Setting to switch off server-based renaming of Payees

System

Quicken automatically runs transactions through a server which renames downloaded Payee names to clean, simple, consistent names, like renaming "Home Depot #1234 Anytown" to "Home Depot". It's a good concept, and it works well in some cases. But some users struggle with the Quicken server ranking thing illogically or incorrectly, and want to be able to simply turn off server renaming. There is currently no way to do so in Quicken Mac. This is a request for a simple checkbox in Settings to turn off server renaming rules.

Note: In Settings > Connected Services, there is a checkbox for "Automatically improve the quality of downloaded payee names and categories". We had been told by Quicken that unchecking this box would disable server-based renaming and categorization of transactions. Perhaps it did so at one point, but multiple users have tried this and it does NOT disable renaming currently. So perhaps there's an easy fix to restore functionality which is broken? But it would really be better to have two separate checkboxes to toggle on/off automatic server payee renaming and automatic server categorization. This is the way it works in Quicken Windows:

Abq Michael J

Quicken's server-side automatic renaming rules have become fully counter productive and need to be re-worked from the get go. My hopes for it ever working well have vanished and I want to get it out of my workflow.

So how do I completely turn off server-side renaming of transaction payee names and categories!

Things I've tried: one community poster suggested, I have already turned off "Automatically improve the quality of download payee names and categories" under connected services. This change has no effect on server side renaming. Others suggest fixing renaming rules on my computer. I have also cleaned out 99% of the renaming rules on my computer. The renaming experiencing is coming from Quicken's server.

Why do I say this is messed up? Well the problem I experience is not about removing store numbers from places like Home Depot. The problem is in renaming transactions that could come from one company but actually come from another that share some similarity. For example, I have an Apple and an Amazon credit card. The renaming will change both purchases made at Apple and Amazon as well as credit card payment to Apple or Amazon into simple transactions with one or the other. When you think of how many companies transact with Apple or Amazon or have similar names to it, you can imagine all the transactions that can potentially get renamed with payee Apple or Amazon and category being whatever Amazon or Apple came before it.

Impact: This means that instead of being able to simply scan down my list of transactions from either, I must scrutinize each one, pulling up the "Inspector" window to determine what the transaction was really about and then fixing them appropriately. OR I can just use the auto rename and then come back at a later date and fix those that totally don't make sense. The prior creates a lot of work when I balance, and the later creates a lot of investigation work as I often forgotten how much I payed for this or that a couple weeks after the fact.

All this careful "what was this hell behind the renamed transaction" work is starting to dominate my use of Quicken. It is very much ruining my experience of the product and having me wonder why I have it.

Other: I tried posting this under "new ideas" but apparently the community board does not let me post new ideas for Mac products.

jacobs

[duplicated post]

jacobs

@Abq Michael J I've flagged this for a moderator to check why you were unable to create a new Idea topic. I just tried, and I was able to, but it's possible some setting on this site is messed up and only allowing moderators and SuperUsers to create new Idea topics.

As for the topic of your post, I just did a quick test in my own file with unchecking the "Automatically improve the quality of download payee names and categories" setting, and I agree that it is not disabling server Payee renaming. So I created this Idea post for just such a feature, and asked a moderator to move your comment into this thread. You're not the only one I've seen post about this.

It might also be helpful — and far faster — if anyone who has turned off the "automatically improve…" setting and still sees Payees renamed to file a problem report in Quicken (Help > Report a Problem). If we can get someone to look and determine this is a bug, it might get fixed quickly. The Idea approach for a new feature takes a long, long time to amass enough votes to be forwarded to the developers, and then for them to evaluate it and schedule it on their development roadmap.

Quicken Jasmine

Hello @Abq Michael J,

What exactly occurs when you attempt to post an idea in a Mac category? Do you by chance receive an error message/pop-up? These usually appear in the bottom left-hand corner.

Let me know!

Jim_Harman

On the original topic of this Idea, I have reported a similar issue on the QWin side with obvious mistakes in the automatic renaming.

I think Quicken uses the same server-based renaming for EWC+ (the Windows equivalent of Quicken Connect) connections. The tracking number of the issue I reported is CTP-11778

In QWin there is an option at Edit > Preferences > Downloaded transactions "Automatically apply Quicken's suggested name to payee" which definitely enables and disables the server-based renaming. See this discussion for more info.

https://community.quicken.com/discussion/7958328/issues-with-automatic-payee-renaming

Chris_QPW

It sounds like a bug not an idea that the server renaming rules can't be turned off, they certainly can in quicken Windows. I want to say that I'm a quicken windows user so I'm not exactly sure how Quicken Mac handles this, but for Quicken windows that option about cleaning up the payee name is the very last thing checked in the process of deciding the payee name should be changed. So, if one wants to override what the server is doing then you add renaming rules, not remove them unless of course the renaming rules are just plain wrong. And that would only be if the user still wanted the server to rename any payee that didn't get changed by the rename rules that the user has already set.

there is a whole another issue that the server doesn't pick good payee names when that feature is left on.

jacobs

It sounds like a bug not an idea that the server renaming rules can't be turned off,

I agree, and I have reported it as such. But unless someone at Quicken validates that submission and forwards it to the developers, and the developers look and see that something is broken, and prioritize fixing it, then an Idea thread is unfortunately the only way to raise the visibility of this issue.

One problem in Quicken Mac is that there is one preference setting which deals with both server categorization and renaming. It's been that way since the inception of modern Quicken Mac; I've always thought there should be two separate settings to users can enable/disable server auto-categorization and server auto-renaming individually. It would make this process more transparent to users.

While I agree that for most users, adding some local renaming rules to override server renaming is the best solution. But some users would prefer to just be able to turn off server renaming, and I think they should be able to.

Jim_Harman

for Quicken windows that option about cleaning up the payee name is the very last thing checked in the process of deciding the payee name should be changed. 

That's right, in QWin, the auto renaming is only done if the option is enabled AND no user renaming rule applies to the downloaded transaction.

So the way to work around incorrect auto renaming is to provide a better renaming rule of your own, because your rule will take precedence over the automatic rule. Then Quicken only attempts auto renaming if you enable it, for Payees that you have not already handled.

jacobs

Thanks, @Jim_Harman and @Chris_QPW for the Quicken Windows perspective. The issue here is that the preference in Quicken Mac which is supposed to disable auto-renaming and auto-categorization is not working to disable renaming. I'm not certain if the setting ever was a complete on-off switch or just ratcheted back the server renaming; the wording of the preference option is vague about what it does.

Chris_QPW

Quicken Mac ties both server renaming and categorization together in the same preference? That is definitely not a good idea, and it isn't how Quicken Windows works, so this might fall under "feature parity". This is what it looks like in Quicken Windows preferences.

Jim_Harman

In QWin I can see both the original Payee name and the result of the Server-based renaming in the Cloud Sync Log. The server's version of the Payee name is in the "inferredPayee" field.

I assume the same is true for QMac. Thus the setting does not have to disable the server renaming, it just tells Quicken whether or not to use the result of that renaming if no local renaming rule applies.

jacobs

@Jim_Harman Although there is no "inferredPayee" in Quicken Mac, we do have a transaction "Inspector" window which shows exactly what was downloaded from the Financial Institution Payee name, Memo, Amount, Date Posted, and FITID) at the bottom, and what Quicken has done with it at the top. In this example, the "From your Financial Institution" Statement Payee was "PECO Energy PAYMENTS" and Quicken's server renaming changed it to "PECO":

That's fine. Except that the preference setting which is supposed to disable server renaming was unchecked when I downloaded this transaction:

I note that with that preference unchecked it does seem to disable the Auto Categorization Engine, as expected. But it doesn't disable server renaming. That's the bug. And since developers sometimes have a funny way of saying something is actually "working as designed" even though it seems illogical to users, that's the reason for this Idea post: to get them to create a checkbox which actually does work to disable applying server renaming rules. Very straightforward and simple. (Of course, nothing is ever quite as simple as it may seem! A preference setting like this also needs to be applied to the Quicken Cloud server, so that if the Quicken server logs into a financial institution for an overnight download, it won't apply renaming if the user has turned off renaming on the desktop.)

Quicken Jasmine

Hello All,

This issue has been reported as a bug. I have removed the ideation from this thread.

Thanks!

(CBT-532)

Chris_QPW

just to clarify inferredPayee is in the “cloud sync” log file for Quicken Windows, not the register.

Jim_Harman

Thanks for the additional detail, @jacobs

My point was to clarify that for the desktop products, the setting does not have to enable or disable anything at the server. Since both the "Statement Payee" and the "Quicken name" are downloaded, the setting can just control which one Quicken should use if no local renaming rule applies. I have not experimented with any of this in connection with the apps or Quicken on the Web.

Apparently the setting in QMac does not work; it always uses the Quicken name.

jacobs

@Jim_Harman Yes, my use of the word "disable" may have been too broad. I don't think anyone would care if the server renaming rules ran, and even if the server-renamed Payee was downloaded to the user — as long as it isn't downloaded as the actual Payee name the Quicken application will use for the transaction.

@Quicken Jasmine Thanks for updating this thread and confirming that this has been submitted as a bug to the PD team. (I was fairly sure that this had been discussed in the past, but I couldn't locate a post which specifically described this as a documented bug.) In the CBT-532 submission in JIRA, does it include the suggestion to employ the Quicken Windows approach of having two checkbox settings, one for auto renaming and one for auto categorization? I know that's technically an "enhancement request", but as long as the Mac team is going to look at why the current setting isn't working, it would be great if they received the suggestion to make it more intuitive to users by using two checkboxes and language similar to Quicken Windows. Thanks!