Bank of America....EWC+ Connection

denmarfl

But it is important to repeat; Quicken Bill Pay is only offered at no Charge until October 1023.  

Chris_QPW

Jim_Harman said:

CrunchTheNumbers said:

While you might find another FI that supports DC, I suspect it's just a matter of time until they pull the plug. In the end, I suspect everyone will be on EWC+.

I've enjoyed the convenience of being able to initiate Bill Payments from one place (my Quicken file), but it sounds like that's going away.

A long time ago, I wrote paper checks, so I'm sure I can get it done, somehow.

To be clear, you will still be able to initiate payments from inside Quicken. The change is that the payment instructions would go to Quicken Bill Manager (Quick Pay and Check Pay) rather than directly to your bank.

denmarfl said:

But it is important to repeat; Quicken Bill Pay is only offered at no Charge until October 1023.  

It is also important to understand that Quicken Bill Pay works completely different than Direct Connect bill pay through the financial institution.

With the Direct Connect method you are requesting your financial institution's bill paying system to do either the ACH transfer or sends a check.  A "push" system.

With Quicken Bill Pay it has a third party service that tries to log into each and everyone of your biller's websites to schedule the transfer.  A "pull" system.  Note that there isn't any standard on how all the biller's in the US would allow this operation to happen, so the third party system would have to have "scripts" that try to log in as if you were doing it.

And it is the third party service that will be sending the checks instead of your financial institution in the case of "Check Pay" which is used when it isn't possible to setup an automatic bill payment on the biller's website.

denmarfl

Kind of scary to me.....Citi Banks system to DirectDeposit their Credit card Cash back rewards when redeemed requires you to provide the ID and password of your bank in order to make that DirectDeposit....   I don't know how others feel, but no way I am giving out my ID & Password of my Bank....No Way.  It just gives access to my entire Banking Profile/Accts to that service.  In this day where security needs to be at its highest....giving out your ID and Passwords for me is completely off Limits and no service should ever use or ask for it.....

Quicken Kathryn

Hi all,

There have been a lot of questions about connectivity changes and Bill Pay in this thread and in our other Care channels.  

Please understand that these connectivity changes were not initiated by Quicken Inc., and that we do not benefit financially (nor are we harmed financially) by these changes.  Our continuing focus has been on providing reliable, secure connectivity and integrated Bill Pay capabilities to our users. 

For more information on these changes, please see the FAQ here.

denmarfl

Clicking on the Link provided by Kathryn...origionally I read Quicken Bill pay would be Provided FREE of Charge for 1 year for those losing the ability to pay Bill with Quicken at Chase and Bank of America...the Link now reads Quicken Bill Pay will be provided Free of Charge for 2 years.  This is certainly a very nice perk for Quicken to offer, but Quicken users using Chase and BofA would still be required to fo to the Banks Website to enter Transfers between their accts within those Banks.  My 1st reaction to the Q Bill pay offer got my interest as puting this change to EWC+ behind me as I could use Q to Pay Bills...than, the Transfer lost hit me.  

Might using Q Bill pay still be a solution even partial and short or Long term?  Maybe??? But.....

1) BofA Guaranteed Bills Paid on time if entered before the banks cut off dates (Elecronic 1 Day before Bill Due date) Mailed...(4 days before Due date). Majority of Bills are Electronic...(95% of my Bills) the NEXT day (if check Mailed 3 to 4 Days)...and if they failed they would contact the Company and report their error to them and pay any Late fees....Does Q Bill Pay offer this???  I can report in my 20 years of using Bill Pay... ONLY 1 Bill was late, it was the banks error and the bank handled it with the Payee.

2) Without signing up for Quicken Bill Pay can the List of Quicken Payees be reviewed to see if all the Bills I pay thru BofA are available?  Or, as it was, customers would need create their Payees??  Upon Creating my Payees, the Payee was available for Immediate payment and I could see if they were Electronic (1 Day) or Check (4 days)

denmarfl

oops....wish they was away to edit a Post just entered....there is not.  My Hangup with Q Bill pay is providing the system with my Online ID and Psswords for the Payees they will be paying.  That to me is not something I think I could get over...my ID's and passwords to a 3rd party Bill Pay company for all the Bills I want them to Pay....   Seems to me they would also require my Checking accts' that I would pay from ID and Password to debit the Bill Amount.    

Chris_QPW

denmarfl said:

oops....wish they was away to edit a Post just entered....there is not.  

You can edit your comments up to 1 day.  Click the ... in the upper right the comment.

DreamKiller

> @denmarfl said:
> But it is important to repeat; Quicken Bill Pay is only offered at no Charge until October 1023.  

Not strictly true. For Quicken Premier and above subscriptions, Quicken Bill pay is included with I think 12 quick pay and 5 check pay per month. Plenty for me and I get to start using something I had been paying for all along and not using! LOL

denmarfl

But are you not one bite uncomfortable that the Bill Payer service has your ID and Passwords for every Biller you are paying Plus, the ID and Password of your account where your Checking acct is....   As I understand Quicken Bill pay, the Bill paying service logs into the Payees website you are paying to pay the Bill, logs into the Bank where your checking\ payment acct is...to debit that acct.   

Chris_QPW

denmarfl said:

But are you not one bite uncomfortable that the Bill Payer service has your ID and Passwords for every Biller you are paying Plus, the ID and Password of your account where your Checking acct is....   As I understand Quicken Bill pay, the Bill paying service logs into the Payees website you are paying to pay the Bill, logs into the Bank where your checking\ payment acct is...to debit that acct.   

And on top of that, Quicken Inc won't even tell the users what company is the "third party", and you have no direct access to them or the information they store.  At least with the old Quicken Bill Pay you could contact them directly and they had a site for managing it.  And of course for "Bank Bill Pay" you were just accessing your financial institution's bill payment system and if things went wrong you could go to their stie/contact them.

DreamKiller

> @denmarfl said:
> But are you not one bite uncomfortable that the Bill Payer service has your ID and Passwords for every Biller you are paying Plus, the ID and Password of your account where your Checking acct is....   As I understand Quicken Bill pay, the Bill paying service logs into the Payees website you are paying to pay the Bill, logs into the Bank where your checking\ payment acct is...to debit that acct.   

I used to be, but all that info is out there somewhere anyway. Just one data breach away. Kind of the cost of doing business for the convenience IMHO. Probably a cavalier attitude, but I expect to get hit with a hack sooner or later and will just deal with it (knock n wood, hasn't happened yet in twenty years of doing things online). There is no way I am going back to writing checks and stuffing envelopes. The only option to be totally secure is to never use the Internet for anything, ever.

Having said that I may not even use QBP. All but two of my regular bills are auto charged to a BOA CC and we pay for everything else with a second BOA CC. I use two CC because the one we use for general stuff seems to get breached once every year or two and BOA sends us a new CC with a new number and I don't want to have to change all the auto bill pays. Both CC give us significant cash back and we pay both off every month so no finance charges. For the two BOA CC I can pay either by hand on my phone app or put them on auto pay on the BOA web site, so technically I could never actually have to pay anything, all auto charged and I just need to make sure the money is in the checking account every month. The third option would be to use QBP to pay the BOA CCs so I have a bit more control when they are paid.

The two outlier pesky bills are the local water and natural gas utilities. They charge extra % to use auto CC payment which I refuse to pay, or I can put in an eCheck auto pay so I would be giving them my bank info anyway. Which is worse, using QBP and their third party company (which presumably is in the business and has a more vested interest and resources to keep things secure) or some local mom and pop utility co which has uncle Bob as part time IT guy? I may or may not use QBP for these, haven't decided yet.

All just IMHO.

evsteve

In addition to all the concerns expressed here, after switching to Quicken Connect for both BofA and Chase my downloads are duplicating previously downloaded and reconciled transactions. I’ve gone through 2 cycles of download and remove dupes. Still happening (there are other threads around this issue)

howardmw

This feels like if Microsoft announced that we are going back to Windows ME!

WHIII

I am in the same boat. Am busily migrating Bof A to Eastern Bank. Direct connect will cost $10 a month unless you have a premier account in which case it is free.

denmarfl

I am waiting on a call back from Quicken to assist me in HOW to change From BofA to Truist Direct Connect....BILL Pay.  All my BofA Bill pays were created at BofA but in Q PAYEE LIST, you can click on BofA/Truist/Chase (I have checking with Bill Pay at Truist & Chase BUT have never created any Bill Pays at either bank).  Surely I can not just click on the Q PAYEE list and select Truist; select a Bill pay I created at BofA and Connect with truist and they pay that Bill.  In the Q Bill Payee List in Q..whether you click BofA/Truist or Chase all the Payees are the ones I creted at BofA...but some of the LEAD TIMES are different.  So Must I delete all BofA Bill Pays in Q, create New Bill pays at Truist...so the Payee Lists displays just Truist created Bill pays??????  This is what is Holding back from making the change from Bof to truist.  My fear is, that banks using DC today will eventually convert to EWC+....so making a change now will only be a short term remedy.....   

Like I wrote in anothe thread here, 2 years ago I caught a rumor about BofA Terminating DC, when I spoke with a BofA Tech Support person about another Q issue, I mentioned the rumor and the person quickly denied it had any truth.  I have always followed, Rumors for the mostpart always seem to come true.  BofA won't miss me, they really won't care I am leaving after 35yrs...and they say they care about customers.  Be nice to know how many Q DirectConnect customers bank with  BofA.....

Okayish

Here's one. I've too been with BofA at LEAST 35 yrs. I've been long-time with QB and later with DirectConnect and am amazed at how much this change will impact the way I use Q with BofA. I for one am waiting to see if/until/if I personally will have to switch to EWC+, or if longtime users will see a grandfather and get to keep DirectConnect. I just know I'm not going to use Q's Bill Pay service. I'm worried it might be outsourced to some other country, like Quicken support. I have enough difficulty with Q's support. So what good is QB's Bills/Online Center/Online Payee List/ going to be then?

denmarfl

You will NOT be Grandfathered in....I spoke with BofA Corp....BofA after 10/12/22 will no longer be using Q DC...its Over....that is a certainity.  They stopped DC about 6 years ago for new Customers but did Grandfather those enrolled in DC...this is the Next phase...terminating DC Connection.  I see this for those of us using BofA with Q, doing the teller work, doing the Back room Banking Processing...as a Slap in the Face.  I know there concern is security...uploads security higher risks...then just downloads (basically what EWC+ is)  Not sure if there is a difference between EWC and EWC+ might just be a fancier name.  I know those that were forced to move to EWC+ are reporting many issues...No Downloads, duplicate Downloads, etc....  This thread names other Banks that are still using DC....

Chris_QPW

denmarfl said:

You will NOT be Grandfathered in....I spoke with BofA Corp....BofA after 10/12/22 will no longer be using Q DC...its Over....that is a certainity.  They stopped DC about 6 years ago for new Customers but did Grandfather those enrolled in DC...this is the Next phase...terminating DC Connection.  I see this for those of us using BofA with Q, doing the teller work, doing the Back room Banking Processing...as a Slap in the Face.  I know there concern is security...uploads security higher risks...then just downloads (basically what EWC+ is)  Not sure if there is a difference between EWC and EWC+ might just be a fancier name.  I know those that were forced to move to EWC+ are reporting many issues...No Downloads, duplicate Downloads, etc....  This thread names other Banks that are still using DC....

Thank you for the clarification on not being grandfathered in.  It is what I suspected, but it is nice to see the confirmation one way or another (note I'm not a Bank of America users, but just getting the facts right to let other people on here know does matter to me).

The difference between Express Web Connect And Express Web Connect + is that with Express Web Connect there isn't any standardized protocol between Intuit and the financial institution and that your username and password would be stored on the Intuit server (encrypted).  Whereas Express Web Connect + uses the FDX protocol between the Intuit server and the financial institution and that protocol use the OAuth2 system which exchanges rotating tokens, and as such your username and password are not stored on the Intuit server.  That is the extra security they are talking about.

In contrast with Direct Connect you are either storing your username and password in the Quicken Password Vault or typing it in and it makes a secure connection to the financial institution's website to send it and log in.  No in between server has your username and password, but of course your machine could be compromised and then a hacker could get them.

It is ironic that Direct Connect/the OFX protocol allows for OAuth2 also which would make it even more secure but the financial institutions and Quicken never picked up that feature.

One has to understand this from the financial institution's view point.  Quicken isn't the only program/service that wants access to their customer data.  And since the financial institutions didn't standardize on a protocol like OFX/QFX/Direct Connect (4000 to start dropping down to 2000 now out of 35,000+ financial institutions) more and more this access has been done with "aggregators" like Intuit.  And they all have usernames and passwords, and not necessarily using the same protocols to access the data.  This is the financial institution's push to clean it up.

P.S. I'm pessimistic that this will really clean up the industry. Instead I think it will just fragment it more.  OFX was supposed to be the protocol that would bring ever financial institution together, but that never happened.  Short of the federal government requiring the standardization (something that is never going to happen in the US like it did in the EU) this never going to be adopted by all the financial institutions.

denmarfl

Not a good 1st Impression; today using the new and Improved CHASE EWC+...the greatest, Faster and whatever....everyone of my Transactions downloaded Twice....at the same connection.  Is this the Future?

When I called CHASE about this...they said the choice to go fr DC to EWC+ was not theirs...said it was Quickens????  Said Q changed OFX ??? and Chase was not willing to convert to the new Q Protocol so they had to go with EWC+ or Chase Customers would have had no Way to Bank with CHASe using Q...as Q also took away the Download EWC.   Is all of this true?  I explained other banks still used DC...and they commented that is because those other Banks updated their system to work with Q Direct Connect.....

Dr. L

The whole thing sucks. I'm either leaving quicken or leaving BOA

Chris_QPW

denmarfl said:

Not a good 1st Impression; today using the new and Improved CHASE EWC+...the greatest, Faster and whatever....everyone of my Transactions downloaded Twice....at the same connection.  Is this the Future?

When I called CHASE about this...they said the choice to go fr DC to EWC+ was not theirs...said it was Quickens????  Said Q changed OFX ??? and Chase was not willing to convert to the new Q Protocol so they had to go with EWC+ or Chase Customers would have had no Way to Bank with CHASe using Q...as Q also took away the Download EWC.   Is all of this true?  I explained other banks still used DC...and they commented that is because those other Banks updated their system to work with Q Direct Connect.....

Who ever you talked to either didn't know what they are talking about or lied.
Nothing for Direct Connect has been changed.  In fact, I'm still using Direct Connect with Chase.  It will be Chase that pulls the plug on their OFX server that will actually kill the connection.  Direct Connect/QFX is slightly different from the standard OFX protocol, adding a few new fields, but those field have been in there from the beginning.

Note also that the OFX protocol is backwards compatible.  There are some financial institutions still using 1.0 version of it even though the latest is 2.3.

It was definitely Chase that made the decision to change.  Here is a link to members supporting the new protocol that Express Web Connect + is based on (FDX):
https://financialdataexchange.org/FDX/FDX/The-Consortium/Members.aspx


The "Sustaining Members" are the main financial institutions pushing for this protocol.

Chris_QPW

Dr. L said:

The whole thing sucks. I'm either leaving quicken or leaving BOA

I'm personally leaving Quicken because Chase means more to me at this point of time, but I will point out something.  This change isn't just for Quicken.  The whole point of it is to get all of their "aggregators" to be using the same protocol.  So, any other program you might look for would have to be using this protocol too in the future.

Now another program might execute the conversion better.  But I do believe in time Quicken Inc/Intuit will get this all figured out, at least for most people.

I just personally have no reason to deal with the problems at this point in my life.  I don't really need a program like Quicken.  I can do all I want at my financial institution's websites.

denmarfl

For now I want to TRY...to continue to use Quicken.  I very much like doing all my Banking in my home, in one place, My PC & Quicken...then using the banks Website...  Quicken allows me to have my Records/History saved in my PC.  But will that happen...depends on how much work it will be on my part to chnage all I have been doing with BofA to Truist...and might Truist be working on a Change from DC to EWC+...who knows.  With Quicken I can create reports across all my banks, no matter what bank they are with ie credit cards into one report, can't do that if only Banking at 1 Banks Website.  

Anyone that is using EWC+...and experienced Duplicate Cleared downloaded Transactions at the same Connection....was it just one time?  It continues?  Known Fix?  

Dr. L

I don't know all the terminology or the features in Quicken by their appropriate name so I have to ask this question in a very basic, non technical way. In my Quicken register, I currently type "send" into the Check Number field. When I update through Quicken it connects to the bank and my payment is made or check is sent. Also cleared transactions are downloaded back to Quicken. Is this the functionality that I will lose?

denmarfl

YES....Once you convert to EWC+ you'll no longer have SEND....you will only be able to Download Cleared Transactions.  Chases' deadline 9/26, BofA Deadline 10/12...   It is clear from Post here in the Community that Chase EWC+ which is the 1st up to change...there are Issues...speaking with Q support their answer was....we just have to wait while Q and the Banks converting to EWC+ work out the issues.  Once again we as the users become the ginnie pigs...or Research and Development team.  Chase should have throughtly tested EWC+ before introducing it to customers and BofA should DELAY it deadline date until Chase gets this EWC+ free of current issues...but then why should the Banks care about the issues they cause us, their customers.  

Chris_QPW

@denmarfl for what it is worth, all parties involved have some part in some of these problems.
As in Quicken Inc (the Quicken program itself and the Quicken servers), Intuit, their "aggregator", and of course the financial institutions.  No one of them is without blame to some degree or the other.

Randalllind

The issue is Quicken sends a couple of emails out telling us of the change of connection and assumes we all know what they are talking about. Quicken should have said BOA is dropping Direct Connection for EWC+ and here is how to switch connections. Instead of saying BOA is changing connections and when they do Bill pay is over. I set up my account late 90's or whenever BOA started using Quicken and I save backup whenever I download new transactions. I didn't know how to change connections. I found someone's post saying to deactivate the current account then add a new account and merge it with the old one whiched worked.

Randalllind

I use Quicken just for a ledger anyway, Now that Bill pay which is dead your software is way over the price now. Since I have cerebral palsy and can't write that well I still use this. I knew when you started Bill manager it was only time before banks will opt out. I think you should make a cheaper version of Quicken for people that just download transactions. Why must I pay for deluxe if I don't do bill pay or manage or stuff?

Jim_Harman

@Randalllind,
Have you considered downgrading the the Starter edition? If all you want to do is download and categorize transactions for bank accounts and print checks, it is the cheapest alternative.

Starter does not support investing accounts or Tags.

Quicken Jared

Randalllind said:

The issue is Quicken sends a couple of emails out telling us of the change of connection and assumes we all know what they are talking about. Quicken should have said BOA is dropping Direct Connection for EWC+ and here is how to switch connections. Instead of saying BOA is changing connections and when they do Bill pay is over. I set up my account late 90's or whenever BOA started using Quicken and I save backup whenever I download new transactions. I didn't know how to change connections. I found someone's post saying to deactivate the current account then add a new account and merge it with the old one whiched worked.

Hello @Randalllind, 

I do apologize if there had been any confusion about the process of changing connection methods, specifically with respect to the Bank of America situation. Thanks for talking with us about this here in this Quicken Community Discussion.

The relevant information should be available in the link provided here. Please let me know if you have any other questions about this issue, and be sure to save a backup before attempting any further troubleshooting by navigating to File > Copy or Backup File... in the upper menu at the top of the screen.

I hope that is helpful, and I hope to hear more from you if you have additional questions. 

Thank you,

Quicken Jared