downloading/installing it to find out.
I do hope that whoever does download/install it is first making a backup of their data file.
Quicken Classic Premier (US) Subscription: R60.15 on Windows 11 Home
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I use OneDrive as my "backup" for my documents and pictures and such, but normally don't keep my data file in OneDrive for the very reason that I have known for a very long time that Quicken Inc and Intuit before them don't recommend it for this very reason.
But I did try it both with and without a password. For me, I never see the problem.
Here is the deal, I believe that the Quicken developers are "fishing". They have already released one version of Quicken that said it had a fix for the OneDrive problem in it. What was that result? It actually did fix the problem for a few people, but not others. And here they do the very unusually and post a "developer build" for testing. Why would they do that?
There is only one reason I can think of, they can't reliably reproduce the problem. So, they are making guesses at what might fix the problem. (and guessing wrong)
To me, I backup to this logic, I can't reproduce the problem on my machine, other people can on their machines, of those people some change that the developer's made helps, not for others. When presented by this I say "What is different?" To me it has to be "timing" different machines have different hardware and software combinations that dictate how long a given process will take doing any given task.
The longer a given process takes the bigger chance of hitting it if it is a timing issue.
On my machine I ran a program that tries to open the data file (and if it gets it open, closes it real quick, otherwise report the problem which is because Quicken has the data file locked). This was posted in that thread. The result? At startup Quicken does open/lock the data file for a short period of time (1/60 of a second on my machine), and then closes/releases the lock. And then bit later (1/4 second on my machine) opens/locks it again, this time holding it open/locked for "most of the time" with the exception of doing backups, validate, …
If OneDrive is fast enough, it can see that first open/close and start syncing before Quicken goes to open/lock it for the second time, it could certainly "get in Quicken's way" of trying to open the data file the second time.
After writing this I realized I never went back and tested the timing of R63.19, so I did that. The first short open/close is still there, but the timing to the second open/lock is MUCH different now, it is 1.68333 seconds on my machine.
It looks like to me someone said something like this "We can't get rid of the first open/close or hold it open for the whole time for "some reason XXXX", so let's try making the period of time between them be longer so that OneDrive has time to sync the file and release the lock. That is going to slow down the opening of all data files, and because this is a timing issue with different machines having different timings it will never really fix the problem!
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@Chris_QPW - You might be on to something. And it certainly does seem to reinforce the "always only use your local hard drive for saving and running your main data files" guidance.
Quicken Classic Premier (US) Subscription: R60.15 on Windows 11 Home
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FWIW, the errors associated with the "file will not open when OneDrive is active" condition are getting logged in the qw.log file. They are unique to error and do not post when OneDrive is paused. You can't miss them as they are the first ones posted for a session. I submitted the qw.log in Report a Problem and listed them in another post.
If you do get the data file open with OneDrive active, you will see that it also bangs away on the ofxlog.dat and _synlog.dat files but they are smaller and less prone to timing conflicts. _synclog.dat is constantly updating during OSU so it likely is a crash source. The guaranteed way to corrupt the data file is to have OneDrive active when a Quicken version update gets pushed on file open.
Until about a year ago, Quicken coexisted with OneDrive okay except when a version update was pushed on open without being caught by Windows. When prompted for an update, you could pause OneDrive and avoid the corruption crash.
If you observe OneDrive while it backs up the data file, it looks like it can see the underlying tables in the qdf container that were changed and only write to the changed tables, but it scans along the whole file during the process. For a simple open/close of Quicken, OneDrive shows only a few kb to be updated but it takes about 10 seconds to scan thru my 130 MB file and release Quicken. After an OSU, it takes about 20 seconds to write a few MB of new data. It's just not practical to build in pauses for every write.
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