Today's Update cause old reconciled transaction to be duplicated in several accounts

DaisyDoo

Had open yesterday and all was fine. Opened today and it installed a new update to Year 2020 / Version R28.16 / Build 27.1.28.16

I performed a one-step update and it performed as normal. I then looked and realized several accounts had changed the balance amount even before I had accepted any transaction.

Investigation revealed that assorted random transactions, anywhere from 2017 to 2020, had been duplicated. The original transaction had been cleared and reconciled long ago. It appears very random as to which transaction were duplicated and it could be anywhere from one to a dozen or more. There is no pattern. It could be a payment or a deposit transaction.

The transactions that were actually downloaded today did not duplicate and the duplicate transactions are not in the downloaded transaction list. The duplicates just appeared. They do not show as cleared or reconciled so are easy to find but having some registers that go back 10 to 20 years, it will take a little time.

Additionally, the registers themselves were sorted in a different manner than I have always had my sort set to. They were sorted in reverse order by date (newest at top, oldest at bottom). All my registers are always sorted by Date / Order Entered with the oldest at the top and newest at the bottom. Only the registers that contain the duplicated transaction are sorted wrong.

I can sort through and delete the duplicated transactions but if this is going to happen each time I open Quicken, it is a major issue.

NotACPA

Whoever you talked to at Support is, simply, wrong.  Head to this link and pick the appropriate patch level that you want to downgrade to.  BE SURE to get your product year/subscription correct ... then simply download and then install the patch.

QuickNPerlWiz is, under another ID, a SuperUser of this forum.

http://www.quicknperlwiz.com/quickenpatches.html

Don Bartenstein

NotACPA said:

Whoever you talked to at Support is, simply, wrong.  Head to this link and pick the appropriate patch level that you want to downgrade to.  BE SURE to get your product year/subscription correct ... then simply download and then install the patch.

QuickNPerlWiz is, under another ID, a SuperUser of this forum.

http://www.quicknperlwiz.com/quickenpatches.html

Much Thanks!  I was in panic mode for a minute!

Quicken Sarah

Hi All,

Our Teams have been investigating the duplicate transaction behavior and have created a solution that is part of the R28.18 hot fix, now available in staged release format.

If you would prefer to not wait for this release to go live to all Users, please download and install the Mondo Patch, available here.

Once installed, the duplicated transactions should not occur again, but please let us know how it goes.

Thank you,

Sarah

DaisyDoo

After further review, a few of the duplicated transaction were included in today's download but definitely not all.

Dave1234

Ran OSU today and was notified that an update was available (27.1.28.16), so I installed it, and ran OSU again.

OSU proceeded to create hundreds of duplicate *reconciled* transactions in multiple accounts - PayPal, Venmo, and a business checking account. Automatic transaction entry is OFF - so anything that is downloaded should appear in the 'Downloaded transactions' box at the bottom of the screen, but that's not at all what happens. Of particular note is that many of them are transfers to other accounts, but Quicken lists them as a transfer to '[Unspecified Account]'

Due to the sheer volume of downloaded transactions, and the inability to easily determine the difference between them and legit ones (i.e., by reconcile status) it would take hours to seek them out and delete them.

Restored from yesterday's backup. Validate, Super Validate - all fine. OSU still mangles things massively.

I contacted Quicken support and simply asked if there's a way to roll back to the version of software that I was using yesterday - which worked fine. Nope, they say that's not possible - gotta wait for the next update they say. That's bonkers.

Dave1234

I have the same issue. Literally hundreds of duplicate transactions in at least four accounts. https://community.quicken.com/discussion/7879387/after-latest-update-and-osu-hundreds-of-duplicate-reconciled-transactions-in-multiple-accounts/p1?new=1

DaisyDoo

Did they provide any information on when the next update with the fix would be available?

NotACPA

Whoever you talked to at Support is, simply, wrong.  Head to this link and pick the appropriate patch level that you want to downgrade to.  BE SURE to get your product year/subscription correct ... then simply download and then install the patch.

QuickNPerlWiz is, under another ID, a SuperUser of this forum.

http://www.quicknperlwiz.com/quickenpatches.html

Boatnmaniac

@DaisyDoo , @Dave1234 - Would you please provide a little more detail?

• Were the accounts you received these duplicate transactions into EWC or DC or both?
• Would you please open your PW Vault.  Do you see your EWC financial institutions listed there and if you do are you able to edit their PWs?  (No need to change the PWs, just need to understand if Quicken is giving you the ability to change them.)
  

Quicken Sarah

Hello @DaisyDoo & @Dave1234

Thank you for sharing the details of this issue with the community, although I apologize for any frustration or inconvenience experienced.

I attempted to duplicate this behavior with my personal data files in R28.16, but unfortunately could not.

I would like to look into this further, but I apologize, I have a few questions - 

For the accounts that you received duplicates in, which connection method are they using?  Direct Connect or the Express Web Connect method?  

What type of accounts are they? Standard banking (checking, savings, etc.) or more complex accounts like investments?

And lastly, are these accounts activated for syncing with the Mobile/Web Apps?

Please let us know, thank you.

Sarah

Sherlock

NotACPA said:

Whoever you talked to at Support is, simply, wrong.  Head to this link and pick the appropriate patch level that you want to downgrade to.  BE SURE to get your product year/subscription correct ... then simply download and then install the patch.

QuickNPerlWiz is, under another ID, a SuperUser of this forum.

http://www.quicknperlwiz.com/quickenpatches.html

I don't find it at all surprising that Quicken Support won't direct a user to an external collection of Quicken updates.  I do find it wrong that Quicken Support isn't maintaining the reference links to the current official release R27.42 on their update page while release R28.XX is still being staged: https://www.quicken.com/support/update-and-patch-20182019-release-quicken-windows-subscription-product

Dave1234

> @Boatnmaniac said:
> @DaisyDoo , @Dave1234 - Would you please provide a little more detail?* Were the accounts you received these duplicate transactions into EWC or DC or both?

It appears that this only occurs with EWC accounts. For me, it's PayPal, Venmo, and one of my banks where I have two checking accounts.

> * Would
> you please open your PW Vault.  Do you see your EWC financial
> institutions listed there and if you do are you able to edit their PWs?  (No need to change the PWs, just need to understand if Quicken is giving you the ability to change them.)

Yes, I can change my EWC passwords.

Dave1234

> @Quicken Sarah said:
> Hello @DaisyDoo & @Dave1234
>
> For the accounts that you received duplicates in, which connection method are they using?  Direct Connect or the Express Web Connect method?  

It appears that this is only happening with EWC accounts.

> What type of accounts are they? Standard banking (checking, savings, etc.) or more complex accounts like investments?

1. Paypal
2. Venmo
3. Two business checking accounts

> And lastly, are these accounts activated for syncing with the Mobile/Web Apps?

No.

Dave1234

> @NotACPA said:
> Whoever you talked to at Support is, simply, wrong.  Head to this link and pick the appropriate patch level that you want to downgrade to.  BE SURE to get your product year/subscription correct ... then simply download and then install the patch.QuickNPerlWiz is, under another ID, a SuperUser of this forum.
>
> http://www.quicknperlwiz.com/quickenpatches.html

THANK YOU

markus1957

I had duplicates going back 3 years from EWC checking type accounts and PayPal that I had temporarily set up to sync to the cloud.  My sync has been set to Off for several weeks.

I used the register sort option of Date Entered to push the old duplicates to the end of the register and then deleted them in bulk.

If you have a mix of missing transactions and duplicates, it will be more complicated because some of the newly entered transactions may be ones you actually want to keep.

Adding- even though the accounts are set to review transactions in the download tab before accepting them, the transactions were just added directly to the register.  I did get a red flag on the accounts and OSU summary indicated transactions were downloaded.  They just did no show up in the download tab register.

I cannot change my EWC passwords. I am using QCS channel for EWC.
It appears to have been a one-time occurrence.  Duplicates did Not reappear for subsequent OSUs performed after deleting the duplicates.

DaisyDoo

Finally got back into Quicken (why do I have to have three different passwords ?? One for this site, another QuickenID that occasionally pops up locally and the vault password)
Anyway, the accounts in question all appear to be using Express Web Connect.
PayPal, Citibank, and multiple accounts with two different banks (checking, did not appear to hit the savings but it has very few transactions in the register anyway).

When I open the password vault, these accounts indicate password not required and have what appears to be a gold colored key beside them. Highlighting that does not give the option to edit the password.

I do not use any mobile feature of Quicken.

Boatnmaniac

DaisyDoo said:

Finally got back into Quicken (why do I have to have three different passwords ?? One for this site, another QuickenID that occasionally pops up locally and the vault password)

You have 3 different PWs because that is what you originally entered for them.  If you want to change them, you can do that.

• Quicken.com (QuickenID):  Log into your account either through a browser or from within Quicken at Help > My Quicken Account.  (Note:  Changing your Quicken ID PW means that you will also need to change it in Quicken at Edit > Preferences > Quicken ID & Cloud Accounts > Sign in as a different user > Sign in again with your Quicken ID and new PW.)
• PW Vault:  Tools > Password Vault > Add or Edit Passwords > Change Vault Password.
• Community.Quicken.com:  Click on your Profile > click on the person icon with the downward pointing triangle to the right of your profile name ("Edit Profile") > click on on the left side of the screen.
  

DaisyDoo said:

Anyway, the accounts in question all appear to be using Express Web Connect.
PayPal, Citibank, and multiple accounts with two different banks (checking, did not appear to hit the savings but it has very few transactions in the register anyway).

When I open the password vault, these accounts indicate password not required and have what appears to be a gold colored key beside them. Highlighting that does not give the option to edit the password.

I do not use any mobile feature of Quicken.

Thank you for this information.  I'm sure it will be very helpful to the Quicken team.

Boatnmaniac

Summary of responses so far:

• All are EWC Spending accounts.
• 2 are set up for QCS channel...1 is set up for FDS channel.  (EWC passwords for QCS channel are not stored in PW Vault.  They are stored in PW Vault for FDS channel.)
  
• No one is syncing with Mobile/Web.

One of the things R28.16 fixes is a situation in which QCS channel EWS OSUs would sometimes not download some transactions and if they didn't download they would not download with follow-on OSUs.  It sounds like maybe the lookback to retrieve transactions not previously download was perhaps a bit too aggressive.  I suspect, like @markus1957 said, that this is likely a 1X event and should not happen again.  If it does, please be sure to post back here.

What throws me a bit was that @Dave1234 said he is able to change his EWC PWs which indicates he has FDS channel.  I did not think this transactions not downloading issue has been affecting FDS and that the fix did not address that.  Maybe there was something else in the R28.16 update file that triggered this for him.  @Quicken Sarah will be more than happy to correct me if that's the case. 

Don Bartenstein

NotACPA said:

Whoever you talked to at Support is, simply, wrong.  Head to this link and pick the appropriate patch level that you want to downgrade to.  BE SURE to get your product year/subscription correct ... then simply download and then install the patch.

QuickNPerlWiz is, under another ID, a SuperUser of this forum.

http://www.quicknperlwiz.com/quickenpatches.html

Much Thanks!  I was in panic mode for a minute!

markus1957

I had duplicates going back 3 years from EWC checking type accounts and PayPal that I had temporarily set up to sync to the cloud.  My sync has been set to Off for several weeks.

I used the register sort option of Date Entered to push the old duplicates to the end of the register and then deleted them in bulk.

If you have a mix of missing transactions and duplicates, it will be more complicated because some of the newly entered transactions may be ones you actually want to keep.

Adding- even though the accounts are set to review transactions in the download tab before accepting them, the transactions were just added directly to the register.  I did get a red flag on the accounts and OSU summary indicated transactions were downloaded.  They just did no show up in the download tab register.

I cannot change my EWC passwords. I am using QCS channel for EWC.

It appears to have been a one-time occurrence.  Duplicates did Not reappear for subsequent OSUs performed after deleting the duplicates.

DaisyDoo

Ok, so today I am going to go back in. I want to set aside the data file that has been jacked up and use the most recent backup I have available. There is a backup named Q_DATA-2020-08-13.AM11.56-R-27.42.QDF-backup.

Am I correct in thinking this backup was created before the new update was applied? I will be making a copy of this file to use so will retain the original in case needed again. I will also rename the existing active data file to have available as well. Will report back on results.

Don Bartenstein

markus1957 said:

I had duplicates going back 3 years from EWC checking type accounts and PayPal that I had temporarily set up to sync to the cloud.  My sync has been set to Off for several weeks.

I used the register sort option of Date Entered to push the old duplicates to the end of the register and then deleted them in bulk.

If you have a mix of missing transactions and duplicates, it will be more complicated because some of the newly entered transactions may be ones you actually want to keep.

Adding- even though the accounts are set to review transactions in the download tab before accepting them, the transactions were just added directly to the register.  I did get a red flag on the accounts and OSU summary indicated transactions were downloaded.  They just did no show up in the download tab register.

I cannot change my EWC passwords. I am using QCS channel for EWC.

It appears to have been a one-time occurrence.  Duplicates did Not reappear for subsequent OSUs performed after deleting the duplicates.

In my case it destroyed links between accounts on reconciled items.  It only added a couple dupe items, but I had a couple hundred items linked to [Unassigned Account]  (sp?).  I rolled back to a backup and reinstalled the previous version.  

Boatnmaniac

DaisyDoo said:

Ok, so today I am going to go back in. I want to set aside the data file that has been jacked up and use the most recent backup I have available. There is a backup named Q_DATA-2020-08-13.AM11.56-R-27.42.QDF-backup.

Am I correct in thinking this backup was created before the new update was applied? I will be making a copy of this file to use so will retain the original in case needed again. I will also rename the existing active data file to have available as well. Will report back on results.

My backup files do not include the revision of Quicken in the file name so I don't know if that is from before you updated from before R28.16 or not.  But the date and time signature (2020-08-13.AM11.56) is a good indicator of whether or not it is.  If you updated to R28.16 after 11:56 a.m. yesterday, then this backup file is from the old revision.  If you updated before this time yesterday, then it is from the new revision.

Renaming the file (either the backup or the original) is a really good way to keep them separate.  I usually do that every time before I update the Quicken revision and whenever I start doing significant troubleshooting on my data file.  I also have my preferences set to automatically backup my data file after every session and to retain the last 21 backup files (I usually have 2 Quicken sessions per day so this is only 10 days of backups).  There have been numerous occasions in the past where I was really happy that I've set it up this way.

I look forward to seeing your update report.

cbw65

I updated to R28.16 on 8/13/2020. After updating and performing a One Step Update, all of my linked accounts downloaded several additional transactions, with some matching previous entries and some "new" but upon closer inspection were also already manually entered (previous to this update I was having issues with transactions not downloading, for accounts on the new cloud syncing service). After a few minutes of editing/matching manually was able to clean these up - however I then discovered there were DOZENS of additional duplicate transactions that were automatically entered into my accounts - some enteries back in March/April of 2018, some in 2017, etc. These entries were not on the screen to review/accept. The problem is compounded in that many of the transactions are linked to other accounts in Quicken (such as loan payments) so it appears in the associated loan account that several extra payments were made. The worst problem was with Schools First Federal Credit Union accounts.

I have reported the error using the error reporting tool in Quicken as well. At this point this update introduces so many errors that it is unusable.

DaisyDoo

Update: Opened the file I indicated above and it as indeed a backup file that the update process must have created as when I opened it, all balances and registers were correct. I then performed a one-step update and the same duplication anomaly occurred.

While I didn't pay real close attention to the specific duplicated entries the first time around, I recall enough to believe that the same duplication occurred. This time I started sorting through the affected registers and removed the duplicate entries before I started accepting any downloaded transactions (I wasn't paying as close attention the first time and started accepting entries before I realized the scope of the problem.

I have been able to bring the registers for both banks and the citibank register to align with the actual balances for each account. PayPal is being a little more stubborn and I am having to go line by line against my PP activity log so this will take some time.

My intent will be to get everything corrected, close Quicken and create a backup copy of this current, corrected file then open quicken again and perform a OSU and see if the duplication happens again. More to follow....

markus1957

Use the register sort option of Date Entered (under gear icon top right of register) to push the old duplicates to the end of the register and then deleted them in bulk.

markus1957

Use the register sort option of Date Entered (under gear icon top right of register) to push the old duplicates to the end of the register and then delete them in bulk.

Others have also reported this behavior; Quicken "fixed" something and caused a worse problem for some.  It is a one-time event.  Once you clean up the spending account registers affected, it will not happen again.

Dave1234

Rolled back to a backup and to 28.10 thanks to the above link - and working as it did before. (Which is, mostly correctly)

Dave1234

Roll back to 28.10. Worked for me.

cbw65

Unfortunately I rolled back and I still have the same behavior of MANY duplicated transactions. Also tried using my backup data file (R27.42) and still have the same behavior. :/

DaisyDoo

> @markus1957 said:
> Use the register sort option of Date Entered (under gear icon top right of register) to push the old duplicates to the end of the register and then delete them in bulk.
>
> Others have also reported this behavior; Quicken "fixed" something and caused a worse problem for some.  It is a one-time event.  Once you clean up the spending account registers affected, it will not happen again.

Yea, I use the register sort feature but my PP issues go deeper than that and I think are unrelated to this current problem. Still, I want to get that register fixed before I take any more steps and do a full reconcile on all accounts before doing another update.

DaisyDoo

Ok, finally got my PP register fixed. There were actually a couple entries that WERE reconciled that had been duplicated. I cannot verify one way or the other if these entries were present before the Great Duplication Event or not. Took some time before I was able to track this down but safe to say, I am very familiar with my PP transactions over the last two years.

Made backup copy of fully corrected data file, closed Quicken then re-opened. Performed OSU and no anomalies to report. However there were no new downloaded transactions to accept either so after I complete another OSU in a couple days, I will report again.

Boatnmaniac

cbw65 said:

Unfortunately I rolled back and I still have the same behavior of MANY duplicated transactions. Also tried using my backup data file (R27.42) and still have the same behavior.

Did you accept and then delete all the downloaded duplicate files and then run OSU with that same file, again?  That will allow Quicken to "relearn" what has been downloaded so in the future those duplicate transactions will be filtered out and you should not see them, again.

But if what you are doing is running OSU on restored backup files then you are doing that on a file(s) that has not yet "relearned" so it is not surprising that you saw the same duplicate transactions behavior, again.