R52.33 - Unable to open data file on first try - then opens after pointing to file (edit75)
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If you are going to make a copied data file, please initiate a process once to see if the same issue with OneDrive occurs, then you may send the copied data file logs. If the same issue does not occur, then please send the logs/sanitized file using your original file.
Also, we would like users to try a few troubleshooting steps to see if the issue continues to occur. Does your file work as expected after pausing one drive, opening the file, closing the file, unpausing one drive, and then opening the file again but this time without pausing one drive?
Please let us know!
-Quicken Jasmine
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Hello All,
We would also like to know if you are experiencing this issue with your Quicken ID password, data file password, or both.
Please let us know.
Thanks!
-Quicken Jasmine
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I don't have a datafile password, but am asked for it in one circumstance: when the file has to be opened through the File:Open command (the problem we're talking about). The file opens normally. but when I initiate a OSU, I'm asked for the datafile password and then password vault password. On the rare occasions when the file opens normally, I'm not asked for the datafile password.
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The release notes for R53.16 (November 2023) (Windows) indicate that this is a fixed bug.
However, I am still experiencing this problem.
I note that my data file is flagged to "Always keep on device', so OneDrive does not have to do any synchronizing until after the file is opened.
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Jasmine, the problem is with the datafile password, not the Quicken password. That is true for me and appears most of the others. Pausing Onedrive for 2 hours (the least amount allowed), and then opening the file fixes the issue.
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This is identical to my experience as well. Not sure it is an issue with the password however, as it is correctly entered, etc. Pausing OneDrive works like a charm to prevent the issue from occurring. When the issue does occur (when OneDrive is running), there is an error message, then need to go to "file" and "open", at which point it prompts, for the data file pw again and finally opens. After that, it prompts for the Quicken password if you try to do an auto update, etc.
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Having the same problem — also happened after an update. 1st Quicken re-opened after having backed up with an old (July 2023) data file. Then I couldn't re-open the file. After several attempts, I was able to open the file.
However, again today, I received the error message — unable to open file. I exited & restarted Quicken & was able to open the file.
Again this happened after the most recent update.
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Updated to 53.16 today and when I restarted after the update, no problem. Closed, let OneDrive save the file to the cloud. I retried again and it failed (the password to Quicken file was not correct, even though it was). Paused OneDrive. Restarted, no problem.
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@David J. Carlson Simply move your data file(s) from a Onedrive path to a non-Onedrive path and you won't have to pause/stop/exit Onedrive or jump through hoops to run your data file(s). The usual recommended convention is to store your data file(s) in C:\Users\%username%\Documents\Quicken.
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Understand, but I would prefer to have it on OneDrive and am able to put up with pausing OneDrive until Quicken or OneDrive fix the issue. It has worked for me since OneDrive came alive until recently. It is a very strange error in that Quicken finds the file but can't match the password (or, more likely, can't read the password and gives an incorrect error message).
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How about this, you go to eat your meal, you start cutting the meat and then someone pulls the plate away from you.
What is going to happen next?
OneDrive is pulling Quicken meal (the data file) way from it when it doesn't expect anyone to be touching its plate.
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I have mine moved off Onedrive for now but have the backup folder on Onedrive. When I exit Quicken it automatically backs itself up. I quit using a password to open Quicken a while back. My desktop has a login already. For a long time even before it quit opening right in Onedrive it was slow to open. Now with it out of Onedrive it opens faster. I'm leaving mine set up this way for now.
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Same issue here…have to manually open the quicken file as the program is looking for it on my "one drive" when it is resident on my computer.
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Select the File menu in Quicken and look at the recently used list at the bottom. I think you will find that your data file is in a OneDrive folder. A OneDrive folder isn't "off your machine". It is a folder that OneDrive syncs to the server. And now it is doing that when it shouldn't be as it is doing it when Quicken is trying to access it.
This is an example of a folder (Documents) that is in OneDrive:
C:\Users\Chris\OneDrive\Documents
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Has something changed in Quicken regarding cloud storage? I have successfully been using Quicken on two computers connected to a data file on Microsoft OneDrive for years. Suddenly, neither computer will open a data file in a OneDrive directory anymore. I can take a file that it won’t open, copy it to my hard drive, and it opens as per usual. I can copy a working data file from my hard drive to a Onedrive directory, and again it won’t open. Exacerbating my frustration are the lame error messages that pop up, with kindergarten solutions (reboot, disable antivirus, etc.) but never the REASON why an error occurred. Is there any “under-the-hood” help available here? I just want to get back to where I was, accessing a singular data file from two different computers.
[Merged Post]
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No, OneDrive is no longer compatible with Quicken. There was an update to OneDrive that has caused a problem with Quicken. Try pausing OneDrive before starting Quicken.
[Merged Post]
Quicken Subscription HBRP - Windows 102 -
I have my Quicken data file on OneDrive and have no issues. I am on Windows 10 on both computers with no issues.
[Merged Post]
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For what it is worth, when I tested this, I didn't have any problems either, but one has to understand that this is a timing kind of problem. So, yes it might work on some machine, but not on others.
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Sure enough, you can load a data file from OneDrive by pausing synchronization. Was there any announcement/bulletin of this by Quicken? It really burns me up to be troubleshooting a problem for days and then finding out that there was never any hope of fixing it on my own.
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See this Announcement for Quicken's update on this issue. Scroll up to see earlier updates.
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Thanks. They can update it to include Quicken R53.16 and OneDrive 23.226.1031.003 — which is a later version than the one Microsoft says is going to be rolled out in January of 2024.
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There were updates to both quicken and onedrive around the time the issue started, I haven't seen any smoking gun evidence of which it is. But regardless from my testing the issue looks like quicken does not maintain its lock on the file consistently, it seems to release the file while at the password prompt or between launching quicken and actually opening the file. If they can just make it maintain the lock the entire time quicken is open (and while copying or repairing files which is also a historical issue with onedrive) it should resolve it. For now running a batch file that stops onedrive before loading quicken and restarts it on exit is working great.
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I took a really close look at this, and I don't think Quicken changed anything, but that isn't to say Quicken is doing all the right things. I mentioned lots of times that Quicken doesn't hold lock on the data file continuously. This isn't surprising when you know two facts. One is I'm almost 100% sure that Quicken never locks the data file, instead it opens the data file and Windows locks it as part of that process. This also means that as soon as they close the data file the lock is removed. And the second fact is that Quicken opens and closes and then reopens the data file in several places like Validate and backup, but in a few other known places. Quicken was just never designed to work in this "syncing" kind of environment. And I will say it is a really hard nut to crack when you have to absolutely make sure another process like OneDrive will not sync it when it might be in an inconsistent state, when there isn't any kind of signaling between the two when it is OK to do it except the file lock. Note that "locking the file for all the time Quicken needs it" isn't really possible. When you lock a file that would block even Quicken from opening it. As a side note this is another reason network drives aren't supported, network file locks can be inconsistent depending on many factors.
Testing if a process has a file locked is really hard when you have to go down to very small amounts of time because Windows doesn't have a call that says "is file locked". The only real way to test is to try to open it. If it fails then you know, but the problem is that now this program has the file locked because of its open. Of course, it would close it really fast right after that, but as you get down into short times the program is opening it almost constantly and that will block Quicken from opening it.
Anyways as best I can tell, Quicken is opening the file for a very short period of time, closing it and then reopening it between entering the password and really getting it open. Maybe to test something about the file. Maybe one guess would be to see if the password matches… But I see this both R52.16 and R52.33. Which to me sort of implies that OneDrive has been change in a way that it will detect this very short close and start the sync. Note on my machine I have never been able to reproduce the problem. The timing is just not right to reproduce it.
Here is a run of the program on R33.16 (the first number is the current time, just the seconds (fractions of a second not shown, there is more to the output, just say that each try is about 1/60 of a second):
11 Opened data file.
11 Opened data file.
11 Opened data file.
11 Opened data file.
11 Opened data file.
11 Opened data file.
11 Opened data file.
11 The process cannot access the file 'C:\Users\Chris\OneDrive\Documents\Quicken\TestEWC+.QDF' because it is being used by another process.
11 Opened data file.
11 Opened data file.
11 Opened data file.
11 Opened data file.
11 Opened data file.
11 Opened data file.
11 Opened data file.
11 Opened data file.
11 Opened data file.
11 Opened data file.
11 Opened data file.
11 Opened data file.
11 Opened data file.
11 Opened data file.
11 Opened data file.
11 Opened data file.
11 The process cannot access the file 'C:\Users\Chris\OneDrive\Documents\Quicken\TestEWC+.QDF' because it is being used by another process.
11 The process cannot access the file 'C:\Users\Chris\OneDrive\Documents\Quicken\TestEWC+.QDF' because it is being used by another process.
11 The process cannot access the file 'C:\Users\Chris\OneDrive\Documents\Quicken\TestEWC+.QDF' because it is being used by another process.
12 The process cannot access the file 'C:\Users\Chris\OneDrive\Documents\Quicken\TestEWC+.QDF' because it is being used by another process.Here is a run on R52.33:
40 Opened data file.
40 Opened data file.
40 Opened data file.
40 Opened data file.
40 Opened data file.
40 Opened data file.
40 Opened data file.
40 The process cannot access the file 'C:\Users\Chris\OneDrive\Documents\Quicken\CurrentCpy.QDF' because it is being used by another process.
41 The process cannot access the file 'C:\Users\Chris\OneDrive\Documents\Quicken\CurrentCpy.QDF' because it is being used by another process.
41 Opened data file.
41 Opened data file.
41 Opened data file.
41 Opened data file.
41 Opened data file.
41 Opened data file.
41 Opened data file.
41 Opened data file.
41 Opened data file.
41 Opened data file.
41 Opened data file.
41 Opened data file.
41 Opened data file.
41 Opened data file.
41 The process cannot access the file 'C:\Users\Chris\OneDrive\Documents\Quicken\CurrentCpy.QDF' because it is being used by another process.
41 The process cannot access the file 'C:\Users\Chris\OneDrive\Documents\Quicken\CurrentCpy.QDF' because it is being used by another process.
41 The process cannot access the file 'C:\Users\Chris\OneDrive\Documents\Quicken\CurrentCpy.QDF' because it is being used by another process.I have sort of "nixed" the idea that the short open is for checking the password here is a run without the password set (R52.33):
34 Opened data file.
34 Opened data file.
34 Opened data file.
34 Opened data file.
34 The process cannot access the file 'C:\Users\Chris\OneDrive\Documents\Quicken\CurrentCpy.QDF' because it is being used by another process.
34 Opened data file.
34 Opened data file.
34 Opened data file.
34 Opened data file.
34 Opened data file.
34 Opened data file.
34 Opened data file.
34 Opened data file.
34 Opened data file.
34 Opened data file.
34 Opened data file.
34 Opened data file.
34 Opened data file.
34 Opened data file.
34 Opened data file.
34 Opened data file.
34 Opened data file.
35 Opened data file.
35 Opened data file.
35 The process cannot access the file 'C:\Users\Chris\OneDrive\Documents\Quicken\CurrentCpy.QDF' because it is being used by another process.
35 The process cannot access the file 'C:\Users\Chris\OneDrive\Documents\Quicken\CurrentCpy.QDF' because it is being used by another process.
35 The process cannot access the file 'C:\Users\Chris\OneDrive\Documents\Quicken\CurrentCpy.QDF' because it is being used by another process.
35 The process cannot access the file 'C:\Users\Chris\OneDrive\Documents\Quicken\CurrentCpy.QDF' because it is being used by another process.Signature:
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Yeah lock wasn't really the right word, but both windows and onedrive know when a file is open, and thus will see it as "locked" in a way, and won't attempt to back up or synch it. Open file backup requires special plugins and programming. As you say, it is the fact that quicken seems to open and close the file when you wouldn't expect it to that is causing the confusion apparently. If it just opened it and kept it open, it would be "locked" as far as onedrive is concerned.
Network shares actually aren't a problem as long as nothing else is accessing the file. I briefly ran off a network drive for a while and never saw any issues.
There are plenty of programs out there that weren't designed with onedrive or other synch/cloud stuff in mind and they work fine with it, as they open whatever files they need to, then close them when done.
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Network shares actually aren't a problem as long as nothing else is accessing the file. I briefly ran off a network drive for a while and never saw any issues.
The biggest two problem with network shares is, #1 you don't know that the connection is stable, and #2 you don't even know what kind of network you are dealing with. There is a world of difference between a network that is on ethernet and setup correctly and one on WiFi that isn't setup right or has a weak signal. And people don't realize that "network share/drive" doesn't actually describe one thing. The server hosting the share can be a Windows machine with one kind of share, it can be a Mac with another kind, or Linux or some "appliance/NAS running usually Linux".
And I can tell you from starting with Unix that some of the network shares aren't the robust.
If Quicken had some low-level error correcting, then it might be different but Quicken was designed with the assumption that drives never fail.
And besides error/data corruption there can be performance problems that they will blame on Quicken. This is in fact one of the things people don't get about supporting Quicken. When something goes wrong people expect Quicken support to troubleshoot the whole system. One can't just be a Quicken Expert (which they won't be at the first level of support) they need to also be an expert in Windows/Mac operating system troubleshooting, including networking. Quicken Inc will definitely try to avoid taking on such extra support if they can.
Just because it worked in your situation doesn't mean that Quicken Inc wants to take on this kind of risk for all the possible users out there.
Yeah lock wasn't really the right word
Yes, it was, because currently that is the only way Quicken can signal to the world not to touch its data file.
but both windows and onedrive know when a file is open, and thus will see it as "locked" in a way
No, that isn't the case, a file can be open and not locked, so an open file isn't an indication to OneDrive not to sync it, and in fact in these cases it will sync it while it is open. If you are wonder, why any program would open a file and not lock it, I can think of two reasons, one is that the program is designed so that multiple processes can modify that file. Another reason is because they don't care. As in at any given time they know that the file will be in a stable state.
There are plenty of programs out there that weren't designed with onedrive or other synch/cloud stuff in mind and they work fine with it, as they open whatever files they need to, then close them when done.
Yes, this definitely points to a "problem with Quicken", but like what I described above for network shares/drives you have to realize what environment Quicken was developed in, and that it has changed over time. What was OK for Quicken to do in the past is now "wrong". So, one would say "change Quicken", but one has to understand that it might not be that easy. People see the word "soft" in software and think that everything is possible to change easily. It isn't. There is a basic framework and design that if the assumptions change means MAJOR reworks. If you design a foundation for a single-family home and later, they want to bult to 40 story building on it you are going to have problems. It is easy to say you should open the data file and never close it (releasing the lock) until you are finished with it, and actually doing it when they want to do things like Validate, backup, …
I have no idea why they open the file for that brief period of time at the start and then close it. If lucky it might be something that they can do differently without much effort. On the other hand, they already took a whack at this and it "fixed it" for some people and not others. Not surprising since there is clearly a timing to this. As I have stated I have never been able to reproduce this problem on my machine.
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I, like everyone else was having issues opening my quicken file (on MS Cloud) the second time getting the error message. Recently I upgraded computers and downloaded the quicken program, during installation I used a backup copy on my USB drive to be installed and quicken put it on the hard drive document folder (not the MS Cloud it was previously on). Problem solved and opens considerably faster of course!
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I too, am having issues opening my file upon login. It seems to keep pointing to an old file. I have to go to the "find Quicken Files" at the login, and point it to the latest file listed. It then opens and I can begin to use. How do I correct it so that it will point to the latest file to open all the time as it usually has done?
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