What happened to Schedule C? (Q Mac)

dcmaia

So one of the main reasons I use quicken is to make filling out tax docs a lot faster, but this time I don't see Schedule C in the list of reports I can pull. Maybe it moved? Not sure why it would. I've been using Quicken for years and this is the first time this happened.

Chris_QPW

Do you have the Business edition?

I'm a Windows user so I don't know if it works the same on Quicken Mac, but on Quicken Windows you have to have the Business edition to get the Schedule C report since it is for businesses. On the other hand, in Quicken Windows you can get around this down to the Deluxe edition because if you use a category with a Schedule C tax line, it will show up in the Tax Schedule report.

Jon

I'm pretty sure Schedule C & E reports on the Mac require a Business & Personal subscription, since they're primarily related to businesses & rental real estate.

dcmaia

https://community.quicken.com/discussion/comment/20416044#Comment_20416044

Damn. Are these new tiers new? I wonder if I used to have the Business edition or something. Doesn't show up in the Tax Schedule report either. Oh well, at least I label my categories as the same names as the Schedule C lines so I suppose I can just add those up for the tax year.

Jon

@dcmaia The Business & Personal tier has been around for a long time but until recently had nothing extra to offer Mac users. Starting in release 7.4 they've begun to roll out Business features that require that subscription level.

Chris_QPW

I'm not surprised that Quicken Mac's Tax Schedule doesn't show it. There are several things like this in Quicken Windows that just sort of slipped by the developers.

jacobs

Schedule C was previously available in Quicken Mac for the Deluxe and Premier subscriptions levels. I can't check to see if this is still correct because I'm on the Business & Personal subscription level as part of my beta testing. It would be bad if the developers, with no warning to users who have used it for years, suddenly made Schedule C require Business & Personal. The release notes for version 7.4, which introduced Business & Personal, say "If you need to file Schedule C, E, or F, this product is for you!" But the notes don't say, "Schedule C, previously available in Quicken Deluxe and Quicken Premier, now requires Business & Personal."

MODERATORS: Can you check with the Quicken Mac team to see if Schedule C was intentionally removed for Deluxe and Premier users? If so, can they update the Release Notes to state this, as I'm sure other users will encounter this as tax season progresses.

dcmaia

https://community.quicken.com/discussion/comment/20416069#Comment_20416069

That would make sense why I’m only missing it this year. But having features removed just to be put behind a higher tier is pretty scammy, so I’m holding out hope that this might just be a mistake or a bug

jacobs

@dcmaia Yes, wait just a little to see if a moderator can get a clear answer on this from the Mac development team.

I agree with you that if they took away a feature for Quicken Deluxe users which has been there for years… during tax season… and without any notice to users — that would be a pretty bad set of decisions by the brain trust.

jlgg

@jacobs I am running Quicken Deluxe for Mac, not Business , and I can confirm that Schedule C does appear in the Tax Schedule Report. There is no separate Schedule C report. I'm not sure if that was there before the latest update. For what it's worth you must have a transaction for the Schedule C section to appear. If you have to have a separate Schedule C report, it would be easy to create from the Tax Schedule Report by excluding all non-business categories.

Chris_QPW

If you have to have a separate Schedule C report, it would be easy to create from the Tax Schedule Report by excluding all non-business categories.

Personally, I think this statement puts it in the proper context. Yes, it is nice to have a pre-created report and/or section in a tax report, but it isn't like they removed the actual tax lines/categories, so you can pretty easily create your own report.

Their timing stinks, and not announcing it stinks, but in reality, if they really do need to separate out the different edition functionality levels, and a tax report for C is for business.

EDIT: Lots of people have used lower-level editions for "higher level needs", but that is always with the understanding that they might have to workaround some limitations of the edition they are using.

jacobs

@jlgg said: There is no separate Schedule C report. I'm not sure if that was there before the latest update.

There was.

@jlgg said: I can confirm that Schedule C does appear in the Tax Schedule Report.

@dcmaia said: Doesn't show up in the Tax Schedule report either.

Hmmm, well those both can't be true. 😂 I wonder if @jlgg identified the source of the discrepancy: "you must have a transaction for the Schedule C section to appear." @dcmaia do you have any transactions during the time period of the report which use categories which are assigned to Tax Schedule/Form=Schedule C?

There's a Schedule F tax report in Quicken Mac, but it doesn't show up on the list of tax reports until/unless you have a business which is defined as Business Type=Farming (Schedule F). But seemingly contradictorily , Schedule E for rental property income appears in the list of tax reports without requiring there to be a business defined as Type=Rental Property (Schedule E). Hmmm…

@Chris_QPW said: it is nice to have a pre-created report and/or section in a tax report, but it isn't like they removed the actual tax lines/categories, so you can pretty easily create your own report.

For some of the tax categories, this is true, but not all. Schedule D, for instance, has columns for Date Acquired, Date Sold, Proceeds, Cost Basis, Gain/Loss — that's not something you can create on your own.

jlgg

Actually, since Schedule D and it's columns which jacobs mentioned are present in the Tax Schedule report, it is easy to create a stand-alone Schedule D. In the Tax Schedule Report, click on "Edit", then "Categories" then "include only transactions with selected categories". The list that appears shows all the categories you have linked to the different tax schedules. Select the ones you want, in this case those linked to Schedule D, and you will have a separate stand-alone Schedule D report which can then be saved as a custom report. The same procedure works for Schedule C as well.

Personally, I prefer to work with the Tax Schedule Report when doing my taxes. It's easier for me to have just one open Quicken window with all the data I need.

jacobs

@jlgg In the current 7.5.x version, the Schedule D data is no longer included in the Tax Schedule report.

That's because the old Tax Schedule report as well as the Schedule D report subset, were based on the very old Quicken reports engine which was developed for the 2010-era Quicken Essentials for Mac, the predecessor to the modern Quicken Mac. Over time, the developers have created a more modern reports engine and rewritten most, but not yet all, of the reports. Schedule D is one they haven't re-written yet. Tax Schedule, however, was re-written using the modern reports engine in the 7.5 release, and as a result, it can't include the Schedule D data which is only available in the old Schedule D report.

When you open the Tax Schedule report now, you'll see a dialog box to alert you to the absence of the Schedule D data and the need to open tat report separately:

I would guess (hope) that creating a modern Schedule D report, and integrating it back into the overall Tax Schedule report, is something on the developers' future agenda. But it might be a low priority, since the existing Schedule D report works.

jlgg

I'm running 7.5.2 and I still see Schedule D in the Tax Schedule report. I also do not see the dialog box you are showing. My guess is this is in the beta but not yet in the public release.

My question would be, what will happen to the Tax Schedule reports that I have saved for prior tax years. Will the Schedule D sections of those saved reports just disappear with a future release? If so I will have to create separate Schedule D reports for each year adding to my already numerous reports, and making navigation that much more difficult.

Edit: Jacobs, I now see the dialog box. It appears if I open a new copy of the Tax Schedule Report. If I edit a previously created Tax Schedule report, it still shows Schedule D.

jacobs

I now see the dialog box. It appears if I open a new copy of the Tax Schedule Report. If I edit a previously created Tax Schedule report, it still shows Schedule D.

Well that's fascinating! 😂 Thanks for sharing that discovery.

jlgg

I had never tried to open a new copy of Tax Schedule after the 7.5 updates, so I didn't realize it had been converted to the new report format. All my previously saved Tax Reports are still in my file, and open in the old Tax Schedule format. Any comments I made earlier about creating stand alone Schedule C of Schedule D reports are correct if you are editing a previous Tax Schedule in the old format.

Personally, the Tax Schedule is the one old format report that I liked, and I greatly prefer it to the new format. Hopefully I will be able to preserve it in the future by editing older reports.

Chris_QPW

It has been quite a few years since I used the Deluxe edition, so I might have this wrong, but as I remember it in Quicken Windows Deluxe you had just the Tax Schedule and Tax Summary reports. There was always a push to state that Premier was the "investment" edition but seeing that Deluxe had the support for investments that never ran true, especially when you consider that the higher-level C, E, F Schedules leaked into the Tax Schedule report. Premier then "to the users/not Intuit" was "some extra investment and tax reports". Lately though they have been putting new features only in Premier to separate it off.

To me it seems that since Deluxe does have support for investments, it should have at least the D level on the Tax Schedule report. And certainly, should be there plus the Schedule D report on Premier.

jacobs

@Chris_QPW I don't disagree with your points, but this was a discussion of Quicken Mac, which has always treated the subscription levels differently than Quicken Windows. In Quicken Mac, Deluxe has always has the full range of investment activities and tax reports. There was only one report for foreign bank accounts added recently which only appears in Premier.

Chris_QPW

@jacobs People keep asking for parity with Windows, well that is a two-way street.

Quicken Jasmine

Hello All,

The Schedule C report is just a report based on the tax line items assigned to various categories. You can manually create business categories with Schedule C tax line item assignments, and a category report will show the totals for those categories, broken down by tax line. the other business reports included in Business & Personal are much more robust and more than just category summaries.

The Schedule C report is only available as a standalone report for Business & Personal. However, it is available in the combined Tax Schedule report for all subscriptions.

I hope this clears things up!

jacobs

@Quicken Jasmine Thanks for looking into this and getting a response from the development team. I'd like to note three issues which I request you pass back to the developers:

1. As I originally mentioned, the Release Notes for version 7.4 do not indicate that the Schedule C report, previously available to users of Quicken Classic Deluxe and Premier, is now available only to users of Business & Personal. When a feature is removed, it really should be mentioned. Many people who have small businesses with Schedule C income and/or expenses will not need the features in Business & Personal and will not upgrade to that version, particularly this year when it is new and has limited functionality. I believe the developers should add a mention of the removal of Schedule C in the Release Notes to avoid complaints and confusion.
2. It seems illogical that the developers have chosen to exclude the Schedule C report for Deluxe and Premier users, yet to continue to include the Schedule C information in the larger Tax Schedule report. If Schedule C reporting for a business is now deemed a feature only available in Business & Personal, the program should exclude that section of the Tax Schedule report for Deluxe and Premier users; or, alternatively, continue to make the Schedule C report available to those users.
3. You wrote: "The Schedule C report is just a report based on the tax line items assigned to various categories", so users can manually create their own Schedule C report of business income and expenses by creating a category report with just the business income and expense categories. that's correct. You also wrote: "a category report will show the totals for those categories, broken down by tax line". I don't believe that is correct; a category report subtotals by category, but has no knowledge of tax lines. A Schedule C report has a filter at the top to select whether the report rows are by category or by tax form/tax line, but a regular transaction report does not allow selecting rows by tax form/tax line.

Thanks!

Chris_QPW

It seems illogical that the developers have chosen to exclude the Schedule C report for Deluxe and Premier users, yet to continue to include the Schedule C information in the larger Tax Schedule report. If Schedule C reporting for a business is now deemed a feature only available in Business & Personal, the program should exclude that section of the Tax Schedule report for Deluxe and Premier users; or, alternatively, continue to make the Schedule C report available to those users.

It might seem illogical to do it this way, but that is exactly how it is done on the Windows side. (And you really probably shouldn't be arguing that they should be logical and remove it.)

jacobs

It might seem illogical to do it this way, but that is exactly how it is done on the Windows side.

Aren't you the one who is always reminding us on the Mac side not to necessarily wish for a flawed or out-of-date implementation like in Quicken Windows? 😂

All I would be wishing for is logical consistency. Currently, there is a stand-alone Schedule D report which is not included in the not-so-all-encompassing Tax Schedule report, and now we have a Schedule C report which is included in the overall Tax Schedule report for all users, but the stand-alone Schedule C report is removed for users who haven't paid for the top their Business & Personal subscription. Schedule E appears in the list of reports for all users, irrespective of whether you have Schedule E income, but Schedule F only appears if you have a business defined as a Schedule F (farming) business.

Chris_QPW

I find that when something is "illogical", but favors the user, they tend to overlook it. But in reality, I was mostly just joking.

I think that especially with the Schedule C that people could easily workaround not having any custom report. And that is sort the point of the different editions. There is very little you can't workaround as long as you have at least the Deluxe edition. The rest is really about making it easier for people to do a certain task. And Schedule C is business so I certainly see how Quicken Inc feels that it should only be in there.

Steve122@

I don't know if this has been answered here or elsewhere.

I have Quicken Premier for Mac 7.5.2.

When you select the Tax Schedule report, there is a check box that allows you to choose "Include business tax schedules". With this checked, you will get Schedule C and Schedule E in the report, if you have such transactions.

Also, as someone else pointed out earlier, if you have previously saved your own Tax Schedule Report (for example, a customized version from a previous year), you can use this to print out the Tax Schedule Report in the "old" format, which will include Schedules C, D, and E.

At least, this has been my experience.