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Bank of Montreal accounts and Quicken

TJTex

Has anyone struggled with trying to get connected to Bank of Montreal with Quicken? Back in April I set up Quicken and connected to Bank of Montreal for my accounts including my credit card, but the selection process for determining what service to select on the add account screen is very cryptic. Here is the screen:

I just went with the 'Best Result' being highlighted as BMO Bank of Montreal. It worked well and I set up all my accounts and downloaded all my transactions and it continued to work using the One Step Update.

Then on October 19 it stopped downloading transactions, that's another problem I am trying to figure out.

If you are connected to Bank of Montreal, what did you select? Are you now having issues with downloading your transactions?

Running Quicken Classic Deluxe R52.28

Windows 11 Pro

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Arctic Hare

I recommend you read this thread:

https://community.quicken.com/discussion/7940555/bmo-being-added-incorrectly-while-using-online-features

The thread linked above may or may not be related to your issue. When you say "on Nov 10 it stopped downloading transactions" what exactly do you mean, especially given that Nov 10 (of this year) is in the future (today's date is Nov 6). Did you mean Oct 10? If so, does it produce an error message or simply runs normally but nothing comes down? I will probably have some suggestions when you provide more specific information.

Quicken Jasmine

Hello @TJTex,

Are you receiving any error codes or messages? What is your connection method with Bank of Montreal? You can see the connection method by navigating to Tools > Account List.

Thanks!

Arctic Hare

https://community.quicken.com/discussion/comment/20395573#Comment_20395573

He indicated in his post that he is using One Step Update - hence, he is using Express Web Connect. OSU doesn't use Web Connect.

TJTex

https://community.quicken.com/discussion/comment/20395573#Comment_20395573

The reason I asked this question is that, while I had Quicken working just fine, it just stopped downloading transactions starting on October 19. I managed to get that working again on all but one account by using the 'Reset Account' in the account details window. I then had to contact support after spending days combing through Community searching for a resolution. The Tech managed to totally destroy my data file (good thing I made a backup before having it messed up). Some of the things he had me do was to deactivate accounts then add accounts and then do a web connect to add transactions. All of that managed to completely screw up my accounts.

So to answer your questions, the account connection is Express Web Connect.

When I was working with a Quicken Tech earlier today, it got to the point that I was getting a CC-503 error then a CC-501 error when trying to get my Credit card account reconnected after he deactivated it.

But the most curious thing was that at one point he had me connect up to BMO and had set up a new credit card account and it was called Mosaic MC and I don't have that. So I am confused as to how I should have originally set up the accounts.

Arctic Hare

@TJTex The two keys things you should do are:

Create a brand new Quicken file as a test file. Set up the Express Web Connect connections in the test file. Does that produce a different result than your main working file? I actually recommend making three test files. One with all the accounts mapped to Bank of Montreal. One with all the accounts mapped to BMO Mosaik. One with the credit cards mapped to Mosaik and the bank accounts mapped to Bank of Montreal. Run all the test files in parallel and see which works best.
Read the linked thread about Mosaik. You may think that doesn't apply to you, yet it might. The Mosaik brand was discontinued more than a decade ago, but some people still need to use that brand for downloading. I do. Once upon a time - more than ten years ago - I did have a BMO Mosaik Mastercard. Even though the brand was discontinued, I still need to use the Mosaik branding in Quicken. I believe it is possible that you may need to use the Mosaik brand for at least the credit card. Again, I would try setting up just the credit card in a brand new Quicken test file using the Mosaik brand and see how that works.

You can set up a few test files and switch back and forth between them to help you figure out what works for you. This BMO mess has been going on with Quicken for at least 10 years. I've raised the issue countless times and Quicken has never done anything to address it. At the very least, I don't understand why they can't provide some transparency as to why the Mosaik branding still exists and who needs to use that branding - even though they don't have a Mosaik product (this is a case where apparently you can have a product that doesn't exist).

TJTex

https://community.quicken.com/discussion/comment/20395570#Comment_20395570

Ok thanks for that. First off - November 10 is a big oooops on my part. It should have been October 19 so I went in and corrected that date in my original post.

Yes I did read that post "BMO - Being added incorrectly while using online features" before I posted here but it really didn't relate to my issue(s) as when I originally set up Quicken I used the correct BMO login creds and all 4 accounts (including my Credit Card) were displayed for me to add to quicken.

You asked "does it produce an error message or simply runs normally but nothing comes down?" No error produced when I run the OSU but no transactions downloading for the credit card. I am in the middle of writing a post for the no transactions downloading (I have read everything I can in Community but nothing seems to work to fix the issue) and will upload that once I have it written.

But the reason for me asking people how they got BMO working with Quicken was to make sure I originally set up my BMO accounts correctly.

Arctic Hare

@TJTex as a next step, create a test file called "Test BMO CC with Mosaik" by creating a brand new Quicken file (not a new account, but an entirely new file). Attempt to set up an Express Web Connection download for your credit card ONLY using the Mosaik brand. Let us know the result.

TJTex

https://community.quicken.com/discussion/comment/20395588#Comment_20395588

I tried that and it does not work because my credentials are rejected for the Mosaik option. The only way I can get setup with Quicken and my BMO accounts is by selecting the 'BMO Bank of Montreal' option for setting up accounts. I guess that's why I selected that option when I was setting up Quicken back in April.

Arctic Hare

https://community.quicken.com/discussion/comment/20395623#Comment_20395623

Well, that is a helpful result, now try setting up all your accounts in another test file using the non-mosaik brand.

TJTex

https://community.quicken.com/discussion/comment/20395625#Comment_20395625

Well that's exactly what I did to set up the accounts in the first place. Here is the screen for setting up BMO accounts:

The selection BMO Bank of Montreal sets up all my bank accounts plus my credit card in Quicken. My creds don't work for the other options. I asked this question just to make sure I had the correct selection and obviously I did because that is the only option that works with my creds.

Arctic Hare

Yes - understood… the point is to test whether you have any problems downloading transactions in the test file. In your original post you stated that transactions stopped downloading.

Although there are a bunch of BMO's listed, behind the scenes there are really only two access points - you can see this from the entries in the FIDIR.TXT file that governs all of this. Thus, we've already proved you are using the correct BMO choice for your case. The question is now why you are having an issue downloading transactions. That is what we were using the test file to tackle… but you haven't indicated whether the transactions download into the test file without error.

TJTex

https://community.quicken.com/discussion/comment/20396069#Comment_20396069

Yes the accounts download in the test file when I create a new Test file. BUT when I am done tinkering around and want to go back to my actual data file the downloads no longer work when I use OSU. Note that I have financial institutions other than BMO that link to Quicken, and they had stopped downloading as well.

In order to get OSU working again I needed to do one of the following actions:

Either:

Go to Tools - Online Center - select the financial Institution from the dropdown (in this case Bank of Montreal) and click the Update Accounts
For each of my other online financial institutions, select that financial institution from the dropdown and click the Update Accounts.

OR:

For each of my accounts click the Edit Account then select the Online Services Tab and click the "Reset Account" button.

Both of these methods gets the downloads working again.

Arctic Hare

https://community.quicken.com/discussion/comment/20401274#Comment_20401274

That's odd behaviour. It sounds like you might need to clear all the information in the cloud. The only time you should expect to run into an issue with downloads from one data file affecting downloads in another data file is when one those data files is a restored instance of the other, in which case Quicken seems them as the same file and gets them confused. Otherwise, Quicken should recognize them as separate instances. I don't use the cloud features so I'm probably not the best person to guide you through the cloud purge, but I think you should be resetting your cloud data. Note that Quicken puts data up in the cloud even if you don't use Mobile (which I don't).

TJTex

https://community.quicken.com/discussion/comment/20401288#Comment_20401288

It is very strange indeed. I turned off the Quicken cloud Sync when I installed Quicken on my computer. So I don't know what is going on with this behaviour.

I do know that it does not happen on my US version of Quicken because I spent a lot of time building tinkering files.

Arctic Hare

https://community.quicken.com/discussion/comment/20401367#Comment_20401367

If you use EWC, Quicken puts you data up in the cloud even if mobile/sync is turned off. At least that is my understanding. Someone please correct me if I'm wrong. Note the statement: "Your accounts will not be accessible on the Quicken Mobile and Web apps". It does not say "Quicken will not store your data in the cloud". You can turn off Mobile and Web, but you can't stop Quicken from syncing your data to the cloud if you use EWC. I'm not sure if you can avoid the cloud storage if you only use Web Connect and no OSU function.

Chris_QPW

OK, I just read through all of this, basically didn't read before/stayed out of it because @Arctic Hare is the expert for anything Canadian.

But now that it is a general question about how Express Web Connect works, I will try to jump in and see if I can help.

@Arctic Hare is correct, when using Express Web Connect transactions are stored in the Quicken Cloud dataset (as well as some of them being stored on the Intuit server). And they do use "Sync" to get them into Quicken.

https://community.quicken.com/discussion/7882641/qcs-express-web-connect-is-cloud-sync

Now how to fix that problem data file.

There are a couple of things you might try that I'm not sure will do anything but are "less disruptive" than the last thing I'm going to suggest.

The first thing I suggest is that you turn on Sync to Mobile and Web and make sure that it isn't on for any of your accounts:

I have (and others) have noticed that at times Quicken has turned on this for some accounts when first creating connections to accounts:

Ensure that is 0 (you and click on it to change it) and then turn Sync off and then select Reset your cloud data, and then turn it off.

Test if this fixes the problem.

If that doesn't fix it, the next is basically to get a completely new Quicken Cloud dataset.

Every data file has a unique Id that connects it to a given Quicken Cloud dataset.

The only ways to get a new unique Id is by using Quicken's File → New Quicken File… or by using File → Copy or Backup → Create a copy or template.

When using the copy function Quicken will create a copy with a new unique Id, and but it will also disconnect any online services. It is done this way to ensure that there aren't any lingering connections to the old data file/online services.

You will have to setup your accounts again, but this should give you a fresh start equal to that new data file that you were testing in.

Arctic Hare

https://community.quicken.com/discussion/comment/20401569#Comment_20401569

The last thing you suggested @Chris_QPW - creating a copy of the data file using the copy method built into Quicken - has been proven to cure other ailments. That is certainly worth a shot in this scenario. Thanks for the confirmation on the cloud dataset and EWC synch.